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If not Ausmus then who?

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Gammons:

Who takes the job. One of the Red Sox executives who was in on the interviews after the 2012 season, called Ausmus’ interview the best he’d ever seen; had Farrell not gotten free of Toronto, he’d have been the manager. Brad grew up in Cheshire, Ct. a Red Sox fan. His mother grew up less than a mile from, Fenway, between the homesteads where Sam Kennedy and Theo Epstein were raised. He was hired by Dombrowski and has a good relationship with him. He calls Gene Lamont “the best baseball mind I’ve ever been around,” and Lamont, his bench coach, goes back with Dombrowski to Jim Leyland days; when Larry Lucchino hired Bobby Valentine, Lamont was runner-up and planned to make Ausmus his bench coach. David Price thinks Ausmus is the best manager for whom he’s ever played. Brad and his parents have adjoining houses in Dennis. One daughter is at Dartmouth, the other will be in college in New York next fall. His minor league manager was Brian Butterfield, one of the most important persons they have.

Clayton Kershaw and A.J. Ellis credit Ausmus with changing the Dodger culture as he closed down his 18 year major league career in Los Angeles. He is very intelligent, loyal through his core, has a striking sense of humor.

http://www.gammonsdaily.com/peter-gammons-moving-on-from-the-anticipated-departure-of-john-farrell/

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2 hours ago, RatkoVarda said:

Gammons:

Who takes the job. One of the Red Sox executives who was in on the interviews after the 2012 season, called Ausmus’ interview the best he’d ever seen; had Farrell not gotten free of Toronto, he’d have been the manager. Brad grew up in Cheshire, Ct. a Red Sox fan. His mother grew up less than a mile from, Fenway, between the homesteads where Sam Kennedy and Theo Epstein were raised. He was hired by Dombrowski and has a good relationship with him. He calls Gene Lamont “the best baseball mind I’ve ever been around,” and Lamont, his bench coach, goes back with Dombrowski to Jim Leyland days; when Larry Lucchino hired Bobby Valentine, Lamont was runner-up and planned to make Ausmus his bench coach. David Price thinks Ausmus is the best manager for whom he’s ever played. Brad and his parents have adjoining houses in Dennis. One daughter is at Dartmouth, the other will be in college in New York next fall. His minor league manager was Brian Butterfield, one of the most important persons they have.

Clayton Kershaw and A.J. Ellis credit Ausmus with changing the Dodger culture as he closed down his 18 year major league career in Los Angeles. He is very intelligent, loyal through his core, has a striking sense of humor.

http://www.gammonsdaily.com/peter-gammons-moving-on-from-the-anticipated-departure-of-john-farrell/

LOL

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15 hours ago, chasfh said:

Oh my god, THANK you, Jonah Keri:

When it comes to hiring and firing MLB managers, nobody really knows what they are doing

I had always been sheepish when admitting that managers was a soft spot in my baseball knowledge, but it makes me feel better to consider that maybe that it's not my fault.

Good article.  My favorite line:  Dave Dombrowski was aggressively vague... :)

I've come to believe teams make the manager as much as a manager makes the team.  Jim Leyland had a profound impact in his first year with the Tigers. Francona didn't have much luck until Boston.  Did he suddenly change? I doubt it .. he had better teams.

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1 hour ago, djhutch said:

Good article.  My favorite line:  Dave Dombrowski was aggressively vague... :)

I've come to believe teams make the manager as much as a manager makes the team.  Jim Leyland had a profound impact in his first year with the Tigers. Francona didn't have much luck until Boston.  Did he suddenly change? I doubt it .. he had better teams.

Bill Belichick and Tom Brady.    Gonna be interesting to see just how great a coach he is when Brady retires. 

I think when a manager walks into a room with some authority behind him he's more likely to have an impact.   Jim Leyland is the tough dad who will ***** you out when you deserve it but still loves the heck out of you.    Brad didn't have that type of clout.   

As far as Tito - I think having some very clutch players on that team really helped. 

I think Dusty is getting canned in Washington.   I bet Leyland will get a call from them.   But I think he's done.   

