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Game #11: Pistons vs Warriors - 11/15/10


Deleterious
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This team is a mess. Unfortunately, it's going to take years to come back from the hole Joe D has dug them into and the frankenstein's monster he has created.

Nearly every team in the league is more athletic than ours, so we can't get up and down on them because they do it better.

Nearly every team in the league is stronger in the paint than ours, so we struggle in the half court against them.

We aren't a good defensive team, yet we also aren't the type of the team that can outscore you every night.

This team has no identity and its core (if it has one) doesn't fit well into any system that I can imagine winning. Point guards who have no vision in the half court but also aren't great finishers, big men who who lack the strength to post up but are also not athletic enough to finish above the rim, guards who can't shoot the three but also don't play defense particularly well, SFs who aren't lock down defenders but also aren't athletic enough to create their own shots, and so on.

The problem is that there are way more problems than there are solutions. Sure you can trade Prince and maybe Stuckey, but what will you get back? And look, you're still left with guys that have long contracts like CV and Rip, as well as even the new guys like Daye and Monroe who don't really fit any team identity either. This team is a mess of bad contracts and bad draft picks that do not gel into any sort of strategy at all.

Heck, the only way I can see to fix a team like that is to do something like what the Celtics did. Trade half your team away for a superstar that will single-handedly change/create the identity of your team. Good luck with that...

OK, sorry for the rant...back to this game. I watch every game and there are times when the team is down big and at the end of the night you feel like you've wasted your time. This game was not one of those times. While they didn't win in the end, the second half was pretty exciting and I'm glad I stuck through it.

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This team is a mess. Unfortunately, it's going to take years to come back from the hole Joe D has dug them into and the frankenstein's monster he has created.

Nearly every team in the league is more athletic than ours, so we can't get up and down on them because they do it better.

Nearly every team in the league is stronger in the paint than ours, so we struggle in the half court against them.

We aren't a good defensive team, yet we also aren't the type of the team that can outscore you every night.

This team has no identity and its core (if it has one) doesn't fit well into any system that I can imagine winning. Point guards who have no vision in the half court but also aren't great finishers, big men who who lack the strength to post up but are also not athletic enough to finish above the rim, guards who can't shoot the three but also don't play defense particularly well, SFs who aren't lock down defenders but also aren't athletic enough to create their own shots, and so on.

The problem is that there are way more problems than there are solutions. Sure you can trade Prince and maybe Stuckey, but what will you get back? And look, you're still left with guys that have long contracts like CV and Rip, as well as even the new guys like Daye and Monroe who don't really fit any team identity either. This team is a mess of bad contracts and bad draft picks that do not gel into any sort of strategy at all.

Heck, the only way I can see to fix a team like that is to do something like what the Celtics did. Trade half your team away for a superstar that will single-handedly change/create the identity of your team. Good luck with that...

OK, sorry for the rant...back to this game. I watch every game and there are times when the team is down big and at the end of the night you feel like you've wasted your time. This game was not one of those times. While they didn't win in the end, the second half was pretty exciting and I'm glad I stuck through it.

Great post and better summary of the Pistons problems right now.

I think we are in for quite a few seasons of losing.

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I didn't know either.

So I am guessing the broadcast either glossed right over it or somehow, paying decent attention to 80% of the broadcast wasn't enough to pick up that there was this fight.

I listened to the halftime talk with Eli Zaret. I don't recall any questions about the fight. The first question had something to do with the 9-0 run to end the first half and how to keep that alive.

Are the Pistons broadcasts falling in caliber to the level of the team itself? Come on. If it was brought up, it was very limited. It certainly wasn't replayed on television that I ever saw. Honestly, I don't think it was brought up until the postgame show.

Great job Blaha, Kelser and Eli Zaret (who actually had a chance to talk to a coach about the strife) keeping the people in tune with what is going on around the court. Blaha already was this, but you now qualify as Pistons' PR slappies.

And it pains me to say that about Kelser. For years I commented about how much I enjoyed the games he did.

How can you either 1) totally ignore this happened or 2) suger-gloss it and bring it up so little that I didn't even realize it happened. Check this thread. I watched the game. I was concentrating on an email for a bit in the third/fourth quarters, but it was always on.

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Hopefully last night is the straw that brings the camel down.

We haven't committed to rebuilding in any sense of the word, it is astonishing. I think some of it stems from the ownership limbo, but nonetheless, as pretty much everyone on the board says all the time, play young guys, see if there is any talent and start over. RIP and Tayshaun had great runs in Detroit, no one is holding anything against them, it's just stale at this point.

Trade Stuckey too if you have to, of all the young guys, I think it's clear he is a productive nba player, but not dwyane wade pt II like Joe D had hoped for out of college.

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Hopefully last night is the straw that brings the camel down.

We haven't committed to rebuilding in any sense of the word, it is astonishing. I think some of it stems from the ownership limbo, but nonetheless, as pretty much everyone on the board says all the time, play young guys, see if there is any talent and start over. RIP and Tayshaun had great runs in Detroit, no one is holding anything against them, it's just stale at this point.

