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2019 Tiger Prospects

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3 hours ago, kdog said:

Cameron is probably a souped up defensive version of Rogers. He's better defensively but will probably struggle with making contact. Paredes has less than zero defensive value right now. And Greene is 2+ years away if he is on a standard trajectory.

Parades does not have the range or agility for short, but he's fine at third, especially with more experience.

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7 hours ago, Edman85 said:

A lot of it came from Emily, so probably the latter.

Minor league catching metrics are meh, but the ones on BP that attempt to factor framing and controlling the running game in never really had him as elite.

I want to modify this. They had him as elite in Erie last year.

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Is there any data on how catcher framing in the minors translates to the majors?  

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12 hours ago, chasfh said:

If Greene is on a standard trajectory, he's at least four years away. He's two years away if he's on an accelerated superstar trajectory.

given how he has performed once he was promoted out of rookie ball, do you think he is on the path to superstardom?

me neither.

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12 hours ago, tiger337 said:

Is there any data on how catcher framing in the minors translates to the majors?  

I am willing to be convinced that I am mistaken, but as I see it, the "skill" involved in catcher framing is the ability to fool an umpire.  So unless there are certain pitches or locations that all umpires can be fooled about, it seems like it would be difficult for this to translate not only from minors to majors, but across the same leagues, regardless of level.  

Really the skill is manipulating a person.  Bring on trackman or whatever.

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unless it can't be done effectively, I'd like to see an AI approach to calling balls and strikes.  Hitting and pitching at the MLB level is hard enough--it sucks when it's impacted by ****ty umping.

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9 hours ago, Buddha said:

given how he has performed once he was promoted out of rookie ball, do you think he is on the path to superstardom?

 

The answer to your question may depend upon what the definition of "superstardom" actually is. 

How many players in MLB are actual 'superstars'?  Is a 'superstar' just another All-Star type player ..of which each team always has at minimum at least one player elected every year?  Is a 'superstar' just another star-type player ..or is a 'superstar' clearly above and beyond the star-type players?

Personally, I would consider a 'superstar' to be a player who has demonstrated potential Hall of Fame productivity.

With that said, ..why does a competitive team absolutely need a superstar?  Did the KC Royals have a bonafide 'superstar' when they won the 2015 World Series?  Or did they have several star-type players complemented with a lot more very good players?

The Erie Seawolves may already have several potential future star-type players.  Time will tell.

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2 hours ago, theroundsquare said:

I am willing to be convinced that I am mistaken, but as I see it, the "skill" involved in catcher framing is the ability to fool an umpire.  So unless there are certain pitches or locations that all umpires can be fooled about, it seems like it would be difficult for this to translate not only from minors to majors, but across the same leagues, regardless of level.  

Really the skill is manipulating a person.  Bring on trackman or whatever.

Framing isn't just about fooling an umpire to get a ball called as a strike. It's also about properly receiving those pitches on the edges of the strike zone -- that are actually strikes in the first place -- to insure they are called strikes by the umpire. Improperly receiving those pitches can result in them being called balls at times. That's more a skill than the manipulation of a person.

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1 minute ago, Microline133 said:

Framing isn't just about fooling an umpire to get a ball called as a strike. It's also about properly receiving those pitches on the edges of the strike zone -- that are actually strikes in the first place -- to insure they are called strikes by the umpire. Improperly receiving those pitches can result in them being called balls at times. That's more a skill than the manipulation of a person.

Yes, it's about smoothly receiving them as if they were meant to be there as opposed to jerky movements at the ball to catch it.

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6 minutes ago, Microline133 said:

Framing isn't just about fooling an umpire to get a ball called as a strike. It's also about properly receiving those pitches on the edges of the strike zone -- that are actually strikes in the first place -- to insure they are called strikes by the umpire. Improperly receiving those pitches can result in them being called balls at times. That's more a skill than the manipulation of a person.

So, it might be better named "pitch receiving".  

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On 9/5/2019 at 11:56 PM, Buddha said:

given how he has performed once he was promoted out of rookie ball, do you think he is on the path to superstardom?

me neither.

What the **** prospect were you watching?

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48 minutes ago, Longgone said:

Their first years are comparable, and Kelenic didn't make it out of rookie ball.

Good point. And if Greene has a 20/20 900 ops or similar 2nd year I'd put him in the same place as Kelenic. I'm hopeful Greene will be a very good Tiger some day. 

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On 9/7/2019 at 5:32 PM, Keepleyland2 said:

What the **** prospect were you watching?

the one who had a 619 ops in a ball, what the **** prospect were you watching?

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On 9/7/2019 at 6:42 PM, leflore said:

Good point. And if Greene has a 20/20 900 ops or similar 2nd year I'd put him in the same place as Kelenic. I'm hopeful Greene will be a very good Tiger some day. 

It's too bad the season ended when it did. Greene definitely scuffled when he got to WM, but he was heating up at the end with 10 hits in his last nine games and 10 total bases in this last 3.

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1 hour ago, Gehringer_2 said:

It's too bad the season ended when it did. Greene definitely scuffled when he got to WM, but he was heating up at the end with 10 hits in his last nine games and 10 total bases in this last 3.

If history is any guide, he'll probably do well at WM next year and continue a gradual rise through the organization.  

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2 hours ago, Buddha said:

the one who had a 619 ops in a ball, what the **** prospect were you watching?

The 18 year who smashed rookie ball and posted a top 10 OPS at Low A. 

But, hey focus on the fact he had a .619 OPS in a league where he was the youngest guy. Good thing Royce Lewis OPS .665 in a league higher and Luis Robert .614 OPS in AAA are gonna suck too. That will help

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56 minutes ago, Keepleyland2 said:

The 18 year who smashed rookie ball and posted a top 10 OPS at Low A. 

But, hey focus on the fact he had a .619 OPS in a league where he was the youngest guy. Good thing Royce Lewis OPS .665 in a league higher and Luis Robert .614 OPS in AAA are gonna suck too. That will help

I get it.  He plays for your favorite team and is therefore going to be the next great superstar the game has ever seen.

I hope you're right.

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On 9/5/2019 at 11:56 PM, Buddha said:

given how he has performed once he was promoted out of rookie ball, do you think he is on the path to superstardom?

me neither.

After 208 plate appearances of rookie ball, the 18 year Greene has not put up superstar numbers in A- or A ball.

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Worrying about Greene's "trajectory" three months after he signed is reactionary nonsense. Bordering on gobbledygook if not outright crazy drunk talk

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I think its possible that his 208 PAs above rookie ball being not superstar quality and that his future still being bright can both happen at the same time.

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13 minutes ago, Lei Pong said:

Worrying about Greene's "trajectory" three months after he signed is reactionary nonsense. Bordering on gobbledygook if not outright crazy drunk talk

I could go for some drunk talk right about now.

Really I just want to drink.

I probably have a problem with alcohol.

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22 minutes ago, Mr. Bigglesworth said:

I could go for some drunk talk right about now.

Really I just want to drink.

I probably have a problem with alcohol.

Can't consume it at work?  Same here.  Stupid rules.

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1 hour ago, Lei Pong said:

Worrying about Greene's "trajectory" three months after he signed is reactionary nonsense. Bordering on gobbledygook if not outright crazy drunk talk

Saying hes not on a superstar tractectory based strictly on numbers so far is a fact.  It doesnt mean that he wont be a superstar though.  FWIW, I think its reasonable to doubt this about all 18 year olds not named Mike Trout.

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