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2020 MLB Draft

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On 3/21/2020 at 2:15 AM, clark1mt said:

The point is to save money to reduce the financial hit being caused by not having a season.  The amount of money being saved by not having a draft will likely be far less than the amount of money being lost due to not having a season.

I think the MLB's financial hit by not playing may be increased by not having a draft.

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On 3/17/2020 at 8:24 AM, Longgone said:

Please, stop it. No one is arguing you'll get value of he doesn't hit. 

"Martin just offers value in other areas also."

As I said over and over and you keep ignoring, the other value doesn't matter at 1-1. Positional value loses a lot of the point at first overall because the only thing that matters is if the guy can hit. If he doesn't hit it really doesn't matter if he plays shortstop or first base, he'll be gone by year 7. 

And pick 20 sure your points make sense. 

And if Martin is the as good or better hitter than Tork we wouldn't have this conversation because of course you would take the .300/40/100 guy at shortstop over firstbaseman. But, we are having this conversation which shows that Martin's bat right now isn't as good as Tork. 

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23 minutes ago, Keepleyland2 said:

But, we are having this conversation which shows that Martin's bat right now isn't as good as Tork. 

Is there really that much certainty around this? The Tigers have been repeatedly fooled drafting power that couldn't cut it in the majors. They even have the distinction of having drafted the all time minor league HR champ that couldn't cut it in the majors. Moya, Stewart. It happens. We also have candidate guys who are hitting for high average at lower levels who may not make it either (Reyes, W. Castro). I think having to decide whether a slugger vs a guy you can't K (and does still have a  1100 OPS at his level)  is more likely to still be hitting usefully 3 levels up is by no means obvious.

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1 hour ago, Keepleyland2 said:

"Martin just offers value in other areas also."

As I said over and over and you keep ignoring, the other value doesn't matter at 1-1. Positional value loses a lot of the point at first overall because the only thing that matters is if the guy can hit. If he doesn't hit it really doesn't matter if he plays shortstop or first base, he'll be gone by year 7. 

And pick 20 sure your points make sense. 

Bull ****. Value is value, and it makes even more sense at the top of the draft, where the stakes are so high. Drafting based on one tool is just ignorant. It's like saying, "Just take the best fastball!" for a pitcher.

You can keep saying other value doesn't matter over and over, but that doesn't make it make sense. Torkelson's bat may be so good that his over all grade ranks him at the top, but that doesn't mean you ignore all other factors.

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56 minutes ago, Keepleyland2 said:

"Martin just offers value in other areas also."

As I said over and over and you keep ignoring, the other value doesn't matter at 1-1. Positional value loses a lot of the point at first overall because the only thing that matters is if the guy can hit. If he doesn't hit it really doesn't matter if he plays shortstop or first base, he'll be gone by year 7. 

And pick 20 sure your points make sense. 

And if Martin is the as good or better hitter than Tork we wouldn't have this conversation because of course you would take the .300/40/100 guy at shortstop over firstbaseman. But, we are having this conversation which shows that Martin's bat right now isn't as good as Tork. 

Why does defensive value matter at pick #20, but not pick #1.  That doesn't make sense to me.  I don't agree that the only thing that matters is that a guy can hit.  

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Well if they have a draft, which I think they will no matter, and there isn't any more college games played for evaluation Al Avila/ Tigers will be faced with choosing between their two favorite  options - Power and Vanderbilt players.

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2 minutes ago, socaltiger said:

Well if they have a draft, which I think they will no matter, and there isn't any more college games played for evaluation Al Avila/ Tigers will be faced with choosing between their two favorite  options - Power and Vanderbilt players.

It's hard to tell how much of the hype around Torkelson should be counted. That fact that you break Barry Bond's college record does not make you BB V2.0. Guys set college records all the time who don't end up excelling in the majors

If you ask me today to bet a nickle, I would put it on Martin. Avila often talks about liking athletic players. Ask me tomorrow I might change my mind. :D

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I think Martin might be the better hitter.  Not as much power, obviously, but strong OBP/SLG, coupled with an incredible eye at the plate.  Tork had 15 K's vs. 2 for Martin, with similar AB's.

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Tork also likely stretched his zone because he wasn't getting anything good to hit. He had extremely hi expectations for this year and may have swung at whatever he could. Sounds like Al knows which one he'll draft. I'll be ok with either.

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7 minutes ago, leflore said:

Tork also likely stretched his zone because he wasn't getting anything good to hit. He had extremely hi expectations for this year and may have swung at whatever he could. Sounds like Al knows which one he'll draft. I'll be ok with either.

