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Lions and Stafford Agree To Part Ways

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5 minutes ago, Buddha said:

dont follow that guy.  he's an ***.

“Barry McCockiner”? Clever. 

It’s almost clever enough for me to get a Twitter just so I can block the guy. 

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4 hours ago, RandyMarsh said:

Tom Brady has won 6 Conference championship games with these pathetic numbers.    

I dunno... maybe it's just that in the Championship game you can probably expect a good defense?

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Which QB do you want the Detroit Lions to take, assuming they draft one this year?

QB #1: Trade up for Trevor Lawrence

QB #2: Justin Fields

QB #3: Trey Lance

QB #4: Luke Wilson

QB #5: Mac Jones

QB #6: Kyle Trask

QB #7: Other

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5 minutes ago, RedRamage said:

I dunno... maybe it's just that in the Championship game you can probably expect a good defense?

But that excuse doesn't matter when it's Stafford. I think the point is Stafford doesn't have the luxury to throw more INTs than TDs because the Lions defense could never come up with a stop. Even the game against Dallas, when the Lions had a good defense, they couldn't come up with a final stop and let Dallas go down the field for the winning TD. 

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3 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

Peter King thinks Jimmy Garoppolo and a 2nd is enough for Stafford. 

So a Safety in Jamal Adams nets two 1sts and a 3rd but Stafford only nets us a middle-of-the-road, injured starting QB with a bad contract and a 2nd?

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9 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

But that excuse doesn't matter when it's Stafford. I think the point is Stafford doesn't have the luxury to throw more INTs than TDs because the Lions defense could never come up with a stop. Even the game against Dallas, when the Lions had a good defense, they couldn't come up with a final stop and let Dallas go down the field for the winning TD. 

Exactly, I wasn't trying to tear down Brady but just trying to show how narratives can change depending on how the rest of your team performs.   

When the rest of the team does their job you get labeled  with "he just knows how to win" or "he did what it took to win" if they don't and you lose you get labeled with "can't win the big game" or "choke artist" like Stafford gets painted with. 

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1 minute ago, Mr.TaterSalad said:

So a Safety in Jamal Adams nets two 1sts and a 3rd but Stafford only nets us a middle-of-the-road, injured starting QB with a bad contract and a 2nd?

I wouldn't mind taking Garoppolo back. He has a big contract but only $2.8 million dead cap so they can get out of it easy. It's going to take more than a 2nd though. You take Garoppolo back, draft your QB at 7, and if Garoppolo stays healthy, you have another trade asset. It's similar to what the Chiefs did with Alex Smith. Garappolo and a 2nd is a joke. If SF doesn't want to trade a 12, I would consider their 2 and 3 this year plus their 1st next year. SF is getting multiple comps in the 3rd round and with Stafford they would project to have a later 1st. On the Lions end, I kind of want to spread the draft capital over multiple drafts instead of placing it all in this one draft. The SF 2nd rounder is 43 so it's a fairly high pick. 

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9 minutes ago, RandyMarsh said:

Exactly, I wasn't trying to tear down Brady but just trying to show how narratives can change depending on how the rest of your team performs.   

When the rest of the team does their job you get labeled  with "he just knows how to win" or "he did what it took to win" if they don't and you lose you get labeled with "can't win the big game" or "choke artist" like Stafford gets painted with. 

This is spot on.

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3 hours ago, Jason_R said:

“Barry McCockiner”? Clever. 

It’s almost clever enough for me to get a Twitter just so I can block the guy. 

He has the look of a guy who has had sex exactly one time and 'knows' what he is talking about regarding it which led him to create that stupid handle.

