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Brian

So it seems Victor Martinez had locker room issues

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Hard to be a leader as a full-time DH, when you can't run and you suck.

Victor needs to be gone. At this point, with the heart condition and $18M at stake, it's simply a matter of figuring out how. Tigers don't want him and I doubt he wants to play for a 100 loss team. I suspect we end up paying the full $18M to get rid of him. All he has to do is show up and complete ST, or get a doctor's note that says he can't play anymore.

Note that the article is wrong tho, JV did not (at least definitively) flip Victor the bird.

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3 minutes ago, Who is the Drizzle? said:

Hard to be a leader as a full-time DH, when you can't run and you suck.

Victor needs to be gone. At this point, with the heart condition and $18M at stake, it's simply a matter of figuring out how. Tigers don't want him and I doubt he wants to play for a 100 loss team. I suspect we end up paying the full $18M to get rid of him. All he has to do is show up and complete ST, or get a doctor's note that says he can't play anymore.

Note that the article is wrong tho, JV did not (at least definitively) flip Victor the bird.

I always thought is hard to confirm that there was a bird in the hand.  It just looked like a normal, run of the mill, "whatever" typ of hand gesture.

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It did not look like he flipped him off.  It also does not seem like something Verlander would do pubilcy.  He often puts his glove up to his face when he swears (or was that Porcello?).  

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7 hours ago, sabretooth said:

Thank goodness we had Brad around to keep the team together.  Hope we get another respected leader like him.

Not sure how a single declining vet being a sour a-hole reflects poorly on Ausmus. There's no indication that any conflicting factions were formed in the locker room as a result of Victor's attitude, only that Victor withdrew from the team. How's that on Ausmus?

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I have some problems with this article.   Suggesting a trade?  Really?   Unless the Tigers fork over 17.5 million that is not happening.    Retire?   Sorry, he's not leaving 18 million on the table - and I wouldn't either.   There is only one option - Cut him loos and Pay heem.......Pay thyat mayn hees mahney.   

 

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9 hours ago, cruzer1 said:

I think the best for all sides is to not pass him medically if he doesn't retire.

That should be what happens, but I wonder if there is a possible situation there where if he were to clear medically, can he be held back due to health? 

Martinez is not a useful baseball player any longer.  That DH slot is going to see Cabrera's name it more often from here on out.  For those two reasons alone, the Tigers should not have him on the roster next season.

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Heart issues cause different reactions. I’ve known friendly people to become angry old men after heart surgery. Maybe some sort of reaction to his meds, on top of frustration over his declining abilities.

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3 hours ago, CMRivdog said:

Heart issues cause different reactions. I’ve known friendly people to become angry old men after heart surgery. Maybe some sort of reaction to his meds, on top of frustration over his declining abilities.

Interesting theory. 

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10 minutes ago, drownwithyou said:

I vote catapult 

I thought you were a book reader. I vote trebuchet. 

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12 minutes ago, drownwithyou said:

I take a hard stance against trebuchet memes

There are trebuchet memes?

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18 minutes ago, Shelton said:

There are trebuchet memes?

 

15 minutes ago, Who is the Drizzle? said:

 

let's please stop right here i don't like where this is going.

Sorry Drizzy I can't help myself.... this took over Reddit for a few months it was one of the most confusing things to me: https://www.reddit.com/r/trebuchetmemes/

I will step away from the meme topic to allow actual VMart discussion now, apologies.

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5 hours ago, CMRivdog said:

Heart issues cause different reactions. I’ve known friendly people to become angry old men after heart surgery. Maybe some sort of reaction to his meds, on top of frustration over his declining abilities.

Hmm....  Well I guess I am overdue on the heart issues.

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On 9/26/2017 at 7:18 PM, holygoat said:

Not sure how a single declining vet being a sour a-hole reflects poorly on Ausmus. There's no indication that any conflicting factions were formed in the locker room as a result of Victor's attitude, only that Victor withdrew from the team. How's that on Ausmus?

No indication of factions?  I'd say having a very influential latin player go rogue is a pretty good indication of major problems....whether it manifested itself in the form of factions or something else, I don't know.

A manager should be able to wield influence over the team and especially the FO, beyond filling out lineup cards.  If your clubhouse is ripping itself to pieces, you need to hold people accountable (including the GM, and sometimes especially the GM) to to help straighten things out.  This could include bringing in players/coaches who will serve as a "check" on the clubhouse issues, and/or if things really get dicey, you may have to run a guy out of town. 

In Victor's case I realize running him out of town sounds nearly impossible given the loyalty of the owner and $$ being spent and total absence of any trade value....but if the team is underperforming your job as Manager is to push buttons, and that includes the GM's buttons to make changes, including sometimes the extremely difficult.  The alternative is to fail and lose your job, as Brad has.

Now strawman Brad could say "hey I'm leaving with no enemies, I can get another job, this is better than going to war with Victor, and possibly failing and getting fired, then having my conflict with Victor and his peeps turn my reputation in the league inside-out."  This is a legit perspective, and maybe that's where it landed....

.....but in any case, if Victor was the lead cancer in the clubhouse, then it sounds like Ausmus did lose the clubhouse....and keeping the clubhouse is one of the main jobs of the successful manager.  So I think in that context Brad has to be held accountable for a major clubhouse failure.

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8 minutes ago, sabretooth said:

No indication of factions?  I'd say having a very influential latin player go rogue is a pretty good indication of major problems....whether it manifested itself in the form of factions or something else, I don't know.

A manager should be able to wield influence over the team and especially the FO, beyond filling out lineup cards.  If your clubhouse is ripping itself to pieces, you need to hold people accountable (including the GM, and sometimes especially the GM) to to help straighten things out.  This could include bringing in players/coaches who will serve as a "check" on the clubhouse issues, and/or if things really get dicey, you may have to run a guy out of town. 

In Victor's case I realize running him out of town sounds nearly impossible given the loyalty of the owner and $$ being spent and total absence of any trade value....but if the team is underperforming your job as Manager is to push buttons, and that includes the GM's buttons to make changes, including sometimes the extremely difficult.  The alternative is to fail and lose your job, as Brad has.

Now strawman Brad could say "hey I'm leaving with no enemies, I can get another job, this is better than going to war with Victor, and possibly failing and getting fired, then having my conflict with Victor and his peeps turn my reputation in the league inside-out."  This is a legit perspective, and maybe that's where it landed....

.....but in any case, if Victor was the lead cancer in the clubhouse, then it sounds like Ausmus did lose the clubhouse....and keeping the clubhouse is one of the main jobs of the successful manager.  So I think in that context Brad has to be held accountable for a major clubhouse failure.

wow that's quite a rant based on article that said jv flipped him the bird.

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36 minutes ago, Who is the Drizzle? said:

wow that's quite a rant based on article that said jv flipped him the bird.

I don't usually do conspiracy theory, but when I do, I drink Dos Equis.

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