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Angels nearing a trade to acquire Justin Upton

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1 hour ago, Tenacious D said:

I wonder if the PTBNL from Anaheim is contingent on whether or not Upton exercises his opt-out?  If he decides to stay, does the player we get back improve?  It might have been constructed this way to mitigate the risk for Anaheim, so they weren't just trading for a rental.

that's a possibility, although i think it would have come out by now.

my guess is the tigers felt their scouting was a little light on lower level Angel prospects, and the deadline was looming, so they'll have their pick on some guys.

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The fact that "or cash" is next to PTBNL means we are almost certainly not getting anything of note. Not sure how much more valuable Upton would be if they knew he wasn't opting out. It's not a bad contract, but at the very least it's high end of what the market would pay.

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20 hours ago, chasfh said:

It's possible that Daniel Norris is not pitching up to potential and needs to work on a plan to make it back, but it's also possible that this could be a problem with the Tigers' not having the right coaching staff to maximize the value of this particular pitcher.

The last two pitchers who were drafted or signed by the organization and who went on to have success with the Tigers were Porcello and Verlander, despite that the team's key strategy has been to spend high draft picks on young flamethrowers over the past 15 years. That doesn't strike me as a good track record. Either the kids ... ahem ... flame out, or maybe they catch on with other organizations to finally find success (e.g., Andrew Miller, Corey Knebel).

The team has got a fresh new batch of pitchers now in the oven, so they have a chance to prove me wrong. 

It took multiple organizations before Andrew Miller found success and it isn't even as a starting pitcher. Also Andrew Miller and Corey Knebel were traded early before they were given a chance. Plus Knebel, like Miller, is catching on after being in multiple organizations. 

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I wonder now that both corner outfield spots will be unoccupied next year if this opens up a Granderson signing?  On the surface it doesn't make sense to sign a veteran in a lost season but we need somebody to play out there and Granderson may be able to drum up some ticket sales from the casual/lapsed fan. 

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19 minutes ago, RandyMarsh said:

I wonder now that both corner outfield spots will be unoccupied next year if this opens up a Granderson signing?  On the surface it doesn't make sense to sign a veteran in a lost season but we need somebody to play out there and Granderson may be able to drum up some ticket sales from the casual/lapsed fan. 

I know others have mentioned Grandy but why on earth would we want to spend $$ and at bats on him?   

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7 hours ago, Motown Bombers said:

It took multiple organizations before Andrew Miller found success and it isn't even as a starting pitcher. Also Andrew Miller and Corey Knebel were traded early before they were given a chance. Plus Knebel, like Miller, is catching on after being in multiple organizations. 

Regardless of how many other organizations they went through, the point is the Tigers did not have the wherewithal to unlock the potential these guys had when they were with us. That's not uniquely a Tiger problem—lots of organizations can't effectively develop talent. But it gives me cause for concern that essentially the same people who were in charge of development when Miller and Knebel were here are still in charge of development. 

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1 minute ago, chasfh said:

Regardless of how many other organizations they went through, the point is the Tigers did not have the wherewithal to unlock the potential these guys had when they were with us. That's not uniquely a Tiger problem—lots of organizations can't effectively develop talent. But it gives me cause for concern that essentially the same people who were in charge of development when Miller and Knebel were here are still in charge of development. 

Part of that issue is the Tigers always trying to fast track any good prospect they had.  The new regime seems to be taking a completely different approach. 

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21 minutes ago, RandyMarsh said:

Part of that issue is the Tigers always trying to fast track any good prospect they had.  The new regime seems to be taking a completely different approach. 

yeah, miller and knebel weren't even in the minors or in the organization for a full 2 years.

there should be no rush to trade or use these guys to help a playoff push or anything, and outside of that context, avila has said he doesn't want to call up guys before they are ready anymore.

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1 hour ago, LooseGoose said:

I know others have mentioned Grandy but why on earth would we want to spend $$ and at bats on him?   

Because he provides some protection to Cabrera and isn't blocking anyone.  I really doubt they try and rush Gerber or Stewart, at least to start the season.  And his ability to attract fans on a one-year deal shouldn't be discounted.  I could see him end up with the White Sox, too, for the same reasons.

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2 minutes ago, Tenacious D said:

Because he provides some protection to Cabrera and isn't blocking anyone.  I really doubt they try and rush Gerber or Stewart, at least to start the season.  And his ability to attract fans on a one-year deal shouldn't be discounted.  I could see him end up with the White Sox, too, for the same reasons.

i thought it'd be a good fit if JUp and JV were still around, but I doubt Grandy wants to play for a non-contender. maybe if he wins a WS with the Dodgers and nobody offers him what he wants, he does it for sentimental reasons.

