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9/8 Detroit Lions at Arizona Cardinals

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13 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

But your logic doesn't make sense. You would probably complain if Stafford let the clock run and gave his team no choice. Apparently the coaching staff agreed with his decision as they decided to go for it on 3rd down. 

Even faced with overwhelming evidence that the decisions made on 2 of the final 3 plays were dangerously bad you are still defending the sequence.

 

That throw on 3rd down was unforgivable and should have cost them the game.  Going into the huddle on 1st down it should have been obvious that if they didn’t get a large chunk of yards or stop the clock then they should just let the clock run out.

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9 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

But your logic doesn't make sense. You would probably complain if Stafford let the clock run and gave his team no choice. Apparently the coaching staff agreed with his decision as they decided to go for it on 3rd down. 

No I wouldn't have complained if he let the clock run out because as I said a million times, that's what I wanted him to do.

I also said a bunch of times that Stafford played well this game so I'm not a Stafford hater but the decision to spike the ball was a poor one.

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9 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

You wanted to pay Rieff LT money to be a RT? Rieff got more money than Wagner. 

actually I mistyped -  of course, Rieff was our LT before Decker. A more careful org might have left Reiff at LT where his salary demand was more justified and played Decker at RT or another position on the line to hedge their bets since Decker was still on his rookie deal. Sure, it's understandable they didn't want to pay Reiff to play RT what another team was willing to pay him to play LT, but were the Lions forcing themselves into a choice they really didn't have to make at that point? And then of course, the crowning irony is that they paid Wagner damn near LT money anyway - less than 1/2M difference this yr (Rieff 9.4, Wagner 9.0 as per football ref)

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9 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

The Chargers blew a 24-9 lead to the Colts and their backup QB. I don't feel they are some unbeatable team. I haven't said Decker wasn't bad but what can you do about it? There's no replacement on the team. The Eagles and Packers didn't look perfect either.The Chiefs will probably be a bloodbath. 

What can you do about anything on the Lions?  Nothing.  The point is they have 16 games, 8 on the road, and they had this one in the bag against the worst team in the League last year and they absolutely blew it.  That should be a warning sign to all of us fans that we might be overestimating the talent on this team.

As for the Chargers, they could totally win that game.  It's the NFL, anyone can win any one game, especially at home (see Lions v Pats last year).

I was encouraged with how Stafford threw the ball and how the receivers played.  I came in thinking the dline was a strength of the team and left wondering why they gave Trey Flowers that much money to do absolutely nothing.  I came away very concerned about the oline and Decker in particular.  If he's going to be the new Greg Robinson, the Lions are going back to the top 10 in the draft.

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Just now, Buddha said:

What can you do about anything on the Lions?  Nothing.  The point is they have 16 games, 8 on the road, and they had this one in the bag against the worst team in the League last year and they absolutely blew it.  That should be a warning sign to all of us fans that we might be overestimating the talent on this team.

As for the Chargers, they could totally win that game.  It's the NFL, anyone can win any one game, especially at home (see Lions v Pats last year).

I was encouraged with how Stafford threw the ball and how the receivers played.  I came in thinking the dline was a strength of the team and left wondering why they gave Trey Flowers that much money to do absolutely nothing.  I came away very concerned about the oline and Decker in particular.  If he's going to be the new Greg Robinson, the Lions are going back to the top 10 in the draft.

I wouldn't be too hard on Flowers, he didn't play at all in the preseason and didn't practice much either. It'll take him a bit more time to get up to game speed.

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1 minute ago, Buddha said:

Riley Rieff was not that good as a Lion.

Warford is the one that they should have never let go.

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Just now, NYLion said:

I wouldn't be too hard on Flowers, he didn't play at all in the preseason and didn't practice much either. It'll take him a bit more time to get up to game speed.

I would have rather traded a couple of mid round picks for Clowney.

I hope I'm wrong and you're right, but I have a sinking suspicion that Flowers has the typical "he was great in New England and will suck once he leaves" that seems to be pervading this entire organization at the moment.

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And can we all direct some anger at Darrell ******* Bevell who cost them the game by calling a stupid time out right before the play that should have won them the game?

