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bobrob2004

Fire Ron Gardenhire

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21 minutes ago, bobrob2004 said:

I never said anything about bringing someone up from AAA. I never even said anything about sending Rodriguez back to AAA. I just think that given his poor performance recently warrants less playing time.  Gardenhire is the one that makes up the lineup. Rodriguez isn't the only player on the 25 man roster that he can put at SS.  

I don't want this team to just go through the motions. This year doesn't matter, so who cares. That's not the attitude they should have. If you're not going to utilize Gardenhire's experience, get rid of him.  

You referenced candelario being sent to AAA and questioned why Ronny would be treated differently, so get out here with that weak “I never said x, y, z” crap. 

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5 minutes ago, Tigrrfan said:

bobrob .. you actually sound a bit bitter.

Of course I'm bitter.  Everything we were told about Gardenhire is a lie.  

"He won't tolerate sloppy play!"

"He now uses Sabermetrics!"

Gardenhire's quote: "Who says we have to lose?"

I don't want to be lied to anymore.  

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Then fire AA first ..only because cannot fire the owner (first.)

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6 minutes ago, Shelton said:

You referenced candelario being sent to AAA and questioned why Ronny would be treated differently, so get out here with that weak “I never said x, y, z” crap. 

Fine.  But I never specifically mentioned Willi Castro.  Not only do they other options on the 40-man, but Harold Castro was already up here once, so he should be higher up on the pecking order.  At least for the time being.  

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13 minutes ago, bobrob2004 said:

Of course I'm bitter.  Everything we were told about Gardenhire is a lie.  

"He won't tolerate sloppy play!"

"He now uses Sabermetrics!"

Gardenhire's quote: "Who says we have to lose?"

I don't want to be lied to anymore.  

IMHO ..that inexcusable effort by JJones when he stopped running on a dropped popup when he could have been safe if he kept running ..is a far more flagrant baseball no-no than incompetent fielding by their primary offensive weapon this year (R. Rodriguez!) 

Ray Oyler could not hit home runs ..and so nobody expected him to.

Similarily, Ronnie Rodriguez is a very poor fielder (fielding & decision making).  That is beyond anything Ron G can help him with.

As for not playing Ronnie  ..of all Tiger players with 100 or more PA's ..he leads the 'offense' starved team in Home Runs & SLG ..and is second on the team in RBI, XBH, & OPS!  Over the Tigers last 30 games ..he leads in RBI's.  Truth is, ..more folks would have been complaining about Ron NOT playing him.  Sometimes it takes an unwelcome amount of time to unwrap an entire package.

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14 minutes ago, bobrob2004 said:

Everything we were told about Gardenhire is a lie.  

Really? 

"Everything"???

I beg to differ!

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19 hours ago, bobrob2004 said:

It's not about winning. It's about the basics, the fundamentals. Gardenhire isn't doing what he was hired to do. So, fire him.  

The majority of these players and our current manager will not be here in 2021. The next window opens in a year or two.  Chill the F out, man. 

 

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20 minutes ago, bobrob2004 said:

Of course I'm bitter.  Everything we were told about Gardenhire is a lie.  

"He won't tolerate sloppy play!"

"He now uses Sabermetrics!"

Gardenhire's quote: "Who says we have to lose?"

I don't want to be lied to anymore.  

Better stop following professional sports teams then.  I wish I had whatever life you do that you're able to get so worked up about a baseball team. 

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12 minutes ago, Tigrrfan said:

inexcusable effort by JJones when he stopped

Yeah - JaCoby is a guy whose concentration does lapse and that is something a good manager can hopefully work on. Not only not running out the pop but loss of concentration on some one hoppers in the OF under the glove. Those shouldn't happen.

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6 minutes ago, thefunk said:

The majority of these players and our current manager will not be here in 2021. The next window opens in a year or two.  Chill the F out, man. 

 

Why do you assume that I'm not chill? 

Do you remember the amount of hate there was for Ausmus?  I'm not even halfway at that point yet. 

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5 minutes ago, bobrob2004 said:

Why do you assume that I'm not chill? 

Do you remember the amount of hate there was for Ausmus?  I'm not even halfway at that point yet. 

So we have that to look forward to then

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Not to sound like a dick, but *every" team does some level of PR.  We are being lied to daily in any number of facets of life, but somehow Ron is the bridge too far.

 

I don't think the Tigers, or Ron, really lied to anyone.  JMO

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1 hour ago, kdog said:

to give the fans someone to blame before they turn their wrath on the general manager.

The way I meant it was that it gives the fans a recognizable name they can have faith in. I know a lot of people who were thrilled that Ron Gardenhire was hired. 

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8 minutes ago, Mr. Bigglesworth said:

Not to sound like a dick, but *every" team does some level of PR.  We are being lied to daily in any number of facets of life, but somehow Ron is the bridge too far.

