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Coronavirus: Coming to a Neighborhood Near You?

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Just now, Gehringer_2 said:

I wish. The Red Tails take the occasional smaller rodent but the fox squirrels have no natural predators here other than the automobile, and since no-one is driving -- well, you can do the math!

I actually have some squirrels coming in a meat delivery in a couple of weeks time so am looking for recipes...

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11 minutes ago, chasfh said:

Motivated in a negative way meaning what?

This conversation probably belongs in one of the other threads (sorry Euph), but...

When Donald Trump, or an ally of the President, tweets something or says something inflammatory, just as the tweet may serve a purpose in terms of motivating the Trump base, the tweets or statements can also have the effective of motivating those who do not like the President.

I mention the Kentucky election specifically because, at the time of that race, President Trump had a rally in Lexington right before the election. And incidentally, the candidate that Trump tweeted for and campaigned for (Matt Bevin) lost the race, and did particularly poorly in Fayette County (home of Lexington) and the counties immediately surrounding Fayette County relative to the rest of the state.

To be sure, correlation =/= causation, but the broader point is that his tweets and statements, as well as those of his allies, can fire up his supporters *and* his opponents.

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21 minutes ago, Melody said:

this is not the first place I have seen some of this. IIRC, there was observation out of China early on that doctors were surprised some patients did as well on O2 alone as on respirators. It's counter intuitive but you wonder if they should be trying things along the line of anti-organ-rejection cocktails to achieve some immune suppression.

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1 hour ago, CMRivdog said:

Given a choice I’d rather use rocks or pebbles than $2 mulch. Lasts longer and looks better. 
 

Gotta put that black plastic down first...
 

My house came with rocks, and I hate them...

I had to dig up a dead bush in the front area with those rocks and ended up having to tear up a big section of that black plastic in order to get the bush out. I've had weeds growing in them for a while since, and weedeating it hurts but me and my car.

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21 minutes ago, mtutiger said:

This conversation probably belongs in one of the other threads (sorry Euph), but...

When Donald Trump, or an ally of the President, tweets something or says something inflammatory, just as the tweet may serve a purpose in terms of motivating the Trump base, the tweets or statements can also have the effective of motivating those who do not like the President.

I mention the Kentucky election specifically because, at the time of that race, President Trump had a rally in Lexington right before the election. And incidentally, the candidate that Trump tweeted for and campaigned for (Matt Bevin) lost the race, and did particularly poorly in Fayette County (home of Lexington) and the counties immediately surrounding Fayette County relative to the rest of the state.

To be sure, correlation =/= causation, but the broader point is that his tweets and statements, as well as those of his allies, can fire up his supporters *and* his opponents.

I'm not sure how much his tweets fire up anyone either way anymore. It's been such a fire hose for four years that any one of the thousands of outrageous things he has tweeted that would with certainty have sunk the career of an ordinary politician just recedes into the background now, because of the sheer volume and relentlessness of it all.

I'm coming around to the idea that the tweets are meant more to maintain a steady level of hype and agitation, rather than to spike outrage, because I'm not sure tweets can create that kind of spike anymore. The outrageousness all seems so normal now that any one tweet or statement fails to feel particularly outrageous.

So I'm a little skeptical that an inflammatory statement made in April will have much effect in November, whether to get red hats (we can still say that, right?) to the polls, or to get you or me there. And our current politics are so calcified that I don't know whether anything that is said in September or even October can make much difference, either. These are unprecedented times.

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8 minutes ago, Gehringer_2 said:

this is not the first place I have seen some of this. IIRC, there was observation out of China early on that doctors were surprised some patients did as well on O2 alone as on respirators. It's counter intuitive but you wonder if they should be trying things along the line of anti-organ-rejection cocktails to achieve some immune suppression.

As  understand it,  immune system moderation  is part of why some think chloroquine might be helpful?   Then there are studies using plasma of recovered patients to boost immune response that appear to be helpful in some cases.   So much conflicting medical information.     I have wondered if the difference in severity of cases could possibly involve some other virus or disease that the patient previously suffered and had immune cells for.  

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Quote

We presented a nationally representative sample of 3,000 U.S. residents with eight possible policy responses to the outbreak, all of which may be unconstitutional, including forced quarantine in a government facility, criminal penalties for spreading misinformation, bans against certain people entering the country, and conscription of health-care workers.

A majority of respondents supported all eight of these policies, most by considerable margins. The proposals with the lowest support were seizing businesses and banning all citizens and noncitizens outside the country from entering, but these policies still had 58 and 63 percent support, respectively. The proposals with the highest levels of support were banning noncitizens from entering the country (85 percent) and conscripting health-care professionals to work despite risks to their own health (78 percent). Both policies burden a defined minority of the population, so it’s not surprising that large majorities support them. But criminalizing speech based on its content, an idea antithetical to modern American constitutionalism, was also very popular: About 70 percent of respondents supported restricting people’s ability to say things that may qualify as misinformation. Likewise, 77 percent of respondents support suspending all religious services and gatherings, thereby restricting religious freedom. And even when we explicitly told half of our sample that the policies may violate the Constitution, the majority supported all eight of them—even the speech restrictions.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/03/coronavirus-america-constitution/608665/

No jokes, this is real freaking issue. If you are one of these people, reconsider. 

