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3 minutes ago, Tigrrfan said:

You obviously did not even consider where I said that Chris may want to fix the entire organization first AND have a solid core of young home-grown talent in place before spending big money.

Still, thinking your going to fix issues with buying talent is foolhardy.  Teams are signing their young talent, and keeping players more these days.  The top players don't make it to free agency.  Those in free agency often have warts.  That's for the Nick Castellanos's of baseball.

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45 minutes ago, Tigrrfan said:

You obviously did not even consider where I said that Chris may want to fix the entire organization first AND have a solid core of young home-grown talent in place before spending big money.

The #1 example of what you're saying would be Darrell Evans being signed to complement that core of homegrown talent.

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1 hour ago, cruzer1 said:

Still, thinking your going to fix issues with buying talent is foolhardy.  Teams are signing their young talent, and keeping players more these days.  The top players don't make it to free agency.  Those in free agency often have warts.  That's for the Nick Castellanos's of baseball.

Show me a successful team that is 100% homegrown talent. The ALL fix issues by buying some talent. This is a silly post. 

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49 minutes ago, Yoda said:

Show me a successful team that is 100% homegrown talent. The ALL fix issues by buying some talent. This is a silly post. 

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I just noticed that Detroit's team leader for RBI's is Miguel Cabrera,.....with 36 RBI total,. Some of you have argued that the RBI is an obsolete statistic, because, as a team dependent figure, it's possible for a very good hitter to not get very many RBI opportunities. This clearly is not the case with our Tigers, there are no  current great Tigers hitters  who are just "more unlucky than bad" missing out on golden opportunities. 

The RBI is a great indicator of (team)  offensive prowess, after all. 

The Tigers really suck by the way, I just thought I might need to mention that for anyone who is sick of hearing it.

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On 7/12/2019 at 7:01 PM, DumberAndLeaner said:

I just noticed that Detroit's team leader for RBI's is Miguel Cabrera,.....with 36 RBI total,. Some of you have argued that the RBI is an obsolete statistic, because, as a team dependent figure, it's possible for a very good hitter to not get very many RBI opportunities. This clearly is not the case with our Tigers, there are no  current great Tigers hitters  who are just "more unlucky than bad" missing out on golden opportunities. 

The RBI is a great indicator of (team)  offensive prowess, after all. 

The Tigers really suck by the way, I just thought I might need to mention that for anyone who is sick of hearing it.

The thing is, Cabrera is hitting over .400 with RISP, and yet still only has 36 RBI.

That tells me two things:

1.  He does not get many chances to hit with guys on base

2.  When he does get hits with guys on base, it is usually a single that may score one run.  Very limited power, in the past he would hit 2 run doubles, 3 run home runs, now, he will hit maybe an RBI single.

Also, the Tigers as a whole, and Miggy for sure do not get to use the new and improved baseballs that the rest of the league gets to use.

Or, as a I have said a lot, and others have also said, they have limited hitting talent, and that talent is not adjusting to the current landscape of the game these days.  They definitely need a new direction for their hitting approach from the top of the organization to the bottom.  

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28 minutes ago, Mr. Bigglesworth said:

How many AB does he have with RISP?

Cabrera's RBI % is 18.2. Not bad, but nothing like it has been in the past when he was ususally top 10 in baseball. For this season he is 39th on the list for those with over 100 runners on base.

https://www.baseballmusings.com/cgi-bin/RBIPCT.py?StartDate=04%2F04%2F2019&EndDate=07%2F13%2F2019&SortField=1.0*(OnRBI.RBI-OnRBI.HRs)%2FOnRBI.RunnersOn&SortDir=desc&MinPA=100

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1 hour ago, Gehringer_2 said:

Cabrera's RBI % is 18.2. Not bad, but nothing like it has been in the past when he was ususally top 10 in baseball. For this season he is 39th on the list for those with over 100 runners on base.

https://www.baseballmusings.com/cgi-bin/RBIPCT.py?StartDate=04%2F04%2F2019&EndDate=07%2F13%2F2019&SortField=1.0*(OnRBI.RBI-OnRBI.HRs)%2FOnRBI.RunnersOn&SortDir=desc&MinPA=100

Looking at that chart, he is 110th in number of runners available to be scored.  That is really low for a guy who has played over 90% of his teams games.