Yes.  Like I mentioned earlier, there needs to be some level of accountability.  Gardenhire isn't doing the job the way that was expected, so fire him.  

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Whose expectations are Gardy not fulfilling? I can guarantee he's meeting the goals his bosses have given him.

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2 minutes ago, bobrob2004 said:

Yes.  Like I mentioned earlier, there needs to be some level of accountability.  Gardenhire isn't doing the job the way that was expected, so fire him.  

Doing the job the way it was expected by whom? 

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I expected poor play and a lot of losses, so gardenhire has exceeded my expectations. Extend him. 

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28 minutes ago, Shelton said:

Doing the job the way it was expected by whom? 

yes - the key distinction.

Bottom line I like Gardenhire. Give him good players and he is going to win with the best of them. If anything you can fault the Tigers for dumping good managers for  flashy ones too often (Drunkard and notorious pugilist BIlly Martin? Seriously?) . Seriously, I would bet Less Moss would have won as  many games as Sparky did if you had given him Roger Craig to handle the pitchers. Sparky was a great character and a great guy (and a great front for a not so great organization and baseball in general) but without players he lost games and mismanaged pitchers with the best of them - maybe as over-rated as any manager in history. HeII, Phil Garner probably could have won the WS with the Big Red Machine. There are bad managers who don't have the talent to do it well (Trammell, Garner), good managers who never had the horses (Buddy Bell), successful managers who could win with talent - which is most of the ones we consider good ones - I would put Gardenhire in that group. Then there are just a few managers who actually force people to rethink things - LaRussa, Madden, very, very few of them.

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12 minutes ago, kdog said:

Whose expectations are Gardy not fulfilling? I can guarantee he's meeting the goals his bosses have given him.

Go back to my very first post here.  No sloppy play.  Using Sabermetics.  These are the promises that we were told and are not being used.  

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13 minutes ago, bobrob2004 said:

Go back to my very first post here.  No sloppy play.  Using Sabermetics.  These are the promises that we were told and are not being used.  

They shift a lot and have changed the lineup some. You can't sabermetric a good team out of garbage. Bad teams are sloppy...it's a talent/depth issue.

95% of the issues you have are with Gardy's bosses. 

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23 minutes ago, Shelton said:

I expected poor play and a lot of losses, so gardenhire has exceeded my expectations. Extend him. 

They are on a pace for 102 losses which is more than I expected, but I doubt it would be different with any other manager.

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8 minutes ago, tiger337 said:

They are on a pace for 102 losses which is more than I expected, but I doubt it would be different with any other manager.

And there can still be a big swing either way in the quality of play the rest of the way. At the extremes, they could move Nick and Boyd and Greene and replace them with young guys who fail to perform and end up any number of games worse, or they might call up Manning, Rogers, Castro - have them all play well and play the last couple of months around 450. Projecting from this line-up makes assumptions with a good chance of being violated.

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5 minutes ago, kdog said:

They shift a lot and have changed the lineup some. You can't sabermetric a good team out of garbage. Bad teams are sloppy...it's a talent/depth issue.

 

It's not about wins/losses.  It's the little things.  Errors on routine plays.  Running into outs, etc.  If you want to disagree that these things happen due to lack of talent as opposed to lack of fundamentals, then ok.  But I see lack of fundamentals and that's something I was promised wouldn't happen under Gardenhire.  

 

Quote

95% of the issues you have are with Gardy's bosses. 

Sure, I have issues with Avila and Ilitch too.  That's another rant for another day.  

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3 minutes ago, bobrob2004 said:

 

It's not about wins/losses.  It's the little things.  Errors on routine plays.  Running into outs, etc.  If you want to disagree that these things happen due to lack of talent as opposed to lack of fundamentals, then ok.  But I see lack of fundamentals and that's something I was promised wouldn't happen under Gardenhire.  

 

Sure, I have issues with Avila and Ilitch too.  That's another rant for another day.  

Who promised you that a lack of fundamentals wouldn’t happen?

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1 hour ago, bobrob2004 said:

I never said anything about bringing someone up from AAA. I never even said anything about sending Rodriguez back to AAA. I just think that given his poor performance recently warrants less playing time.  Gardenhire is the one that makes up the lineup. Rodriguez isn't the only player on the 25 man roster that he can put at SS.  

I don't want this team to just go through the motions. This year doesn't matter, so who cares. That's not the attitude they should have. If you're not going to utilize Gardenhire's experience, get rid of him.  

When Gardy puts Cabrera at SS, we can call for Gardy's head. But everything else he does with this 2019 roster is meaningless. Well, maybe he can tell his players to hit, catch, pitch and throw the ball better? 🤔😂🤣

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