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6/11 @8:15 Detroit Tigers at Kansas City Royals

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1 hour ago, IdahoBert said:

This series might be our chance to pick up another win. 

Another top pick would probably still be a safe bet at 25 and 137

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For the life of me, I cannot imagine why anybody would have any expectation of success for this franchise as long as the current owner/GM combo is in place.

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6 hours ago, IdahoBert said:

This series might be our chance to pick up another win. 

I would hope they can pick up 1 win out of the 3 games.

The last game of the series is in Ameritrade Park in Omaha (nice area).

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2 hours ago, sabretooth said:

For the life of me, I cannot imagine why anybody would have any expectation of success for this franchise as long as the current owner/GM combo is in place.

Right now this franchise is cutting ties with an entire generation to whom a sense of affection for this team would otherwise be passed. They are not in the seats now, and their own children will not be in the seats in the future. It’s really a disgraceful way to treat a legacy such as this.  

The torch constantly needs to be passed from one generation to the next and right now that’s not happening.  You need to be bit when you’re young, and for all sorts of kids that’s not happening.  

Rightly or wrongly I blame Avila for this far less than the ownership. I think he’s mostly just working within the parameters he’s been given. 

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25 minutes ago, IdahoBert said:

Right now this franchise is cutting ties with an entire generation to whom a sense of affection for this team would otherwise be passed. They are not in the seats now, and their own children will not be in the seats in the future. It’s really a disgraceful way to treat a legacy such as this.  

The torch constantly needs to be passed from one generation to the next and right now that’s not happening.  You need to be bit when you’re young, and for all sorts of kids that’s not happening.  

Rightly or wrongly I blame Avila for this far less than the ownership. I think he’s mostly just working within the parameters he’s been given. 

I'm not so sure on this one.

Did generations forego Cubs fandom when they suffered decades of futility?

Did the Tigers lose a generation in the 70s when they sucked while transitioning from the 68 stars to the 84 team?

The minute they start winning the fans will be back, the ratings will be back and the bandwagon will be full again.   That's the way it always has been and I see no reason to doubt it's the way it will be.

 

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30 minutes ago, IdahoBert said:

Right now this franchise is cutting ties with an entire generation to whom a sense of affection for this team would otherwise be passed. They are not in the seats now, and their own children will not be in the seats in the future. It’s really a disgraceful way to treat a legacy such as this.  

The torch constantly needs to be passed from one generation to the next and right now that’s not happening.  You need to be bit when you’re young, and for all sorts of kids that’s not happening.  

Rightly or wrongly I blame Avila for this far less than the ownership. I think he’s mostly just working within the parameters he’s been given. 

At least we have the back half of Cabrera's hall of fame contract to keep us tuned to the games.

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2 hours ago, sabretooth said:

For the life of me, I cannot imagine why anybody would have any expectation of success for this franchise as long as the current owner/GM combo is in place.

My level of confidence in this combo is very low. To lose a lot of games and get high draft picks as a result doesn’t take a lot of creativity. I’m anxious to see how Avila pulls this calamity together and creates a winning team.

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I think most other owner / GM combos would be doing the same sorts of things.  Obviously there would be some differences but I am thinking they would mostly be on the margins.

In any event, I don't view the situation as dire as sabre / 1776 paints.

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34 minutes ago, Mr. Bigglesworth said:

I think most other owner / GM combos would be doing the same sorts of things.  Obviously there would be some differences but I am thinking they would mostly be on the margins.

In any event, I don't view the situation as dire as sabre paints.