Here are the Tigers splits with RISP:

k Name G GS PA AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI SB CS BB SO BA
OBP SLG OPS TB GDP HBP SH SF IBB ROE BAbip tOPS+ sOPS+
1 Miguel Cabrera 52   82 71 16 32 3 0 1 32 0 0 7 10 .451 .476 .535 1.011 38 1 0 0 4 2 0 .484 169 159
2 Brandon Dixon 38   54 50 11 16 2 0 2 22 1 0 2 15 .320 .333 .480 .813 24 0 0 0 2 0 0 .400 121 105
3 Harold Castro 20   27 22 7 6 1 0 0 8 1 0 3 5 .273 .333 .318 .652 7 0 0 0 2 0 1 .316 83 68
4 Christin Stewart 47   67 56 17 15 4 0 2 23 0 0 5 9 .268 .313 .446 .760 25 1 1 0 5 2 0 .260 115 91
5 Nicholas Castellanos 49   70 59 40 15 2 1 2 18 0 0 8 10 .254 .343 .424 .767 25 2 1 0 2 1 1 .265 93 95
6 Victor Reyes 6   8 8 4 2 1 0 0 3 0 0 0 1 .250 .250 .375 .625 3 0 0 0 0 0 0 .286 79 57
7 Dawel Lugo 12   16 14 5 3 0 2 1 7 0 0 0 5 .214 .250 .714 .964 10 0 1 0 1 0 0 .222 233 133
8 JaCoby Jones 35   52 45 20 9 2 0 2 12 1 0 6 16 .200 .288 .378 .666 17 1 0 0 1 2 1 .250 77 69
9 Dustin Peterson 11   16 15 3 3 1 0 0 5 1 0 0 5 .200 .250 .267 .517 4 1 1 0 0 0 0 .300 74 33
10 Ronny Rodriguez 35   51 46 9 9 5 1 0 14 0 0 2 15 .196 .216 .348 .564 16 1 0 0 3 0 0 .265 67 41
11 Jeimer Candelario 33   50 43 14 8 0 0 0 7 1 0 5 13 .186 .300 .186 .486 8 0 2 0 0 1 1 .267 51 29
12 Niko Goodrum 51   81 71 33 13 4 0 1 19 1 0 8 21 .183 .259 .282 .541 20 1 0 0 2 0 0 .235 57 39
13 John Hicks 38   60 56 7 10 4 0 0 10 1 0 3 17 .179 .217 .250 .467 14 2 0 0 1 0 1 .250 69 19
14 Grayson Greiner 31   50 44 6 7 0 0 1 8 0 0 4 18 .159 .240 .227 .467 10 2 1 0 1 0 0 .231 85 21
15 Bobby Wilson 7   8 8 1 1 0 0 0 2 0 0 0 2 .125 .125 .125 .250 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 .167 53 -36
16 Gordon Beckham 29   36 34 13 4 2 0 1 5 1 0 0 16 .118 .167 .265 .431 9 1 2 0 0 0 0 .176 26 8
17 Josh Harrison 25   38 35 8 3 2 0 0 7 1 0 0 8 .086 .105 .143 .248 5 0 1 0 2 0 0 .103 2 -37
18 Jordy Mercer 12   19 16 3 1 0 0 0 2 0 0 3 7 .063 .211 .063 .273 1 1 0 0 0 1 1 .111 6 -25
19 Mikie Mahtook 3   6 5   0 0 0 0 0 0  

