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5 hours ago, Oblong said:

Yes.  We are still learning about the effects of this on our bodies. It attacks the organs not just the lungs.

If you try the google you can find lots of examples of people who didn't die but are having long tern effects from getting it.  For many people it's not just a coughing fit for a few weeks and back to normal.  Severe lack of energy, breathing issues, aches.... 

now we're talking about athletes competing at the highest levels.... not just going back to work in an office job. 

 

I know that, but that still does not mean there is a "decent" chance you will get those symptoms if you are a healthy adult is all I am saying.  My wife is an NP and dealing with patients who have COVID almost daily.

Am I "allowed" to say that she has ordered testing on about 50 patients in just one facility so far and there have been relatively sick people before this all started that tested positive and beat it that are well into their 80's+?

Should I go and say there is a decent chance if you get it you will recover with no real symptoms or issues considering the majority of people who do get it will recover because I have this info?

Seems like most people on here want to perpetuate the idea that this is worse than it is.  I can already hear the keyboards ticking away like crazy because of this comment because apparently if you do not think this is completely horrific/the beginning of the end, or not an issue at all you get stones thrown your way by the masses for a middle of the road opinion on it.

It is bad, people ARE dying because of it, I AM practicing social distancing, I am wearing a KN-95 mask anytime I am in an enclosed public space, I can also use the information available and come to different conclusions.

 

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3 hours ago, six-hopper said:

With epidemiologists now saying that the death rate is only 0.15 to 0.4 percent (meaning that somewhere between 1 in 250 and 1 in 650 infected people die from it)

This is a misleading statement. This was the CDC's estimation at a point in time. It varies greatly by location, and there are several strains extant. Hopefully, this becomes true, but the estimations have gone up and down over time. This virus is yet to be understood. 

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1 hour ago, Oblong said:

Imagine an airplane with 200 people on board.  Before you take off they say "Ok, 1 of you will die.  half of you will get pretty sick for a few weeks.  Some of that group will have to go on a ventilator.  Some others will have to go to the hospital.  Most of those who get sick will miss a few weeks of work, at least... Some of you will have to be on oxygen, dialysis... you'll be dealing with the issue for a few months.  Those of you who don't get sick, there will be a chance that you will expose your family and friends to what I just described..

 

how many people are getting off that plane?

 

It wouldn't be half. Half might get it but almost all of them will be asymptomatic. I think professional athletes would be willing to take that risk to be able to have a season. 

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1 minute ago, Longgone said:

This is a misleading statement. This was the CDC's estimation at a point in time. It varies greatly by location, and there are several strains extant. Hopefully, this becomes true, but the estimations have gone up and down over time. This virus is yet to be understood. 

Truth

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I really do not want to derail this thread.  There are enough threads talking about COVID.  If anyone wants to have a discussion about it PM me.

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5 minutes ago, Yoda said:

It wouldn't be half. Half might get it but almost all of them will be asymptomatic. I think professional athletes would be willing to take that risk to be able to have a season. 

My analogy was more about the # of people getting it in total.  This idea that if we just let everyone get it and build herd immunity then it's all good.  I only mentioned the airplane to show what 200 people look like.

 

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5 minutes ago, Oblong said:

My analogy was more about the # of people getting it in total.  This idea that if we just let everyone get it and build herd immunity then it's all good.  I only mentioned the airplane to show what 200 people look like.

 

Yeah heard immunity isn't going to happen. 

Airplane aside, if 200 pro athletes, mostly in the 20's, got it, half of them wouldn't get very sick. That's all I was saying. 

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An on air WWE talent said they tested positive for covid in early March then was ruled recovered only to test positive again the other day.   

 

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10 minutes ago, RandyMarsh said:

An on air WWE talent said they tested positive for covid in early March then was ruled recovered only to test positive again the other day.   

 

To my knowledge, which isn't ****, that isn't a thing that's happening. In a rare event like that I have to think it could just be human error. Sometimes results get mixed up and such. If it's not happening all over then it probably didn't happen to that person. Were they sick both times? 

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25 minutes ago, John_Brian_K said:

I really do not want to derail this thread.  There are enough threads talking about COVID.  If anyone wants to have a discussion about it PM me.

Well, the possibility of a season hinges on COVID, so I think it is going to be a part of the conversation, if not the key part of the conversation, regardless.

