Jump to content

Sydney_Fife

Game 82: Pistons @ Knicks

Recommended Posts

7 minutes ago, 313DetroitCity said:

Or this front office hits on the 15th pick (where Giannis & Kawhi were drafted) and things change completely. 

But yeah, nothing can happen to fix this team. Stuck forever. 

I actually like what the front office has done thus far but it's going to be more of that the next few years, pecking away at the dead weight as the big contracts lose term and it'll be imperative to hit on a draft pick or two. Ultimately, for a market like Detroit, they have to develop their own high end talent or find a few diamonds in the rough through trade (Billups and Wallace for example). Do NOT overspend on mediocre free agents when the cap space frees up. Commit to a plan one way or the other, no middle ground like what SVG did.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I cant even express how terrible of an idea it is to tread water while waiting for bad contracts to come off the books.  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, Deleterious said:

I cant even express how terrible of an idea it is to tread water while waiting for bad contracts to come off the books.  

Or you can do what the Lakers did and trade D'Angelo Russell and sell the terrible Mozgov contract. That seems to have worked out for them.

Cap room does nothing for Detroit.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Casimir said:

Of course there have been enjoyable moments.

Honest questions:  Where does this team logically go from here?  Is it wrong to wish for a better path for the Pistons?

Good thing "fans" do not need to be logical to follow/root for the team.

My wish:  This playoff experience lights a fire, they play well together maybe eek out one game, work hard in the offseason, focus on defense, make a push next year and maybe make some hail mary trade/deal at the end of the year to make them a 3-4 seed or something.  Maybe winning 50 games.  Go from there.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, 313DetroitCity said:

They play their best in this playoff series and get valuable playoff experience for the young guys.

They draft well with the 15th pick and make a few moves to gain more assets (like they did in getting Svi, a 2nd round pick & Thon Maker).

They don't take on additional salary and see if they can get 1 year rentals to make themselves a 5 or 6 seed. 

They wait for Jackson/Leuer/Galloway to come off the books in 2020. 

We all want the Pistons to do better. But it is tiresome to have people say "why bother they suck and will always suck and there is no path forward" nonstop. You have an All-NBA talent on your roster & a guy who is an All-Star level player next to him. As a small market team that can't attract free agents, you take that and see if your FO can figure out the rest combination of players around them. 

The "we have no way to get better" stuff is overblown. We have all future draft picks and money coming off the books after next year. That gives you a shot. 

LOVE this.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 minutes ago, Deleterious said:

I cant even express how terrible of an idea it is to tread water while waiting for bad contracts to come off the books.  

There's no other choice.  I mean, try to unload Reggie if possible, but I don't see any other realistic solution in the short term. The one thing I'd really like to see this offseason is them re-signing Ish, letting him go would be a big mistake.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, kdog said:

Or you can do what the Lakers did and trade D'Angelo Russell and sell the terrible Mozgov contract. That seems to have worked out for them.

Cap room does nothing for Detroit.

 

I will wait while you show me where I said a single word about cap room.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, NYLion said:

There's no other choice.  I mean, try to unload Reggie if possible, but I don't see any other realistic solution in the short term. The one thing I'd really like to see this offseason is them re-signing Ish, letting him go would be a big mistake.

Do not bring Ish back.  He helps you win games and then you end up where you are now.  Smoked in the playoffs without a good draft pick. 

A first or second year player should be the backup.  Someone to lose games with while he learns the position so he might be ready in 3-4 years, someone you develop.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Signing Reggie Jackson, Galloway, and Leuer kill your cap. That was done by the previous coach/gm. Trading for Blake Griffin further clogs up the salary structure.

Griffin is a good player and if he stays healthy that means you'll have a reasonably competitive team. They moved some peripheral pieces around and weakened themselves in the process. But they put themselves below the tax and got 2 guys who are signed for next year(+ a second round pick) and didn't trade their first round pick. The mistakes have already been made how do you actually unwind the clock and start tanking?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
35 minutes ago, Deleterious said:

I cant even express how terrible of an idea it is to tread water while waiting for bad contracts to come off the books.  

You can either do that or trade your bad contract for other bad contracts.

The path forward for this team is to make moves on the margins this off-season. Draft well, develop your young players (Brown, Thomas, Svi, Kennard), try to trade for younger players and see what happens.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, Deleterious said:

Do not bring Ish back.  He helps you win games and then you end up where you are now.  Smoked in the playoffs without a good draft pick. 

A first or second year player should be the backup.  Someone to lose games with while he learns the position so he might be ready in 3-4 years, someone you develop.  