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Here are the even uglier numbers with 2 outs and RISP, the Tigers are at .188 as a team, as opposed to .223 with just RISP

k Name G GS PA AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI SB CS BB SO BA
OBP SLG OPS TB GDP HBP SH SF IBB ROE BAbip tOPS+ sOPS+
1 Miguel Cabrera 23   24 21 3 8 2 0 0 7 0 0 3 2 .381 .458 .476 .935 10 0 0 0 0 0 0 .421 149 148
2 Victor Reyes 5   6 6 1 2 1 0 0 2 0 0 0 1 .333 .333 .500 .833 3 0 0 0 0 0 0 .400 139 118
3 Dawel Lugo 7   10 10 3 3 0 2 1 6 0 0 0 3 .300 .300 1.000 1.300 10 0 0 0 0 0 0 .333 344 228
4 Brandon Dixon 25   27 26 6 7 0 0 1 8 1 0 1 8 .269 .296 .385 .681 10 0 0 0 0 0 0 .353 87 79
5 Harold Castro 15   17 15 3 4 0 0 0 4 1 0 2 3 .267 .353 .267 .620 4 0 0 0 0 0 0 .333 77 67
6 JaCoby Jones 25   31 25 3 6 2 0 1 9 1 0 6 10 .240 .387 .440 .827 11 0 0 0 0 2 1 .357 123 119
7 Ronny Rodriguez 20   21 20 6 4 1 1 0 5 0 0 1 7 .200 .238 .350 .588 7 0 0 0 0 0 0 .308 76 54
8 John Hicks 22   27 27 5 5 2 0 0 5 1 0 0 6 .185 .185 .259 .444 7 0 0 0 0 0 0 .238 58 16
9 Nicholas Castellanos 28   31 29 13 5 0 0 1 7 0 0 2 5 .172 .226 .276 .502 8 0 0 0 0 1 0 .174 26 32
10 Grayson Greiner 21   26 24 4 4 0 0 1 5 0 0 1 12 .167 .231 .292 .522 7 0 1 0 0 0 0 .273 105 38
11 Dustin Peterson 4   6 6 1 1 1 0 0 2 1 0 0 2 .167 .167 .333 .500 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 .250 65 29
12 Bobby Wilson 5   6 6 1 1 0 0 0 2 0 0 0 2 .167 .167 .167 .333 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 .250 104 -11
13 Jordy Mercer 7   9 7 1 1 0 0 0 2 0 0 2 3 .143 .333 .143 .476 1 0 0 0 0 1 1 .250 82 32
14 Niko Goodrum 31   39 36 13 5 1 0 0 6 0 0 3 13 .139 .205 .167 .372 6 0 0 0 0 0 0 .217 9 0
15 Christin Stewart 27   32 29 7 4 1 0 1 7 0 0 3 8 .138 .219 .276 .495 8 0 0 0 0 1 0 .150 41 30
16 Gordon Beckham 14   17 16 9 2 2 0 0 2 1 0 0 8 .125 .176 .250 .426 4 0 1 0 0 0 0 .250 25 12
17 Jeimer Candelario 17   20 17 4 2 0 0 0 2 1 0 2 6 .118 .250 .118 .368 2 0 1 0 0 0 0 .182 16 2
18 Josh Harrison 15   18 18 4 1 0 0 0 1 1 0 0 4 .056 .056 .056 .111 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 .071 -53 -70
19 Mikie Mahtook 2   2 2   0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 .000 .000 .000 .000 0 0 0 0 0 0 0      

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On Friday, July 12, 2019 at 7:01 PM, DumberAndLeaner said:

I just noticed that Detroit's team leader for RBI's is Miguel Cabrera,.....with 36 RBI total,. Some of you have argued that the RBI is an obsolete statistic, because, as a team dependent figure, it's possible for a very good hitter to not get very many RBI opportunities. This clearly is not the case with our Tigers, there are no  current great Tigers hitters  who are just "more unlucky than bad" missing out on golden opportunities. 

The RBI is a great indicator of (team)  offensive prowess, after all. 