Trade Stuckey too if you have to, of all the young guys, I think it's clear he is a productive nba player, but not dwyane wade pt II like Joe D had hoped for out of college.

Stuckey just needs to play off the ball, thats really where he excels. Thats why I think Stuckey wont be back after this season, BG will be our 2 for a few years and the Pistons will move in a new direction.

After this season I think the following will be gone:

Tay

Rip

Stuckey

This has to happen to start the rebuild. Stuckey is a good player, but the Pistons have no use for him really, we need a legit PG and less combo guards.

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How can you either 1) totally ignore this happened or 2) suger-gloss it and bring it up so little that I didn't even realize it happened. Check this thread. I watched the game. I was concentrating on an email for a bit in the third/fourth quarters, but it was always on.

I bet it was the producers call. The tigers had it earlier this season with Armando and Avila (I think) where they had a big argument in the dug out and FSD didnt report it. FSD led off with it the following day, apologizing for not filling us in.

I could be wrong though.

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I bet it was the producers call. The tigers had it earlier this season with Armando and Avila (I think) where they had a big argument in the dug out and FSD didnt report it. FSD led off with it the following day, apologizing for not filling us in.

I could be wrong though.

Its possible they just didn't know how big of a deal it was.

Last night after the game I was reading my RSS feeds and two mentioned the argument. Reading both you would have thought both guys made a comment in passing and that was it. Then I read what Azzurri wrote and I was shocked we were even talking about the same incident. I wake up this morning and every paper and web site matches what Azzurri said word for word.

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Someone on a different site brought up an interesting point.

If Stuckey is benched a game for what he did. Shouldn't Prince also be benched for his actions? If not, you are saying there are different rules for different players.

And I believe thats exactly what is happening. Prince came right back out and started the 2nd half. I dont think Kuester has the gull to bench a player like Tay.

Personally, I think Kuester has no control over this team and the players know it. Changes will happen once a new owner is in place, and that couldnt come soon enough.

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And I believe thats exactly what is happening. Prince came right back out and started the 2nd half. I dont think Kuester has the gull to bench a player like Tay.

Personally, I think Kuester has no control over this team and the players know it. Changes will happen once a new owner is in place, and that couldnt come soon enough.

Honestly, no coach could have control of this team. We have some cancers on our team who have argued with and have not gotten along with quite a few coaches now. Its becoming apparent that the players are the problem, since this is a continuing occurrence.

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Both Tay and Q are to blame for last night. The coach can't lose his cool like that and Tay can't throw the coach under the bus like he did. However, it seems like he isn't the only one who has a problem with how Kuester does things and we on here have questioned it quite a lot so far this year. I personally would lean towards wha Tay says about how the Pistons should play since his basketball IQ is probably greater than Kuesters. I mean when Coach K tells Tayshaun to explain things to other members of the Olympic team, that shows how much he values his opinion. I didn't and haven't seen the blow up but it sounds like Kuester has lost his players and they are not playing for him. Same problem with Saunders and Curry and now him.

This team has a lot of problems all going back to Chauncey getting hurt against Boston in the 08 playoffs. That started this whole mess because Stuckey came in, played well and gave Joe D the idea that Stuckey could be his new PG and star. And from there we all know what happened, traded Billups for AI, wasted money on BG and CV, hired Curry, and so on. Until new ownership comes in and puts their foot print on this team, it will remain a mess.

As for the game, it was an inspiring comeback and they certainly can make things happen at times but the missed free throws just killed them.

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So I am guessing the broadcast either glossed right over it or somehow, paying decent attention to 80% of the broadcast wasn't enough to pick up that there was this fight.

Are the Pistons broadcasts falling in caliber to the level of the team itself? Come on. If it was brought up, it was very limited. It certainly wasn't replayed on television that I ever saw. Honestly, I don't think it was brought up until the postgame show.

Great job Blaha, Kelser and Eli Zaret (who actually had a chance to talk to a coach about the strife) keeping the people in tune with what is going on around the court. Blaha already was this, but you now qualify as Pistons' PR slappies.

And it pains me to say that about Kelser. For years I commented about how much I enjoyed the games he did.

Are you really surprised??....

The guys at Fox Sports are all squeaky-clean PR slappies. Blaha, God bless him, has been a slappy for decades. He has NOTHING demeaning to say about this franchise: never has, never will...

Kelser? Please: my Alma Mater's Most Congenial Graduate (Detroit Henry Ford)

You bet your butt, they knew about the spat.

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All networks are interested in that PR aspect of it, espn, csn, vs. The teams can't broadcast without the networks, networks can't get viewers without the teams (sans the yankees and yes, which is beyond brilliant, but also even more of a pr gloss over).

Doesn't matter if they mentioned it or not, we all know what happened and can discuss it without media filter.

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Someone on a different site brought up an interesting point.

If Stuckey is benched a game for what he did. Shouldn't Prince also be benched for his actions? If not, you are saying there are different rules for different players.