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9 minutes ago, Buddha said:

And can we all direct some anger at Darrell ******* Bevell who cost them the game by calling a stupid time out right before the play that should have won them the game?

Pretty hard to believe a new on the scene coach doesn't respect that Stafford over the years has proven himself one of the premier play clock managers in the game and doesn't trust him to get a snap off. Just crazy. Guys in the booth tried to claim he must have thought they were going against the wrong defense. Well if he thought that he was still a fool since the play worked to perfection.

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I watched my Patriots humiliate the Steelers tonight.   Wearing silver helmets is the only thing that the Pats and the Lions have in common.

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8 hours ago, sagnam said:

 

Even faced with overwhelming evidence that the decisions made on 2 of the final 3 plays were dangerously bad you are still defending the sequence.

 

That throw on 3rd down was unforgivable and should have cost them the game.  Going into the huddle on 1st down it should have been obvious that if they didn’t get a large chunk of yards or stop the clock then they should just let the clock run out.

You are conflating the decision to go for it on 3rd down with the spike on 2nd down. I'm not debating the play call on 3rd down. There is no reason not to spike it on 2nd down. Just because the ball was spiked on 2nd down doesn't mean they were forced to throw it downfield on 3rd down. The coaching staff could have decided that it isn't worth the risk, lets just call a knee and run out the clock. It would have accomplished the same exact thing if they let the clock run out instead of spiking it. Everyone acts like they had to go for it on 3rd down since the ball was spiked. That was a separate decision. Every QB in the league spikes the ball on 2nd down there. Spike it and then decide if you want to run out the clock.

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33 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

You are conflating the decision to go for it on 3rd down with the spike on 2nd down. I'm not debating the play call on 3rd down. There is no reason not to spike it on 2nd down. Just because the ball was spiked on 2nd down doesn't mean they were forced to throw it downfield on 3rd down. The coaching staff could have decided that it isn't worth the risk, lets just call a knee and run out the clock. It would have accomplished the same exact thing if they let the clock run out instead of spiking it. Everyone acts like they had to go for it on 3rd down since the ball was spiked. That was a separate decision. Every QB in the league spikes the ball on 2nd down there. Spike it and then decide if you want to run out the clock.

Last word!

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Observations...

1. Hock is a stud. If not for one of the major faults of the team yesterday — Decker’s poor play, Agnew’s muff, or coaching blunders — we would be talking about Hock’s historically great debut. 

2. Decker is clearly not the long term solution, and is even a short term problem. Is it possible to swap him and a mid-level draft pick for Trent Williams?

3. Justin Rogers noted that Dahl, Wiggins, and Glasgow were cycling in and out. Still no certainty on the OL. Apparently the brain trust is using September as an extension of training camp  

4. Flowers was invisible yesterday. Even his late face mask penalty I couldn’t see. 

5. I actually liked a lot of what Bevell did. It was hampered, again, by the OL, but how about Stafford on a naked bootleg? And designed roll outs? But Stafford gave them an earful after that time out. “TRUST ME!!!” Good. Teach the staff a lesson. 

6. Coach Rocket Scientist seemed to trust his defense to be aggressive against a rookie QB in the first half, then lost his trust in the second half. Bad idea. 

7. Will Agnew be returning punts next game?

8. Amendola forgot he was brought here to do his job. He tried to do everybody else’s, and stayed in bounds. He may have taken Golden Tate’s roster slot, but he is not Golden Tate. 

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Good quote on the Lions/Patricia 4th quarter strategy: "The Lions stopped playing the Cardinals in the 4th quarter and their opponent changed to the clock."

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9 minutes ago, Jason_R said:

7. Will Agnew be returning punts next game?

I think Ty Johnson should probably be given a shot to return punts in the next game. Even beyond the muffed punt, Agnew wasn't very good. Maybe Johnson hasn't practiced it enough (or at all) to be put in a game yet. if that is the case, I think that's a mistake by the coaching staff.

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11 minutes ago, Jason_R said:

Observations...

1. Hock is a stud. If not for one of the major faults of the team yesterday — Decker’s poor play, Agnew’s muff, or coaching blunders — we would be talking about Hock’s historically great debut. 

2. Decker is clearly not the long term solution, and is even a short term problem. Is it possible to swap him and a mid-level draft pick for Trent Williams?