The Tigers really suck by the way, I just thought I might need to mention that for anyone who is sick of hearing it.

RBIs are very much a function of opportunities.  Once upon a time they were hugely overrated -- such as when Don  Mattingly won the 1985 MVP award on the strength of a gaudy 145 RBI total, over George Brett, who outhit Mattingly by a considerable margin.  (A seething Bill James, a Royals fan, did a computer plug-in of Brett's season into Mattingly's spot in the Yankees batting order and the computer gave Brett something like 175 RBIs.)

Also, are you sure that the Tigers really suck?  Have you done a computer simulation to prove the truth of that assertion?

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On 7/14/2019 at 5:09 PM, six-hopper said:

 

Also, are you sure that the Tigers really suck?  Have you done a computer simulation to prove the truth of that assertion?

I'm getting ready to buy a scoreboard message at Comerica Park,  telling Chris Ilitch how much the Tigers suck. Care to chip in a few bucks?  📉

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26 minutes ago, DumberAndLeaner said:

I'm getting ready to buy a scoreboard message at Comerica Park,  telling Chris Ilitch how much the Tigers suck. Care to chip in a few bucks?  📉

I'm willing to contribute as I'm quite certain he remains unaware and a scoreboard message might blow the lid off the conspiracy of silence.   Perhaps start a GoFundMe?

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2 hours ago, LooseGoose said:

 quite certain he remains unaware and a scoreboard message might blow the lid off the conspiracy of silence.   

It is imperative to taunt the wealthy about their failures, otherwise they pretend that no one has noticed. 

I'll bet such a scoreboard message would get a more positive crowd reaction than a Niko Goodrum bobblehead

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I still believe a Beth Bernstein bobblehead will fill the park.

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We all know of the Tigers struggles to score runs this year, but they absolutely the worst, by far, with RISP.  Is it due to them being young?  Being poor hitters?  (miggy is hitting over .400 with RISP)  Poor approach?  Not clutch?  Whatever it is, this is a telling stat, as they are hitting .215 with RISP, the 29th place team is at .240.  That is a huge gap