While Prince isn’t expected to be reprimanded by the Pistons, he had a lengthy discussion with his agent Bill Duffy after the game and could meet with team officials in Detroit. Several sources said tension has grown between the players and Kuester during the team’s struggles. Pistons guard Ben Gordon(notes) and forward Austin Daye(notes) have questioned Kuester’s in-game adjustments this season, and guard Rodney Stuckey(notes) was benched for a game after ignoring Kuester during a loss in Atlanta.

Looks like Kuester will be benching his entire team eventually.

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Both Tay and Q are to blame for last night. The coach can't lose his cool like that and Tay can't throw the coach under the bus like he did. However, it seems like he isn't the only one who has a problem with how Kuester does things and we on here have questioned it quite a lot so far this year. I personally would lean towards wha Tay says about how the Pistons should play since his basketball IQ is probably greater than Kuesters. I mean when Coach K tells Tayshaun to explain things to other members of the Olympic team, that shows how much he values his opinion. I didn't and haven't seen the blow up but it sounds like Kuester has lost his players and they are not playing for him. Same problem with Saunders and Curry and now him.

This team has a lot of problems all going back to Chauncey getting hurt against Boston in the 08 playoffs. That started this whole mess because Stuckey came in, played well and gave Joe D the idea that Stuckey could be his new PG and star. And from there we all know what happened, traded Billups for AI, wasted money on BG and CV, hired Curry, and so on. Until new ownership comes in and puts their foot print on this team, it will remain a mess.

As for the game, it was an inspiring comeback and they certainly can make things happen at times but the missed free throws just killed them.

I'd lean Prince's way too. As you suggest, his inclusion on the Olympic team was largely because of his attitude and basketball smarts. He's, at least publicly, always been a pretty quiet, respectful player in Detroit. After Saunders last game as head coach he and Rip went to Dumars to tell him that the blame didn't belong all on Saunders. It wasn't until Curry that any of his disillusionment became public. It's not something I support, on the other hand if you have guys who have won and want to win and you have a coach as ill prepared as Curry and as confused and incompetent as Kuester seems to be I would expect these kinds of collisions. The alternative is guys who just don't care.

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Jesus guys, we win 4/5 then finish a WC road trip with a dud(EXTREMELY NORMAL FOR ANY TEAM!!) and you guys are right back to "The sky is falling". Prince is a fiery guy, nothing to see here. Let's not make drama out of nothing. No, Prince doesn't need to be benched and yes there are different rules for different players. Stuckey was benched because Kuester thought he needed to sit. A vet like TP does not need to sit to learn some sort of lesson.

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I wouldn't doubt Karen Davidson - who badly wants to sell the Pistons as soon as possible - has told Blaha and company to promote the company line as much as possible in order to create as much of a positive perception about the franchise that can be done.

Doubtful. Number one, it's not like there aren't & weren't suitors to buy the team in the first place. Secondly, do you really think promoting the team on Fox Sports Detroit is going to have any huge impact on the franchise? The people who are watching are obviously already Pistons fans & wouldn't be watching this team, who quite frankly sucks now, if that wasn't the case. Not to mention, these are FSD games, not nationally televised games.

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Jesus guys, we win 4/5 then finish a WC road trip with a dud(EXTREMELY NORMAL FOR ANY TEAM!!) and you guys are right back to "The sky is falling". Prince is a fiery guy, nothing to see here. Let's not make drama out of nothing. No, Prince doesn't need to be benched and yes there are different rules for different players. Stuckey was benched because Kuester thought he needed to sit. A vet like TP does not need to sit to learn some sort of lesson.

We snuck by Golden State at home & the rest of those wins came against crappy teams, hardly something to get worked up about.

Bobcats - Beat them when they were 1-3, only win was against the Nets by two points. Currently 4-7, 2nd worst team in their division.

Clippers - Beat them in OT when they were 1-8. Dead last, currently the worst team in the league.

Kings - Beat them when they were 3-5, on a 4 game losing streak. Currently 3-6, 2nd worst team in their division.

Stuckey was benched because he ignored Kuester in a game & because Kuester questioned his leadership. If Tayshaun is going to continue to be a drama queen, then he sure as hell deserves to get benched. It doesn't matter if he's a veteran or not. Did Iverson not get benched just because he was a veteran?

For those who make the argument that Kuester has no control (which I at least somewhat agree with), there's only one way he can try and gain control, and that would be by benching a guy who is continually stirring **** up like Tayshaun. Your method on the other hand, is exactly why a guy like Kuester or anyone else comes in here & has no control of the team.

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Pistons and their coach have a rocky relationship | detnews.com | The Detroit News

After Monday's game, one player wondered why Stuckey was punished and Prince wasn't.

"You see it, the inconsistency," said the player, who didn't want to be quoted by name. "Everybody does."

Therein lies Kuester's problem. While it's true coaches treat players on an individual basis, there is no star who stands above everyone else.

Not good when you start getting anonymous quotes from players.

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It's too bad that Joe has established a pattern of "Okay, if you don't like him, I'll listen and make a change" over his tenure. The players should just shut up and play the game.

The problem is he keeps hiring coaches that can easily be walked all over, conviently leaving the coach as the scape goat. Curry and Kuester were bad hires, we all knew it, and the players know it to. The old guard has to go, including Dumars.

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