"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

- Ben Franklin

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35 minutes ago, chasfh said:

I'm not sure how much his tweets fire up anyone either way anymore. It's been such a fire hose for four years that any one of the thousands of outrageous things he has tweeted that would with certainty have sunk the career of an ordinary politician just recedes into the background now, because of the sheer volume and relentlessness of it all.

I'm coming around to the idea that the tweets are meant more to maintain a steady level of hype and agitation, rather than to spike outrage, because I'm not sure tweets can create that kind of spike anymore. The outrageousness all seems so normal now that any one tweet or statement fails to feel particularly outrageous.

So I'm a little skeptical that an inflammatory statement made in April will have much effect in November, whether to get red hats (we can still say that, right?) to the polls, or to get you or me there. And our current politics are so calcified that I don't know whether anything that is said in September or even October can make much difference, either. These are unprecedented times.

I think this is largely true, but I also tend to believe if anything it has turned negative for him. The thing about being a leader is that specific actions always generate more intense negative feed back than positive - which tend to be diffuse. So as a general proposition it's difficult for any active leader (whether good or  bad) not to slowly bleed support as his specific actions engender more opposition. In Trump's case, this general truth is magnified by the transparency of his narcissistic decision making constantly on display in his tweets. For instance, I'm sure Fauci has some fans among the Trumpers.  Maligning him on twitter will for some of them be the straw the breaks the camel's back of their support of Trump. Drip..drip...drip..

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None of the polls, elections, feeling, media hysteria mean anything. The election isn't until November all of you getting worked up about numbers and theories means jack and jack just left town. 

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 Model projects US has reached peak

HU says the U.S. currently has a mortality rate of 4%, based on confirmed cases. Only Germany (2.4%) is lower among the 10 countries most affected by COVID-19.

 The model predicts that the number of daily fatalities will begin to drop, but won't reach zero until June 22. The model is based on social distancing measures continuing. 

 

https://covid19.healthdata.org/united-states-of-america

 

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25 minutes ago, chasfh said:

I'm not sure how much his tweets fire up anyone either way anymore. It's been such a fire hose for four years that any one of the thousands of outrageous things he has tweeted that would with certainty have sunk the career of an ordinary politician just recedes into the background now, because of the sheer volume and relentlessness of it all.

I'm coming around to the idea that the tweets are meant more to maintain a steady level of hype and agitation, rather than to spike outrage, because I'm not sure tweets can create that kind of spike anymore. The outrageousness all seems so normal now that any one tweet or statement fails to feel particularly outrageous.

So I'm a little skeptical that an inflammatory statement made in April will have much effect in November, whether to get red hats (we can still say that, right?) to the polls, or to get you or me there. And our current politics are so calcified that I don't know whether anything that is said in September or even October can make much difference, either. These are unprecedented times.

I'm with you on this. I'm more making the point that, to the extent that his tweets, statements, actions, etc. have an effect, they are likely evened out, if not canceled out entirely, by the effect that they have on those who do not like him.

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2 minutes ago, Gehringer_2 said:

"The Constitution is not a suicide pact" - Robert H. Jackson - (SCOTUS 1941-1954)

Anyone who supports locking citizens out of the country, literally turning healthcare workers into forced labor, limiting free speech, etc is a scared little baby, who only cares about themselves. Literally don't give away your freedoms, they won't come back.

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10 minutes ago, Gehringer_2 said:

I think this is largely true, but I also tend to believe if anything it has turned negative for him. The thing about being a leader is that specific actions always generate more intense negative feed back than positive - which tend to be diffuse. So as a general proposition it's difficult for any active leader (whether good or  bad) not to slowly bleed support as his specific actions engender more opposition. In Trump's case, this general truth is magnified by the transparency of his narcissistic decision constantly on display in his tweets. For instance, I'm sure Fauci has some fans among the Trumpers.  Maligning him on twitter will for some of them be the straw the breaks the camel's back of their support of Trump. Drip..drip...drip..

Agreed.

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Just now, RatkoVarda said:

Party of Stupidity

 

Seat belts compared to forced labor, restrictions of speech, locking people out of their own country, etc is not the same not even remotely. 

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8 minutes ago, Gehringer_2 said:

I think this is largely true, but I also tend to believe if anything it has turned negative for him. The thing about being a leader is that specific actions always generate more intense negative feed back than positive - which tend to be diffuse. So as a general proposition it's difficult for any active leader (whether good or  bad) not to slowly bleed support as his specific actions engender more opposition. In Trump's case, this general truth is magnified by the transparency of his narcissistic decision constantly on display in his tweets. For instance, I'm sure Fauci has some fans among the Trumpers.  Maligning him on twitter will for some of them be the straw the breaks the camel's back of their support of Trump. Drip..drip...drip..

I'll believe it has turned negative for Trump when his polls drop below the established range of his approval ratings and stay there for a while.

Right now, though, his numbers are toward the high end of that range.

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1 minute ago, chasfh said:

I'll believe it has turned negative for Trump when his polls drop below the established range of his approval ratings and stay there for a while.

I don't see how this is relevant at all to G2's point.

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1 minute ago, mtutiger said:

I don't see how this is relevant at all to G2's point.

G2 says he tends to believe if anything it has turned negative for Trump.

I say I'll believe it has turned negative for Trump when his polls drop below the established range of his approval ratings and stay there for a while.

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8 minutes ago, MAROTH4MVP said:

Seat belts compared to forced labor, restrictions of speech, locking people out of their own country, etc is not the same not even remotely. 

There is forced labor, citizens not allowed into the country and restrictions to speech?

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