Rk Team G GS PA AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI SB CS BB SO BA
OBP SLG OPS TB GDP HBP SH SF IBB ROE Roe BAbip tOPS+ sOPS+
1 NYY 112   1078 915 459 273 45 3 48 428 11 2 120 223 .298 .376 .511 .887 468 28 9 7 26 13 4   .336 116 124
2 COL 110   1105 949 439 276 72 12 42 421 8 0 111 248 .291 .360 .525 .885 498 19 8 8 28 18 8   .341 125 123
3 BOS 115   1215 1019 456 290 67 8 33 427 20 4 151 247 .285 .371 .463 .834 472 27 7 7 31 27 16   .334 105 112
4 CIN 109   973 820 337 232 42 5 32 321 14 3 96 209 .283 .364 .463 .827 380 32 21 13 22 19 6   .333 125 110
5 MIN 112   1054 899 408 251 58 3 44 385 7 2 102 200 .279 .352 .497 .849 447 29 16 4 31 11 8   .302 104 114
6 LAD 113   1133 932 417 258 52 5 41 401 18 0 137 224 .277 .366 .475 .842 443 20 16 11 37 32 10   .308 108 113
7 TEX 110   1100 927 420 257 55 11 36 392 40 4 113 271 .277 .355 .477 .832 442 13 18 6 35 13 10   .337 116 110
8 PIT 112   1121 960 399 264 64 5 43 392 8 0 116 206 .275 .354 .486 .841 467 30 13 10 21 32 7   .302 123 112
9 WSN 112   1127 919 418 249 55 6 41 386 21 4 148 220 .271 .374 .478 .852 439 27 20 13 27 23 13   .304 122 116
10 ARI 112   1135 946 418 255 57 8 38 396 20 2 133 216 .270 .358 .467 .825 442 25 16 7 33 23 11   .299 114 109
11 KCR 112   1073 914 362 244 47 7 28 338 47 8 105 217 .267 .342 .426 .768 389 23 14 12 28 12 13   .310 117 95
12 ATL 111   1114 940 395 249 44 5 37 376 12 2 128 232 .265 .353 .440 .794 414 31 14 7 25 28 6   .305 101 101
13 NYM 113   1079 925 367 242 50 4 32 347 8 3 112 242 .262 .347 .428 .775 396 34 19 4 19 22 13   .313 106 97
14 SFG 108   1022 874 349 229 60 6 27 338 7 6 101 215 .262 .336 .437 .773 382 27 11 6 30 17 9   .305 121 96
15 CHW 107   961 825 326 215 42 1 29 306 20 4 92 245 .261 .335 .419 .754 346 28 10 15 19 9 11   .326 115 92
16 SEA 113   1069 912 372 235 46 8 36 356 16 3 109 269 .258 .336 .444 .780 405 17 13 4 30 5 8   .312 107 97
17 SDP 110   882 742 314 191 33 2 36 301 14 5 98 201 .257 .340 .453 .793 336 28 9 6 27 14 3   .291 115 101
18 PHI 111   1075 902 360 232 59 3 20 335 19 5 131 242 .257 .353 .396 .749 357 18 13 8 20 35 10   .321 103 92
19 CHC 111   1014 825 373 211 46 6 38 352 13 7 141 212 .256 .361 .464 .825 383 36 11 9 28 27 7   .287 112 109
20 HOU 113   1126 937 397 240 60 4 45 384 15 2 129 228 .256 .336 .473 .808 443 39 7 4 47 8 12   .274 95 104
21 OAK 114   997 849 374 216 49 1 37 340 14 0 102 210 .254 .336 .445 .781 378 37 16 2 28 11 13   .284 105 98
22 LAA 114   1112 919 390 233 43 4 38 368 7 1 134 192 .254 .347 .433 .780 398 44 17 1 36 18 11   .269 104 98
23 BAL 111   1003 863 339 217 43 2 35 318 25 7 94 236 .251 .325 .428 .752 369 15 10 14 22 6 10   .296 111 91
24 TBR 113   1126 979 371 246 52 7 34 345 22 7 104 275 .251 .328 .423 .751 414 28 18 5 20 12 6   .307 98 90
25 STL 110   972 812 324 202 36 3 27 296 31 3 110 216 .249 .338 .400 .738 325 24 12 13 25 14 11   .295 106 88
26 MIA 111   926 806 297 200 43 3 20 285 7 3 69 230 .248 .311 .383 .694 309 25 16 9 26 11 8   .309 111 76
27 MIL 114   1042 864 347 212 36 2 40 333 37 5 135 247 .245 .346 .431 .776 372 28 11 5 26 33 5   .285 103 97
28 CLE 111   1065 874 362 213 42 3 28 333 23 6 128 217 .244 .338 .395 .733 345 20 14 15 34 23 11   .279 97 87
29 TOR 112   962 834 321 200 36 4 32 301 14 2 92 243 .240 .314 .408 .721 340 23 7 8 20 7 4   .290 100 83
30 DET 108   999 884 271 190 39 4 18 251 11 0 73 254 .215 .278 .329 .607 291 23 14 1 27 11 7  

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What is the opposite of RISP?  NRISP?  RNISP?  0RSIP?  ZRISP?

Anywho, my guess is the Tiger hitters suck in that circumstance as well.

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36 minutes ago, Casimir said:

What is the opposite of RISP?  NRISP?  RNISP?  0RSIP?  ZRISP?

Anywho, my guess is the Tiger hitters suck in that circumstance as well.

I'll posit that few here have ever been in scoring position.

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I swing for the fences and have an insanely high K rate.  

  • Haha 1

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32 minutes ago, Mr. Bigglesworth said:

****.  I am a Punch and Judy hitter and I still strikeout.

I am too, but I still swing for the fences and still strikeout.  

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