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2 minutes ago, Who is the Drizzle? said:

i thought it'd be a good fit if JUp and JV were still around, but I doubt Grandy wants to play for a non-contender. maybe if he wins a WS with the Dodgers and nobody offers him what he wants, he does it for sentimental reasons.

Yeah, unless they want to overpay - which they won't - the only FAs the Tigers will be able to attract next years are ones who are looking for playing time - or simply need a job.

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4 minutes ago, irvink said:

Yeah, unless they want to overpay - which they won't - the only FAs the Tigers will be able to attract next years are ones who are looking for playing time - or simply need a job.

looking at the mlbtr list....not anything there that's a fit really. gonna be guys out of options or something like that.

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3 minutes ago, Who is the Drizzle? said:

i thought it'd be a good fit if JUp and JV were still around, but I doubt Grandy wants to play for a non-contender. maybe if he wins a WS with the Dodgers and nobody offers him what he wants, he does it for sentimental reasons.

True.  I'd be surprised if his market is very robust, though.   He'd be a great ambassador for the local community.

Sadly, we don't have a single African-American on the team.

 

 

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7 minutes ago, Who is the Drizzle? said:

looking at the mlbtr list....not anything there that's a fit really. gonna be guys out of options or something like that.

I haven't combed the dregs of the list yet. But figure we could be in the market for a corner OFer and maybe a middle infielder if we trade both Jose and Ian. Also, could use some BP arms and need to fill that rotation out after Fulmer, Zimmerman and Boyd... Hopefully, Norris can take a spot.

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2 minutes ago, irvink said:

I haven't combed the dregs of the list yet. But figure we could be in the market for a corner OFer and maybe a middle infielder if we trade both Jose and Ian. Also, could use some BP arms and need to fill that rotation out after Fulmer, Zimmerman and Boyd... Hopefully, Norris can take a spot.

i was just looking at OF with a mind to maybe dealing them in the summer. a lot of veterans, obviously, but just no real fits for that. maybe in february or something if there's a real bargain, but who knows who that would be. i think they'll look more at the AAAA types with club control to fill out a couple spots.

BP arms and the right SP I think are more likely.

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6 hours ago, chasfh said:

Regardless of how many other organizations they went through, the point is the Tigers did not have the wherewithal to unlock the potential these guys had when they were with us. That's not uniquely a Tiger problem—lots of organizations can't effectively develop talent. But it gives me cause for concern that essentially the same people who were in charge of development when Miller and Knebel were here are still in charge of development. 

They were traded before they could develop them. Sorry if I'm not disappointed about having Miguel Cabrera instead of a dominant reliever. Knebel had a whole 8 innings of major league work for the Tigers before he was traded. How can you say the Tigers failed at developing Knebel when he was only given 8 innings? 

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John Smoltz has always said that the Tigers did not miss out on his Hall of Fame career, because it would not have happened if he had stayed in the organization.

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21 hours ago, Tenacious D said:

Because he provides some protection to Cabrera and isn't blocking anyone.  I really doubt they try and rush Gerber or Stewart, at least to start the season.  And his ability to attract fans on a one-year deal shouldn't be discounted.  I could see him end up with the White Sox, too, for the same reasons.

Gerber is 25. He should be in the majors right now, especially given that the games don't matter one bit. If the Tigers feel like they'd be rushing him at this age then he is not someone worth investing in.

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Just now, SeattleMike said:

Gerber is 25. He should be in the majors right now, especially given that the games don't matter one bit. If the Tigers feel like they'd be rushing him at this age then he is not someone worth investing in.

He can't stay on baby food forever, in other words?

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http://www.detroitnews.com/story/sports/mlb/tigers/2017/09/03/tigers-scouts-lay-groundwork-prospect-laden-deals/105262010/

According to this story, the Tigers were scouting the Burlington Bees on Sunday.  I think I have the PTBNL down to 2 players: LHP Elvin Rodriguez (19) who started the game; or RHP Tyler Stevens, who pitched last for them and K'd 5 of 6 batters.  Rodriguez is ranked the Angels #23 prospect on MLB.com.

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I'll also hazard guesses on the two other pbtnl's:  Tigers get D.J. Wilson from the Cubs, and send Arvicent Perez to the Astros.

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19 hours ago, SeattleMike said:

Gerber is 25. He should be in the majors right now, especially given that the games don't matter one bit. If the Tigers feel like they'd be rushing him at this age then he is not someone worth investing in.

he's essentially played 1 full season at each level. so i guess i don't see the problem--he'***** and defended well but that's not fast enough?

he's a dirks type level of prospect and that's how he's been handled. i'm sure you'll see him soon. last minor league game is today.

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