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The Tigers Hitting Thread

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Yeah, I wouldn't mind them cutting Martinez and bringing up someone like Aducci whose development wouldn't be of much concern, but the way Stewart has hit the last few weeks doesn't have me wanting to rush him up right away.

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1 minute ago, Mr. Bigglesworth said:

The other thing is Cabrera general inability to stay on the field makes replacing Martinez with Hicks a non starter right now.

and I wouldn't be surprised to see Miguel right back on the DL. His AB since coming back argue he is nowhere near 100%. Hamstrings seem almost impossible for some baseball players to get over during a season.

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As for left field defense, it is simply not true that defense there doesn’t matter. A run saved in left is just as valuable as a run saved in center, right, or shortstop. 

Jones has saved 5 runs in left over 300+ innings this year. He has saved 3 runs in center over 150+ innings. You put Stewart out there, how many runs is he costing you over 300 innings? 5? That’s a 10 run difference. Would his bat have made up for that? Maybe. It’s sifficult to say but there is a real defensive value difference between Stewart and jacoby in left, enough that you need to be confident that Stewart will hit enough and field well enough to be a net positive relative to jones, and for it to be significant enough to bother making a change vs allowing Stewart to continue developing. 

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7 minutes ago, 4hzglory said:

And if they didn't release Ramirez, and he played roughly 3/4 of the remainder of the season, he would be under contract for over $20 mil in 2019.   Take away that part of the equation, and I don't think Ramirez is released.

Is that a fact? I had no idea. I thought he was released as signed for the minimum, and I thought when a guy was released his vesting option conditions were voided. 

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5 minutes ago, Shelton said:

As for left field defense, it is simply not true that defense there doesn’t matter. A run saved in left is just as valuable as a run saved in center, right, or shortstop. 

Jones has saved 5 runs in left over 300+ innings this year. He has saved 3 runs in center over 150+ innings. You put Stewart out there, how many runs is he costing you over 300 innings? 5? That’s a 10 run difference. Would his bat have made up for that? Maybe. It’s sifficult to say but there is a real defensive value difference between Stewart and jacoby in left, enough that you need to be confident that Stewart will hit enough and field well enough to be a net positive relative to jones, and for it to be significant enough to bother making a change vs allowing Stewart to continue developing. 

And that's the bottom line, really.

It isn't a given that Stewart is better on balance despite claims to the contrary, and Christin will play every day in Toledo until he demonstrates he can be an average fielder and/or a spot opens up.  The Tigers believe it is the best thing for his development, and I will defer to it.  I have no experience or reason to believe their rationale is wrong.

They keep their OF flexibility should a trade for Martin presents itself.  Plus I think they value run prevention with their marginal pitchers.

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4 minutes ago, Shelton said:

As for left field defense, it is simply not true that defense there doesn’t matter. A run saved in left is just as valuable as a run saved in center, right, or shortstop. 

Jones has saved 5 runs in left over 300+ innings this year. He has saved 3 runs in center over 150+ innings. You put Stewart out there, how many runs is he costing you over 300 innings? 5? That’s a 10 run difference. Would his bat have made up for that? Maybe. It’s sifficult to say but there is a real defensive value difference between Stewart and jacoby in left, enough that you need to be confident that Stewart will hit enough and field well enough to be a net positive relative to jones, and for it to be significant enough to bother making a change vs allowing Stewart to continue developing. 

here is another angle: I have no idea if this is in Avila's mind, but consider that you have a lot of bad pitchers that you have to get through a lot of innings. Maybe under those conditions having the best defense you can put in the OF so you have a chance to even get through games at all becomes even more important than scoring runs on the offensive side.

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11 minutes ago, Mr. Bigglesworth said:

The other thing is Cabrera general inability to stay on the field makes replacing Martinez with Hicks a non starter right now.  Unless you bring up Adduci or something.

The option of bribing up Adduci should be a mother****ing starter imho

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Just now, Shelton said:

The option of bribing up Adduci should be a mother****ing starter imho

I am all about the Deuce.

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1 minute ago, Mr. Bigglesworth said:

Beat G2 to the post on that point.

I type slow!

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You can not bribe the deuce.  There is nothing you can offer that he can't get by himself.  

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2 minutes ago, Gehringer_2 said:

I type slow!

I could definitely see it if they value d over o with that rotation.

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2 hours ago, Mr. Bigglesworth said:

You don't get that line of thinking because nobody is making it.  It is a strawman argument.

Really? Because it seems the entire thread's take on Victor is "who cares, no one else is that much better and the team isn't winning anything anyway, so let him finish the season"

He sucks and has no future, dump him. Play Goodrum every day or Hicks every day if you don't think Stewart is ready. The idea that there aren't superior alternatives is laughable.

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Victor sucks, has no future, yet they don't have superior options.  Hooray system.

And, yeah, who cares because no one else is much better, presuming they are better because the team sucks anyway.

72 wins.  73 wins.  71 wins.  What difference does it make?  Is 100 extra Niko Goodrum or Adduci or even Stewart AB really going to make them something more than they will be?

I mean, I get the angst - I really do.  And I think there is a point to be made.  But at some point it just becomes wankering about something that will have minimal impact short or long term.

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I think when they have someone they want to see play in Det, Victor will be gone in a heartbeat. But guys like Goodrum and Adduci are not in the Tigers' long term plans anyway, they don't care about seeing their ABs, they are just roster filler. Avila doesn't care about whether they play or not.

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On 6/11/2018 at 4:13 PM, Mr. Bigglesworth said:

They haven't done it because they do not perceive a benefit in releasing Martinez now.

Or ..they are quite inept.

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45 minutes ago, Tigrrfan said:

Or ..they are quite inept.

They have 6 regulars hitting under .200 with RISP, that is the definition of inept, and that does not include tonights 0-10.