Was gonna say the same thing.  When you're vying to go number 1 overall and the extra cash that goes with it all the while getting the Bonds treatment from opponents it may make you stretch your zone out and chase pitches you otherwise wouldn't.    Obviously without seeing each at bat and knowing what's going on in his head it's hard to say for sure if that's the case but I wouldn't just take his K stats at face value without atleast considering that. 

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50 minutes ago, leflore said:

Tork also likely stretched his zone because he wasn't getting anything good to hit. He had extremely hi expectations for this year and may have swung at whatever he could. Sounds like Al knows which one he'll draft. I'll be ok with either.

Absolutely a possibility. And that is where you need detailed reports of what these guys were doing under what circumstances. What was he swinging at and when?

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22 hours ago, Keepleyland2 said:

"Martin just offers value in other areas also."

As I said over and over and you keep ignoring, the other value doesn't matter at 1-1. Positional value loses a lot of the point at first overall because the only thing that matters is if the guy can hit. If he doesn't hit it really doesn't matter if he plays shortstop or first base, he'll be gone by year 7. 

I believe that at 1-1 .. it is vitally important to consider overall value at all facets on the baseball diamond.  HR power alone is not going to win a World Series.  The 2 most recent World Series Tigers prove that!  Gotta have excellent defense and speed.  If one player can provide all of that .. he will have more value.  

Additionally, at 1-1 .. I believe it is vitally important to consider Long-Term value.  Who is most likely to still retain top value when player nears FA status?  I believe a player who has the most overall skills retains the most value .. albeit hitting & power are foremost.  But again, excellent defense and base running provides additional valuable.

For explanation purposes, first let me say that I do not like the way some of the overall ratings are calculated.  For example, Tork could have a 65 value at power, 40 at speed, 50 at defense, and 60 at hitting ..which suggests an overall value of 53.75 ..but a certain site might have him rated at 55.  But then Martin might be rated 55 power, 55 hitting, 55 speed, and 55 fielding ..with a 55 overall rating.

Give me a guy that can hit 25 to 35 home runs and excel at all other aspects ..over a guy that can hit 33 to 43 home runs but is just average or below at the other aspects.

Pick one of the following two players at his peak:  Victor Martinez or Alan Trammell?

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https://theathletic.com/1698397/2020/03/24/mlb-and-the-players-association-debate-details-of-the-amateur-draft/

All this speculation is kinda making me nervous.  Owners suggesting postponing the draft till next year and just combining the classes.  There's also talk of shortening the draft to possibly 3 rounds this year and giving out smaller bonus pools.  

Ultimately these are just talks at this point and things probably won't change much but it does make me a little uneasy at this point. 

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Again...comparing the Torquemaster...an elite prospect...to the middling stiffs like Stewart, Moya and the rest is completely unfair.  He us a far more highly rated prospect than any of them

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10 hours ago, Lei Pong said:

Again...comparing the Torquemaster...an elite prospect...to the middling stiffs like Stewart, Moya and the rest is completely unfair.  He us a far more highly rated prospect than any of them

I agree. When I read quotes from college coaches calling him a "generational talent," that leads me to believe there is something different about his swing, demeanor and sound of the ball off his bat. Doesn't mean there still isn't a risk. I'll be happy with either Tork of Martin. I just hope there is a draft, and that Al doesn't go in a different direction. We all know this draft is huge, with 1-1 and 4 of the top 85 picks 

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Just thinking .. IF they postpone the draft until next year .. what other players available next year might be a better choice than any of Torkelson, Martin, or Hancock?

 

I could look it up.

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10 minutes ago, Tigrrfan said:

Just thinking .. IF they postpone the draft until next year .. what other players available next year might be a better choice than any of Torkelson, Martin, or Hancock?

 

I could look it up.

kumar!

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once we have a better idea of when baseball could resume, it would be great to institute a combine-approach, like the NFL, allowing both college and high schoolers to participate in drills and exhibition games to help better inform the scouting community.  The devil's in the details, but I'd love to follow the coverage.

If they even need it.

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3 hours ago, Tenacious D said:

once we have a better idea of when baseball could resume, it would be great to institute a combine-approach, like the NFL, allowing both college and high schoolers to participate in drills and exhibition games to help better inform the scouting community.  The devil's in the details, but I'd love to follow the coverage.

If they even need it.

They have enough scouting data to draft, later in the process is health, character and signing requirements.

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Not really sure what type of impact this is gonna have positively or negatively for the Tigers but atleast as of now it looks like there is gonna be a draft this year. 

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"Likely 10 rounds, possibly 5"

 Sucking the fun out of everything.

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4 hours ago, Tenacious D said:

what happens to college eligible players who don't get drafted?  free agent frenzy?

I would think so

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