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13 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

I wouldn't mind taking Garoppolo back. He has a big contract but only $2.8 million dead cap so they can get out of it easy. It's going to take more than a 2nd though. You take Garoppolo back, draft your QB at 7, and if Garoppolo stays healthy, you have another trade asset. It's similar to what the Chiefs did with Alex Smith. Garappolo and a 2nd is a joke. If SF doesn't want to trade a 12, I would consider their 2 and 3 this year plus their 1st next year. SF is getting multiple comps in the 3rd round and with Stafford they would project to have a later 1st. On the Lions end, I kind of want to spread the draft capital over multiple drafts instead of placing it all in this one draft. The SF 2nd rounder is 43 so it's a fairly high pick. 

If I'm Brad Holmes and Co. and the words first round pick don't come out of your mouth if your the GM on the other end of the line, I'm hanging up. I think given the market, Stafford gets a 1st rounder plus at minimum. Peter King is being ridiculous.

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Just now, Mr.TaterSalad said:

If I'm Brad Holmes and Co. and the words first round pick don't come out of your mouth if your the GM on the other end of the line, I'm hanging up. I think given the market, Stafford gets a 1st rounder plus at minimum. Peter King is being ridiculous.

Agree, the only way I'm moving Staff and not getting atleast one 1st is if its in the pipe dream of a deal where we deal Staff and the 7th pick for Watson. 

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Do you trade Stafford and the 7th to Jacksonville for the #1 pick? Maybe Jacksonville throws in a middle round pick? 

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34 minutes ago, RandyMarsh said:

Exactly, I wasn't trying to tear down Brady but just trying to show how narratives can change depending on how the rest of your team performs.   

When the rest of the team does their job you get labeled  with "he just knows how to win" or "he did what it took to win" if they don't and you lose you get labeled with "can't win the big game" or "choke artist" like Stafford gets painted with. 

Okay, I understand better what you're trying to say, and I'll (mostly) agree with you.

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6 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

I wouldn't mind taking Garoppolo back. He has a big contract but only $2.8 million dead cap so they can get out of it easy. It's going to take more than a 2nd though. You take Garoppolo back, draft your QB at 7, and if Garoppolo stays healthy, you have another trade asset. It's similar to what the Chiefs did with Alex Smith. Garappolo and a 2nd is a joke. If SF doesn't want to trade a 12, I would consider their 2 and 3 this year plus their 1st next year. SF is getting multiple comps in the 3rd round and with Stafford they would project to have a later 1st. On the Lions end, I kind of want to spread the draft capital over multiple drafts instead of placing it all in this one draft. The SF 2nd rounder is 43 so it's a fairly high pick. 

I would be okay with the trade you described but SF doesn't have a 3rd this year, they traded it to Washington for Trent Williams.

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21 minutes ago, Mr.TaterSalad said:

If I'm Brad Holmes and Co. and the words first round pick don't come out of your mouth if your the GM on the other end of the line, I'm hanging up. I think given the market, Stafford gets a 1st rounder plus at minimum. Peter King is being ridiculous.

Okay, I know what you're trying to say and I agree with you.  But, because my brain is screwy when I was reading this it made me think of a silly situation: What if a team called you up and offered you their 2nd round picks for the next 10 years... would you trade Stafford for that?  I mean, Holmes is supposed to be a draft guru and having two 2nd round picks for the next decade would be a nice thing to have.  I don't know if I would or I wouldn't pull the trigger on that offer, but man, it's intriguing. 

Also, on a purely side note: How does the league handling if it a team loses a draft pick for doing something bad, but already committed to trading that pick?  For example, let's say team X agrees to trade their 1st round pick this year and their second round pick next year for Stafford and the Lions agree.  But then sometime during this year team X is caught cheating some how and they lose their 2nd round pick in 2022 as punishment.  What would the league do?  The obvious answer is just push that trade out a year and the Lions get their 2023 2nd round pick, but I don't think that's necessarily fair to the Lions.  Delaying team X's punish probably would be what they would do, but that also isn't a perfect fit as now it might be new coaches players and even a front office that is effected.  For the record I don't know that there is a perfect solution, but a side question that popped into my head. (I did say my brain is screwy, didn't I?)

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13 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

Do you trade Stafford and the 7th to Jacksonville for the #1 pick? Maybe Jacksonville throws in a middle round pick? 