The conventional take is like Posner's I guess, but I think he has it wrong. I think Avila knows enough about the baseball draft to understand that most years there isn't a spit's worth of difference in the value of any of the top ~10 picks. Look through the drafts over the careers of the current players - say from around Verlander forward, and what you see that you get an impact player out of roughly half the top ten picks and the best career could be pretty much any one of them. There is actually more variation in yield of top players year to year than by draft position in top 3rd of the 1st round. If I'm a GM and I understand that, I'm aiming to put a team on the field that wins about 1/2 their home games (maybe ~75 win total range) so I don't gut my fan interest and my revenue but still pick high enough to keep the a rebuild going. Which is I think exactly what Avila attempted by spending more offseason money than a team would have if they were looking for nothing but the worst record. They have been done in mostly by pitcher's injuries, but also by the loss of Mercer and for all intents and purposes Cabrera and Castellanos. This is having the effect of putting them into an unintended full tank mode - probably no better than the third worst record,  but I don't think that was the original plan. However it does make it easy to snipe at Avila about it appearing that he didn't know what kind of team he intended to put on the field this season (a la Posner)

 But all it really means is that C. Ilitch was willing to risk spending a little more in a rebuilding year than the minimum he had to get one more decent draft. Why is that a bad thing?

The jury is still out on this org but it's not because of the team on the field this year. It's not because this org is not modernizing. It's because the book isn't written yet on almost any of their top 30 prospect list since Al took over.

Long run, if you are going to have injury dominated years - I'll take having them when I didn't expect to win a division and count it as banked Karma. Not to mention that any FO stuck with Zimmermann's and Cabrera's contracts starts out of the gate looking looking foolish for reasons beyond their control.

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1 hour ago, Mr. Bigglesworth said:

I think most other owner / GM combos would be doing the same sorts of things.  Obviously there would be some differences but I am thinking they would mostly be on the margins.

In any event, I don't view the situation as dire as sabre paints.

I agree.  I am not optimistic, but I am not hopeless either.  This does not feel like a Randy Smith situation where there was no plan and every top draft pick was a disaster.  

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5 minutes ago, tiger337 said:

I agree.  I am not optimistic, but I am not hopeless either.  This does not feel like a Randy Smith situation where there was no plan and every top draft pick was a disaster.  

I sort of agree but I also think the competition is better.  In Smith's era I suspect most orgs were doing it the same way, at the same pace... now with the expansion of information, data. technology... organizations are realizing there's always a better way and some strive to find it.  So the gap will be greater to catch up.

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If the Tigers were to double the HR total of their current team leader, then magically get Yelich, Bellinger and Trout's HR total on top of that they would still have less than the Twins do right now.   Amazing. 

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3 hours ago, IdahoBert said:

Right now this franchise is cutting ties with an entire generation to whom a sense of affection for this team would otherwise be passed. They are not in the seats now, and their own children will not be in the seats in the future. It’s really a disgraceful way to treat a legacy such as this.  

The torch constantly needs to be passed from one generation to the next and right now that’s not happening.  You need to be bit when you’re young, and for all sorts of kids that’s not happening.  

Rightly or wrongly I blame Avila for this far less than the ownership. I think he’s mostly just working within the parameters he’s been given. 

It's been two years. Settle down

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50 minutes ago, Shelton said:

Imagine if sportz were still allowed to post here. 

I will pre-ignore his profile.

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4 hours ago, LooseGoose said:

I'm not so sure on this one.

Did generations forego Cubs fandom when they suffered decades of futility?

Did the Tigers lose a generation in the 70s when they sucked while transitioning from the 68 stars to the 84 team?

The minute they start winning the fans will be back, the ratings will be back and the bandwagon will be full again.   That's the way it always has been and I see no reason to doubt it's the way it will be.

 

Their badge of identification was suffering. It was a making lemonade out of lemons thing. It was the glue that held them together.  It’s an entirely different situation. 

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2 hours ago, Keepleyland2 said:

It's been two years. Settle down

The thing that worries me is that none of my four children are fans or really even enjoy the game even though they all went through T-ball voluntarily before losing interest.  None of them of course had even an index finger’s worth of talent, but neither did I and that didn’t stop me. 

It’s not like taking them to local minor-league baseball games would do it  when they’ve had three different parent clubs in the last 20 years. 

Taking them to one of the cathedrals of the game is where something lasting occurs.  Miss out on that at a tender age and it could never occur. They might end up thinking that football is their favorite show. 

Multiply this thing that is not happening many times over and a real dent is made in the trans-generational knit of cultural identification with the team. 

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