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1 hour ago, djhutch said:

Good article.  My favorite line:  Dave Dombrowski was aggressively vague... :)

I've come to believe teams make the manager as much as a manager makes the team.  Jim Leyland had a profound impact in his first year with the Tigers. Francona didn't have much luck until Boston.  Did he suddenly change? I doubt it .. he had better teams.

"We're happy to have (player X).  We think he'll be a positive addition to our ballclub"

 

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5 minutes ago, Oblong said:

"We're happy to have (player X).  We think he'll be a positive addition to our ballclub"

 

Tiger Woods, when asked any question.   "Golf Course looks good.  My swing feels good.  I like my chances"      (stolen from Jim Rome). 

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17 hours ago, Motor City Sonics said:

I don't know, I think Dave Martinez finally steps out of the shadow of Joe Maddon and ends up with the Red Sox job.   I haven't read anything about it, but I just have that feeling.    If the Nats lose tonight, I think Dusty Baker will be gone.     If that happens two teams that won their division and made the playoffs will have managing vacancies.   I would not be shocked to see the Nats make a trade with the Giants for manager Bruce Bochy.   

See, that would make some sense to me, because the Red Sox is an analytics-heavy organization and Dave Martinez has experience with that kind of thing.

OTOH, Dave Dombrowski likes the devil he knows and they also want big league experience, and say what you want about Brad, but he does have that.

The most galling thing to me would be, they hire Brad, and then we find out Brad turns out to be fully in on analytics, a proclivity he had to hide or downplay to survive in Detroit, where it’s scouts over stats ten times out of ten. That would be a stab to the gut.

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28 minutes ago, Motor City Sonics said:

Bill Belichick and Tom Brady.    Gonna be interesting to see just how great a coach he is when Brady retires. 

I think when a manager walks into a room with some authority behind him he's more likely to have an impact.   Jim Leyland is the tough dad who will ***** you out when you deserve it but still loves the heck out of you.    Brad didn't have that type of clout.   

As far as Tito - I think having some very clutch players on that team really helped. 

I think Dusty is getting canned in Washington.   I bet Leyland will get a call from them.   But I think he's done.   

Normally I would be frightened that Dusty ends up here after getting shirt-canned in Washington, but with the Tigers going through a rebuild and Dusty hurtling towards his dotage, I think those chances are minimal.

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26 minutes ago, chasfh said:

See, that would make some sense to me, because the Red Sox is an analytics-heavy organization and Dave Martinez has experience with that kind of thing.

OTOH, Dave Dombrowski likes the devil he knows and they also want big league experience, and say what you want about Brad, but he does have that.

The most galling thing to me would be, they hire Brad, and then we find out Brad turns out to be fully in on analytics, a proclivity he had to hide or downplay to survive in Detroit, where it’s scouts over stats ten times out of ten. That would be a stab to the gut.

Or a reflection of the organization he works for.  As Brad said in an article I linked here, I think, he said the Tigers were still a year away from any of their work on analytics reaching the manager position.  They're still building out the systems.  The manager has to go with the information he's presented by the people in the front office.  He can't do it himself.

 

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29 minutes ago, chasfh said:

Normally I would be frightened that Dusty ends up here after getting shirt-canned in Washington, but with the Tigers going through a rebuild and Dusty hurtling towards his dotage, I think those chances are minimal.

Though Dusty wouldn't skimp on getting Tiger pitchers enough pitches, especially the good ones after like pitch 120.

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I don’t think a manager is that important when it comes to incorporating analytics. There just isn’t a whole lot you can do in game in view of analytics. I think it’s far more important to the front office in determining which players to acquire. 

 

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17 hours ago, Motor City Sonics said:

I would not be shocked to see the Nats make a trade with the Giants for manager Bruce Bochy.   

If I'm not mistaken Bochy is under contract through 2020 and I know he is one of the highest paid managers in the majors. Yes, this year was a disaster in SF but what gives you the impression SF would ever consider parting with Bochy? Just curious.

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1 hour ago, Motor City Sonics said:

Bill Belichick and Tom Brady.    Gonna be interesting to see just how great a coach he is when Brady retires. 

 

Football coaches actually do have a big impact and I believe Belichick is a big part of the Patriots success. 

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1 hour ago, tiger337 said:

Football coaches actually do have a big impact and I believe Belichick is a big part of the Patriots success. 