I don't want Ish signed to a long term deal. We know where he is and what he brings. In fact, I don't want any vet sign to a long term deal. Do what you did with GR3 this off-season. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Making the playoffs isn't an affirmation that they have a direction or that Tom Gores is super smart. It's just a thing that happened at the end of the season. And they didn't burden themselves with another toxic asset on already terrible balance sheet. Gores gets a few playoff gates and they move onto the draft process.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, 313DetroitCity said:

I think its clear that Gores cares. And if your boss cares and is evaluating you, I think you have to care as well. 

Gores wanting to make the playoffs and being ok with the risk of missing as part of a longer term strategy are not necessarily incompatible views.

Alternately, if the FO truly thought they were putting their careers at risk by trading Bullock, they probably wouldn't have.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Deleterious said:

I cant even express how terrible of an idea it is to tread water while waiting for bad contracts to come off the books.  

What is the least terrible approach to getting out of this pickle, in your opinion?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Deleterious said:

Or it shows just how much Pistons fans overvalue Bullock.  

Pistons fans, and also the lakers. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Mr. Bigglesworth said:

If Gores let himself be talked into Griffin by SVG to then fire SVG 3 or 4 months later, man, I just don't know.  At a minimum I'd suggest he hadn't learned much as a owner after however many years it has been.

OTOH, if the thought is SVG didn't want to talk Gores out of Griffin (or simply couldn't), but he is willing to listen to his staff now, not sure what I make of that.

We'll know in 3 years or something.

Hard to say which straw stirred that griffin drink. 

Like you said, SVG may have pushed for the griffin deal. Maybe he sold it as a great move to Gores and convinced him it would work out. Maybe he sold a bunch of other bull****. Maybe Gores saw the contract and questioned giving up the pick and Tobias but SVG had answers for it. 

When it didn’t work out, I could easily see Gores feeling like he was sold a bag of beans that didn’t have the promised magic, and that’s what cost SVG his job. All it might take is saying “you hired me to do this job, you have to trust me” and Gores trusted him and SVG failed. 

Allowing the griffin trade and then firing SVG months later doesn’t bother me.

If Gores pushed for it, and SVG allowed it without pushing back, that’s almost as bad if I’m Gores.

In either case, a team president/GM can’t make that move and expect to keep his job. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
34 minutes ago, Shelton said:

Pistons fans, and also the lakers. 

He has a lot more value to a team with Lebron as a spot up shooter than a team like Detroit.  They also gave up nothing to get him.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
36 minutes ago, Mr. Bigglesworth said:

What is the least terrible approach to getting out of this pickle, in your opinion?

Hire Hinkie and let him do his thing.

Year 1 would have just finished up.  They would have been in the Zion sweepstakes.  Probably about the same timeline as waiting on bad deals to come off the books.  Except you would be coming off that time period with a couple of high draft picks already on your team.  But hey, when Reggie and Leuer expire they will have a 32 year old Griffin and a 28 year old Drummond.  So they have that going for them.

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Mr. Bigglesworth said:

Do you think they can find takers for Drummond and Griffin?

Not if you want value back.  But I don't want value, I want to be terrible and draft high in the lottery.  

So yeah, you can trade both of those guys for teams terrible contracts.  You could probably even pull a heavily protected first round pick or two for them if the contracts coming back are bad enough.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Mr. Bigglesworth said:

Do you think they can find takers for Drummond and Griffin?

I guess, that is another way of saying acquiring Griffin really screwed up their chances to do that type of rebuild.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There is nothing wrong waiting on Reggie and company to get off the books.  But holy ****, don't do that while being .500.  Do it sucking so you are stockpiling assets and ready to hit the ground running when those deals do expire.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Deleterious said:

Not if you want value back.  But I don't want value, I want to be terrible and draft high in the lottery.  

So yeah, you can trade both of those guys for teams terrible contracts.  You could probably even pull a heavily protected first round pick or two for them if the contracts coming back are bad enough.  

I would be fine with letting both walk if there were some way to do that.  And I think both have good value as players, simply not enough to command their salary and they don't fit what I think a realistic timeframe is for the team.

By terrible contracts, I presume you mean expirings or 2-years remaining?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Deleterious said:

There is nothing wrong waiting on Reggie and company to get off the books.  But holy ****, don't do that while being .500.  Do it sucking so you are stockpiling assets and ready to hit the ground running when those deals do expire.  

I don't disagree at all, but once they got Griffin, I think it got harder to pull off.

Or are you saying trading Drummond and Griffin for players with slightly shorter contracts but guys who can't actually play, because performance is essentially a negative.  Of course, a potential trading partner might also *value* crap play for the same reason.

They should trade for Josh Smith.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Deleterious said:

Not if you want value back.  But I don't want value, I want to be terrible and draft high in the lottery.  

So yeah, you can trade both of those guys for teams terrible contracts.  You could probably even pull a heavily protected first round pick or two for them if the contracts coming back are bad enough.  

I think that’s a good approach. Feels like it could be hard to find a deal terrible enough in return to get a protected pick back in return. I hope they try. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...