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6 minutes ago, Mr. Bigglesworth said:

Could tested positive merely mean they tested positive for antibodies? 

right, or as is already known, once this gets deep in the lungs the dead residues can take a long time to clear. PCR (D/R-NA) based tests can't tell the difference between active and 'dead' material.

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10 minutes ago, John_Brian_K said:

I know that, but that still does not mean there is a "decent" chance you will get those symptoms if you are a healthy adult is all I am saying.  My wife is an NP and dealing with patients who have COVID almost daily.

Am I "allowed" to say that she has ordered testing on about 50 patients in just one facility so far and there have been relatively sick people before this all started that tested positive and beat it that are well into their 80's+?

Should I go and say there is a decent chance if you get it you will recover with no real symptoms or issues considering the majority of people who do get it will recover because I have this info?

Seems like most people on here want to perpetuate the idea that this is worse than it is.  I can already here the keyboards ticking away like crazy because of this comment because apparently if you do not think this is completely horrific/the beginning of the end, or not an issue at all you get stones thrown your way by the masses for a middle of the road opinion on it.

It is bad, people ARE dying because of it, I AM practicing social distancing, I am wearing a KN-95 mask anytime I am in an enclosed public space, I can also use the information available and come to different conclusions.

 

My wife also treats COVID patients and the way I see it if they are one of her patients then yes, "decent" is the correct word. Obviously the majority of affected people in our area will not be in a hospital but the fact we're seeing even as many in hospitals as we are now shows the risk of this virus is real beyond just having a cough.  Maybe you misconstrued the meaning of the word.  Decent is not  odds I want to take.

 

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42 minutes ago, Longgone said:

This is a misleading statement. This was the CDC's estimation at a point in time. It varies greatly by location, and there are several strains extant. Hopefully, this becomes true, but the estimations have gone up and down over time. This virus is yet to be understood. 

Many people in this society can't understand a garage door pull rope.  So getting to understanding of something significantly more complicated is a very tall order.  

As for the death rate, the reported range from 0.15 to 0.4 percent is a very recent one, and coming from some widely disparate research sources.  That is a far cry from the 3 or 4 or 10 percent figures that were hysterically thrown around early on.

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4 minutes ago, Yoda said:

To my knowledge, which isn't ****, that isn't a thing that's happening. In a rare event like that I have to think it could just be human error. Sometimes results get mixed up and such. If it's not happening all over then it probably didn't happen to that person. Were they sick both times? 

I don't believe they were sick,  they didn't really go into details though just posted a tweet about it.  

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5 minutes ago, six-hopper said:

Many people in this society can't understand a garage pull rope.  So getting to understanding of something significantly more complicated is a very tall order.  

As for the death rate, the reported range from 0.15 to 0.4 percent is a very recent one, and coming from some widely disparate research sources.  Which is a far cry from the 3 or 4 or 10 percent figures that were hysterically thrown around early on.

54

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yeah only an idiot would see this and think "That's not a noose.... it's just a garage pull rope"

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2 hours ago, 84 Lives!!! said:

All political.

There is certainly a political aspect to this, but there are also plenty of people that are just sick of hearing about it and sick of living in isolation. There is plenty of real day to day life stuff that is forming people’s opinion on it. I think I would challenge anybody to say they are acting in the same way today as they were acting three months ago. Everyone has loosened up to some degree. Some way more than others. 
 

I think dismissing that as all political is way too simplistic. 

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Also, .15% of the US population is almost 500,000 people.  Assuming 70% infection rate to achieve herd immunity -> 350,000 dead.

Best case scenario using herd immunity.

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47 minutes ago, John_Brian_K said:

I know that, but that still does not mean there is a "decent" chance you will get those symptoms if you are a healthy adult is all I am saying.  My wife is an NP and dealing with patients who have COVID almost daily.

Am I "allowed" to say that she has ordered testing on about 50 patients in just one facility so far and there have been relatively sick people before this all started that tested positive and beat it that are well into their 80's+?

Should I go and say there is a decent chance if you get it you will recover with no real symptoms or issues considering the majority of people who do get it will recover because I have this info?

Seems like most people on here want to perpetuate the idea that this is worse than it is.  I can already here the keyboards ticking away like crazy because of this comment because apparently if you do not think this is completely horrific/the beginning of the end, or not an issue at all you get stones thrown your way by the masses for a middle of the road opinion on it.