I often think baseball fans or commenters in general don't do enough to distinguish the kind of job a baseball manager has compared to a head coach in other sports.  They apply the same expectations and make the same assumptions when the jobs don't really compare.  I think they are vastly different.  In other sports they have offensive and defensive schemes.  There's particular strategies that one coach can use that others may choose a different path.  They don't play as often and thus have daily practices and drills.   Those sports are also more team sports in that there is a flow and being familiar with your teammates is more critical.  In baseball that mainly applies to the SS/2B on double plays.

 

 

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3 hours ago, Motor City Sonics said:

Bill Belichick and Tom Brady.    Gonna be interesting to see just how great a coach he is when Brady retires.

The season that Brady was hurt in the first game and shelved for the rest of the year, New England went 11-5.  They missed the playoffs, but 6 AFC teams had double digit wins, and the Patriots were at the bottom of that heap.  San Diego "won" the west with an 8-8 record.

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1 hour ago, MAROTH4MVP said:

Has the Strategy Expert been interviewed yet? He could probably right the ship in a single season.

I wonder if Dombrowski has spotted @Triple Se7en at Fenway?

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On 10/12/2017 at 1:55 PM, chasfh said:

Oh my god, THANK you, Jonah Keri:

When it comes to hiring and firing MLB managers, nobody really knows what they are doing

I had always been sheepish when admitting that managers was a soft spot in my baseball knowledge, but it makes me feel better to consider that maybe that it's not my fault.

Keri pretty much sums it up. That's why I don't give a rip who the Tigers hire right now, especially given the circumstances. And if I were Martinez or some other rising managerial star (whatever that is) I wouldn't touch the Detroit job. It could taint you for years. All I want for the next manager is a guy who's entertaining. How about Leyland again? 

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Yes as long as the manager wouldn't be detrimental to our young players particularly the pitchers then I don't care who it is.  And yeah it would be a bonus if they are entertaining.  

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When Ausmus came in, wasn't he supposed to be a snappy young analytic thinker -- at least compared to crusty craggy ole Leyland?

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9 minutes ago, TJ_TJ said:

When Ausmus came in, wasn't he supposed to be a snappy young analytic thinker -- at least compared to crusty craggy ole Leyland?

That was what was assumed by a lot of fans, but he was never an analytical guy and he didn't intend to be one.  I think people just assumed it because of his age and Ivy League degree.  

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3 hours ago, RandyMarsh said:

Yes as long as the manager wouldn't be detrimental to our young players particularly the pitchers then I don't care who it is.  And yeah it would be a bonus if they are entertaining.  

 

This is where the idea of Ozzie Guillen goes into the telephone pole.

The Tigers are going to be god-awful the next 2-4 years.

Of course he would come in and say, "OK yeah I understand that, etc etc, " but in about 3 weeks with a record of 5-13, he is gonna blow his gasket and start screaming at everybody.

Remember Earl Weaver (or maybe Billy Martin) said, "You can kick a mule in the azz all you want and he still won't turn into Secretariat."

With the kind of awful rebuilding team the Tigers are going to be the next few years, a screamer manager is exactly the kind of guy you do not need (until maybe about Year 4, when the talent level should be getting good and maybe then it will be time to kick some mule's azzes).

 

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4 minutes ago, tiger337 said:

That was what was assumed by a lot of fans, but he was never an analytical guy and he didn't intend to be one.  I think people just assumed it because of his age and Ivy League degree.  

I think he understood it a bit more than Leyland did, or does.

For that matter, I think Leyland understands a lot of the analytical stuff,  he just doesn't accept all of it unconditionally.

Also, after his playing career, Ausmus had not spent a lot of time in the old-school hands-on managerial training-wheel jobs like bench coach, 3B coach or minor-league manager, instead one of those nebulous-type "consultant" jobs, so the assumption i think a lot of people made was he spent most of that time studying fangraphs.com, etc etc.

 

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7 minutes ago, TJ_TJ said:

For that matter, I think Leyland understands a lot of the analytical stuff,  he just doesn't accept all of it unconditionally.

 

I don't think any smart person would accept it unconditionally.  If you do that, then you are not a good analyst.    

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