Yes

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2 minutes ago, MichiganCardinal said:

I would be okay with the trade you described but SF doesn't have a 3rd this year, they traded it to Washington for Trent Williams.

SF is getting multiple 3rd round comp picks for losing Saleh and Mayhew. They could trade one of those. 

On a side note, why does SF get comp picks for Mayhew getting a GM job when Detroit gave him a GM job before going to SF? 

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1 hour ago, Motown Bombers said:

Peter King thinks Jimmy Garoppolo and a 2nd is enough for Stafford. 

That would be the worst trade of all time. Holmes would start his tenure out with extreme criticism from the fan base.  That trade proposed by King is a joke.  

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35 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

Do you trade Stafford and the 7th to Jacksonville for the #1 pick? Maybe Jacksonville throws in a middle round pick? 

Of course you do that trade. Of course, Jacksonville says **** off Brad Holmes.

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40 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

Do you trade Stafford and the 7th to Jacksonville for the #1 pick? Maybe Jacksonville throws in a middle round pick? 

I'm almost certain we would need to send more to them before Jacksonville would be sending us more - we may not even have enough as it is to get it done. Lawrence is 21 years old and as close to a sure-fire as it gets in the draft. It's likely that Urban hired on with the assumption he would be getting Lawrence to work with. Plus the difference in trade value chart between 1.1 and 1.7 is 1500 points. That's like saying Stafford on his own is worth the #7 overall pick (valued at 1500 points), which I don't think is the case.

That's not to say it wouldn't be worth a call - Jacksonville is a stupid organization that does stupid things.

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1 minute ago, MichiganCardinal said:

I'm almost certain we would need to send more to them before Jacksonville would be sending us more - we may not even have enough as it is to get it done. Lawrence is 21 years old and as close to a sure-fire as it gets in the draft. It's likely that Urban hired on with the assumption he would be getting Lawrence to work with. Plus the difference in trade value chart between 1.1 and 1.7 is 1500 points. That's like saying Stafford on his own is worth the #7 overall pick (valued at 1500 points, which I don't think is the case.

That's not to say it wouldn't be worth a call - Jacksonville is a stupid organization that does stupid things.

I wouldn't dismiss it out of hand. Apparently Stafford and Bevell had a great relationship. Trevor Lawrence hasn't thrown a pass in the NFL. At this point, he's only hype and potential. Stafford is a sure thing and not exactly old but not young. You still get a top 10 pick. Jacksonville has a lot of picks. They have a lot of cap space. They can turn it around quick. Khan strikes me as a Daniel Snyder type who would make a bold move like this. 

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1 minute ago, Motown Bombers said:

I wouldn't dismiss it out of hand. Apparently Stafford and Bevell had a great relationship. Trevor Lawrence hasn't thrown a pass in the NFL. At this point, he's only hype and potential. Stafford is a sure thing and not exactly old but not young. You still get a top 10 pick. Jacksonville has a lot of picks. They have a lot of cap space. They can turn it around quick. Khan strikes me as a Daniel Snyder type who would make a bold move like this. 

If Bevell can convince Khan and Meyer to do it, I'll take back everything mean I said about his getting AP the ball too many times. :)

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4 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

I wouldn't dismiss it out of hand. Apparently Stafford and Bevell had a great relationship. Trevor Lawrence hasn't thrown a pass in the NFL. At this point, he's only hype and potential. Stafford is a sure thing and not exactly old but not young. You still get a top 10 pick. Jacksonville has a lot of picks. They have a lot of cap space. They can turn it around quick. Khan strikes me as a Daniel Snyder type who would make a bold move like this. 

They aren't trading Lawrence. You can downplay him all you want but generational QB prospects who will be on a cheap contract for the next 5 years is the Gold Standard of assets.

Maybe Jacksonville does something stupid because it's Jacksonville but it's extremely unlikely.

Stafford+#7 for #2+ something smaller is more realistic.

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