It is bad, people ARE dying because of it, I AM practicing social distancing, I am wearing a KN-95 mask anytime I am in an enclosed public space, I can also use the information available and come to different conclusions.

 

He didn't say there is a decent chance they will all get sick.  There is a decent chance that one out of the many players will get very sick.   

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Just now, Shelton said:

There is certainly a political aspect to this, but there are also plenty of people that are just sick of hearing about it and sick of living in isolation. There is plenty of real day to day life stuff that is forming people’s opinion on it. I think I would challenge anybody to say they are acting in the same way today as they were acting three months ago. Everyone has loosened up to some degree. Some way more than others. 

I think dismissing that as all political is way too simplistic. 

I'm not talking about cabin fever. Everybody has that.

I'm talking about incessant attempts to diminish the threat of this disease. Starting with six-hopper's "only 54 cases", Trump's "hoax", and currently up to approximately 120K deaths out of ~2.5MM positives (5% mortality rate) and continuing with Trump supporters refusal to wear masks. Pure political BS. My statement stands.

And yes, that may be a bit simplistic... there is going to be some nuance in there... Including kids (anyone under 25 let's say) saying "screw it".

But I believe the overwhelming driver in trying to diminish the threat of the disease is political.

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20 minutes ago, six-hopper said:

Many people in this society can't understand a garage door pull rope.  So getting to understanding of something significantly more complicated is a very tall order.  

As for the death rate, the reported range from 0.15 to 0.4 percent is a very recent one, and coming from some widely disparate research sources.  That is a far cry from the 3 or 4 or 10 percent figures that were hysterically thrown around early on.

You may be mixing up your terminology. The case death rate world wide is 5.8%. That is different from the overall death rate. 

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1 hour ago, John_Brian_K said:

I know that, but that still does not mean there is a "decent" chance you will get those symptoms if you are a healthy adult is all I am saying.  My wife is an NP and dealing with patients who have COVID almost daily.

Am I "allowed" to say that she has ordered testing on about 50 patients in just one facility so far and there have been relatively sick people before this all started that tested positive and beat it that are well into their 80's+?

Should I go and say there is a decent chance if you get it you will recover with no real symptoms or issues considering the majority of people who do get it will recover because I have this info?

Seems like most people on here want to perpetuate the idea that this is worse than it is.  I can already here the keyboards ticking away like crazy because of this comment because apparently if you do not think this is completely horrific/the beginning of the end, or not an issue at all you get stones thrown your way by the masses for a middle of the road opinion on it.

It is bad, people ARE dying because of it, I AM practicing social distancing, I am wearing a KN-95 mask anytime I am in an enclosed public space, I can also use the information available and come to different conclusions.

 

The concentration of concern about the coronavirus on this board is much much higher than I am seeing in the real world.  Almost none of the small businesses I've visited in recent weeks are enforcing any sort of "social  distancing" or mask-wearing.  And two or three weeks ago, at big stores like Walmart and Meijer and Kroger, it appeared to me that about 90 percent of the customers were wearing masks.  This week it was down to maybe 60 percent.  And I've been in two large bars in the last week, and both of them were packed -- people sitting shoulder-to-shoulder at the bar, tables fully occupied, and no one but some of the employees wearing masks.

The Free Press keeps telling us that polls show people in Michigan strongly supporting Whitmer's orders and seriously concerned about a "second wave."  My observation makes me believe that is not true.  It appears to me that most people regard the virus as yesterday's news.  

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1 minute ago, six-hopper said:

The concentration of concern about the coronavirus on this board is much much higher than I am seeing in the real world.  Virtually none of the small businesses I've visited in recent weeks are enforcing any sort of "social  distancing" or mask-wearing.  And...

And that's why Texas is up to 5,500 new cases per day and their ICU's are almost maxed out. Same with Florida.

Because too many morons don't have the intelligence to wear a mask or socially distance. That's 'Murica. Land of the Stupid Imbeciles.

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13 minutes ago, six-hopper said:

  And I've been in two large bars in the last week, and both of them were packed -- people sitting shoulder-to-shoulder at the bar, tables fully occupied, and no one but some of the employees wearing masks.

 

you do realize that the people you see in those bars, including yourself are a self-selected sub-sample based on exactly on their belief the virus is yesterday's news.

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