Player: RISP

Player: RISP
Rk Name G GS PA
AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI SB CS BB SO BA OBP SLG OPS TB GDP HBP SH SF IBB ROE BAbip tOPS+ sOPS+
  Team Total 66   689 594 205 140 38 4 10 195 5 0 72 144 .236 .317 .364 .681 216 18 6 2 15 11 7 .286 93 87
1 Victor Martinez 48   77 61 8 10 3 0 0 16 0 0 13 9 .164 .299 .213 .512 13 1 0 0 3 3 1 .182 58 43
2 Nick Castellanos 41   76 69 20 23 2 0 1 25 0 0 5 19 .333 .395 .406 .801 28 1 2 0 0 2 0 .449 92 121
3 Jeimer Candelario 42   66 57 22 14 5 0 1 15 0 0 9 18 .246 .348 .386 .734 22 0 0 0 0 0 0 .342 76 101
4 Jose Iglesias 41   63 55 18 16 4 1 0 20 1 0 4 7 .291 .344 .400 .744 22 2 1 2 1 0 2 .327 117 104
5 JaCoby Jones 43   63 57 18 10 3 1 0 10 2 0 3 19 .175 .222 .263 .485 15 3 1 0 2 0 0 .250 53 33
6 Dixon Machado 41   60 51 16 9 5 0 0 15 0 0 6 8 .176 .283 .275 .558 14 0 2 0 1 0 0 .205 104 54
7 James McCann 35   55 48 14 8 1 0 1 15 0 0 5 10 .167 .236 .250 .486 12 3 0 0 2 0 2 .179 49 34
8 Leonys Martin 35   50 46 27 7 1 0 1 13 1 0 4 14 .152 .220 .239 .459 11 1 0 0 0 0 0 .194 17 26
9 John Hicks 31   44 40 15 13 2 0 2 18 0 0 3 11 .325 .364 .525 .889 21 4 0 0 1 0 0 .393 132 141
10 Miguel Cabrera 24   42 30 13 9 4 0 1 19 0 0 11 6 .300 .476 .533 1.010 16 2 0 0 1 4 0 .333 139 177
11 Niko Goodrum 25   36 32 14 12 5 0 3 13 0 0 4 8 .375 .444 .813 1.257 26 1 0 0 0 1 1 .429 231 237
12 Mikie Mahtook 11   17 12 3 2 1 0 0 4 1 0 3 5 .167 .294 .250 .544 3 0 0 0 2 1 0 .222 125 51
13 Victor Reyes 13   14 14 11 2 0 2 0 4 0 0 0 4 .143 .143 .429 .571 6 0 0 0 0 0 0 .200 114 50
14 Pete Kozma 8   12 11 3 1 1 0 0 3 0 0 1 1 .091 .167 .182 .348 2 0 0 0 0 0 1 .100 46 -4
15 Grayson Greiner 6   7 5 1 3 1 0 0 4 0 0 1 2 .600 .571 .800 1.371 4 0 0 0 1 0 0 .750 303 272
16 Ronny Rodriguez 4   6 5 2 1 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 2 .200 .167 .200 .367 1 0 0 0 1 0 0 .250 258 0
17 Warwick Saupold 1   1 1   0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 .000 .000 .000 .000 0 0 0 0 0 0 0     -100

 

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1 hour ago, Tigrrfan said:

Or ..they are quite inept.

I don't think they are inept (at least relative to the fan base), but even if that is true, their ineptitude would be the reason they do not perceive a benefit.

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Posted this in the GDT, but feel this is a more appropriate place for it:

It is going to be really hard for this team to score runs the rest of the year.  They are last in the AL in home runs (and fading farther and farther behind), with RISP they , have 6 regular players hitting under .190, with their team leader in plate appearances bringing up the rear at .156 (with a .491 OPS).  With the bases loaded the team is hitting .185 as a team, and with RISP and 2 outs, they are hitting .204 coming into today, with their leading plate appearance (by far)hitting .154 with a .205 SLG, plus 5 regulars under .200 BA, 3 under, 154, and one at .038 BA.

This team can get its share of chances it seems, but they really struggle to get that big hit, and dont hit many home runs (when they do hit them, it seems as if they are usually solo shots), especially with runners on base.

That makes it seem as if runs are going to be really challenging all year for the team.

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1 hour ago, kj2018 said:

Posted this in the GDT, but feel this is a more appropriate place for it:

It is going to be really hard for this team to score runs the rest of the year.  They are last in the AL in home runs (and fading farther and farther behind), with RISP they , have 6 regular players hitting under .190, with their team leader in plate appearances bringing up the rear at .156 (with a .491 OPS).  With the bases loaded the team is hitting .185 as a team, and with RISP and 2 outs, they are hitting .204 coming into today, with their leading plate appearance (by far)hitting .154 with a .205 SLG, plus 5 regulars under .200 BA, 3 under, 154, and one at .038 BA.

This team can get its share of chances it seems, but they really struggle to get that big hit, and dont hit many home runs (when they do hit them, it seems as if they are usually solo shots), especially with runners on base.

That makes it seem as if runs are going to be really challenging all year for the team.

Forget all that gargle - this team is gritty.  

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7 hours ago, LooseGoose said:

Forget all that gargle - this team is gritty.  

I agree, and ....

they are better then we think

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1 minute ago, kj2018 said:

I agree, and ....

they are better then we think

But are they fun to watch?

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1 minute ago, Shelton said:

But are they fun to watch?

you tell me.  I am enjoying this team, except when i want to complain about their lack of power, their lack of hitting with RISP and about Victor in general.

All that aside, i have enjoyed this years team WAAAAY more than the past 3-4 years.  They battle, grind, and allow me to enjoy watching them

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