3. Justin Rogers noted that Dahl, Wiggins, and Glasgow were cycling in and out. Still no certainty on the OL. Apparently the brain trust is using September as an extension of training camp  

4. Flowers was invisible yesterday. Even his late face mask penalty I couldn’t see. 

5. I actually liked a lot of what Bevell did. It was hampered, again, by the OL, but how about Stafford on a naked bootleg? And designed roll outs? But Stafford gave them an earful after that time out. “TRUST ME!!!” Good. Teach the staff a lesson. 

6. Coach Rocket Scientist seemed to trust his defense to be aggressive against a rookie QB in the first half, then lost his trust in the second half. Bad idea. 

7. Will Agnew be returning punts next game?

8. Amendola forgot he was brought here to do his job. He tried to do everybody else’s, and stayed in bounds. He may have taken Golden Tate’s roster slot, but he is not Golden Tate. 

There were some plays where Flowers got into the backfield. I even noted it in this thread when it happened. He brought pressure and caused Arizona to have to hold. Flowers wasn't a high a sack guy. A lot of his contributions aren't easily seen. I want to see what the pass rush looks like against Philip Rivers. With Murray you can't go all out. You have to make sure to keep him contained or he will burn you with his legs. Rivers will be a statue so they can go all out. I'll be anxious to see what that looks like.

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I’m not going to bother complaining about going conservative at the end of the game. It’s already been tackled by just about everyone in Detroit.

I’m not even going to sit here and get mad about The Timeout. Weird things like that sometimes just happen. Darrell Bevell or Matt Patricia or whoever it was that actually called the timeout was fearful that a key third-and-5 was about to turn into a third-and-10. I can, at least, understand what happened there. Should the Lions have trusted Stafford in that moment? Of course, but I still can understand what happened.

What I want to focus on is the play directly after The Timeout. Good teams overcome unfortunate events. The Timeout was an unfortunate event, but the Lions were still in a brilliant position to win the game. Get a first down and the game is over.

But if you rewatch the next play, you can see the chaos on the side of the field. Coaches are literally jumping up and down in anger, the offense—yet again—barely gets to the line in time before the playclock runs out, and then this is the play they run:

This, to me, shows the Lions were completely unprepared for the biggest play of the game. The Timeout threw the Lions sideline into chaos, and everyone forgot the game was still happening. They drew up a half-assed play in a hurry, and Stafford just desperately heaved up a ball that had no chance of being complete.

This whole series of plays felt oddly familiar, and then it hit me. Lions-Cowboys playoff game.

The Lions get hit with an unfortunate event: the pass interference flag pickup. Instead of overcoming something that is just part of the game, Jim Caldwell fails to keep his foot on the gas, opting to punt on fourth-and-1 at Dallas’ 46-yard line.

And what happens next in both scenarios? Blocked/shanked punt, other team goes on to score game-winning/game-tying drive.

Being a good coaching staff isn’t about calling a perfect game. There is no such thing. Bad things are going to happen to your team on a weekly basis. But a good coaching staff remains calm and collective during those moments and overcomes them.

The Lions failed to do that on Sunday and it completely overshadowed what was actually a pretty solid debut from Darrell Bevell and much of the rest of the team.

https://www.prideofdetroit.com/2019/9/9/20856664/detroit-lions-week-1-report-card-poor-coaching-overshadows-solid-debut

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50 minutes ago, Jason_R said:

 

 

8. Amendola forgot he was brought here to do his job. He tried to do everybody else’s, and stayed in bounds. He may have taken Golden Tate’s roster slot, but he is not Golden Tate. 

Amendola had a terrific game despite that blunder. He was every bit as good as peak Tate in that game.

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8 minutes ago, NYLion said:

Amendola had a terrific game despite that blunder. He was every bit as good as peak Tate in that game.

Germaine Crowell had 9 receptions, 125 yards and a touchdown too in 2001 against the Vikings. A blunder like that pretty much erases everything positive you did that day.

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It is really frustrating because a number of players had really solid games (like Amendola) and a series of miscues basically makes it moot.

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BTW, 97.1 is AWESOME today. All of the SOL callers have come out of the woodwork and the hosts are talking non-stop Lions.

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