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Sydney_Fife

Pistons sign Anthony Tolliver

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12 minutes ago, Buddha said:

galloway

baynes

boban

reggie

the aforementioned andre drummond

ish smith was an overpay at the time

jodie meeks

basically everyone he's signed here as has been an overpay.  and then to top it off, he doesnt trade the guys he doesnt like or doesnt want to overpay (monroe, kcp, josh smith) for assets but rather simply lets them go for nothing or worse (were still overpaying josh smith...).

i think their roster management has been pretty poor.  

Meh, those are minor overpays.  Which GM doesn't overpay free agents?  I don't see any Mozgov, Smith, Carroll level overpays in there.  Those are the crippling ones.

The Monroe and KCP situations were completely botched, no argument from me there.  And to add, the Smith stretch which is the gift that keeps on giving.  Don't really see a lot of obscene overpays on his record though.

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30 minutes ago, NYLion said:

Meh, those are minor overpays.  Which GM doesn't overpay free agents?  I don't see any Mozgov, Smith, Carroll level overpays in there.  Those are the crippling ones.

The Monroe and KCP situations were completely botched, no argument from me there.  And to add, the Smith stretch which is the gift that keeps on giving.  Don't really see a lot of obscene overpays on his record though.

drummond is the only obscene overpay.  but everyone he has signed has been an overpay.  when you keep doing that + fail at drafting + fail to bring in young, cheap talent + fail to get any assets for two lottery picks who walked for nothing, you get this roster that is one of the most expensive in the league and had 37 wins last year.

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and i think they'll be better next season thanks mostly to reggie being healthier, having a little bit better shooting, and the east being TURRIBLE.

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10 minutes ago, Buddha said:

drummond is the only obscene overpay.  but everyone he has signed has been an overpay.  when you keep doing that + fail at drafting + fail to bring in young, cheap talent + fail to get any assets for two lottery picks who walked for nothing, you get this roster that is one of the most expensive in the league and had 37 wins last year.

I see fault in his drafting (although still a bit early to judge), his inability to find shooters, the KCP and Monroe situations and not getting the most out of his young players but I don't see the salaries he's handed out as a big problem and even in the Drummond situation, he was going to get max from somebody if not the Pistons.

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39 minutes ago, NYLion said:

I see fault in his drafting (although still a bit early to judge), his inability to find shooters, the KCP and Monroe situations and not getting the most out of his young players but I don't see the salaries he's handed out as a big problem and even in the Drummond situation, he was going to get max from somebody if not the Pistons.

he was stuck with drummond, but they still gave him a ridiculous trade kicker they didnt need to.  its like someone walks into stan's office and says this is what i want and stan just says ok if he likes the guy.

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On ‎7‎/‎13‎/‎2017 at 11:23 AM, Deleterious said:

Well, he isn't that great and it was dumb to spend that money on him so fast.  

But I said before free agency even started that they shouldn't spend the MLE this year.  This team has some serious payroll issues facing them and not spending this year would help right the ship a bit.  Plus, I would much rather have kept KCP than fill the roster with another fringe role player on a long term and expensive (For that type of player) deal.  

Maybe they go out and keep Bradley next year and I will be wrong.  But my suspicion right now is they wont.  They will move him at the deadline and leak it that he was going to want a kings ransom or he wasn't even willing to sign.  So look, we got what we could!  Meanwhile, the salary situation is better. But it cost you KCP to do it.

I am thinking Bradley will remain a Piston.  I don't expect Drummond to be a Piston after the trade deadline this season. 

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7 hours ago, Buddha said:

galloway

baynes

boban

reggie

the aforementioned andre drummond

ish smith was an overpay at the time

jodie meeks

basically everyone he's signed here as has been an overpay.  and then to top it off, he doesnt trade the guys he doesnt like or doesnt want to overpay (monroe, kcp, josh smith) for assets but rather simply lets them go for nothing or worse (were still overpaying josh smith...).

i think their roster management has been pretty poor.  

I don't think any of those guys besides Drummond was overpaid.  Poor roster management you can make a much better argument for.

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15 hours ago, Buddha said:

drummond is the only obscene overpay.  but everyone he has signed has been an overpay.  when you keep doing that + fail at drafting + fail to bring in young, cheap talent + fail to get any assets for two lottery picks who walked for nothing, you get this roster that is one of the most expensive in the league and had 37 wins last year.

How exactly has he "failed at drafting".

Ellenson was not a failed pick. He was the 18th pick in a weak draft, and we don't even know how that will end up.


Obviously this year's pick can't be called a failure.

 

So he had 1 draft pick you don't like. 

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27 minutes ago, 313DetroitCity said:

How exactly has he "failed at drafting".

Ellenson was not a failed pick. He was the 18th pick in a weak draft, and we don't even know how that will end up.


Obviously this year's pick can't be called a failure.

 

So he had 1 draft pick you don't like. 

I know you are new to the board, but Buddah's dislike for picking Stanley Johnson over Booker is legendary in these parts.  Draft day has been a dark time for Buddah over the past few seasons.

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31 minutes ago, 313DetroitCity said:

How exactly has he "failed at drafting".

Ellenson was not a failed pick. He was the 18th pick in a weak draft, and we don't even know how that will end up.


Obviously this year's pick can't be called a failure.

 

So he had 1 draft pick you don't like. 

none of his draft picks have contributed to the team yet.  in fact, theyve all been negatives on the team.  that means that he has so far failed at drafting.

we'll see about kennard.  he does bring shooting which is the thing this team needed most last year.

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13 hours ago, T&P_Fan said:

I am thinking Bradley will remain a Piston.  I don't expect Drummond to be a Piston after the trade deadline this season. 

If Drummond is gone by the deadline, chances are that it was another failed season in which case I highly doubt that Bradley re-signs here.  He only re-signs if the team has a good season and shows that it's on an upward trajectory IMO.

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19 minutes ago, Buddha said:

none of his draft picks have contributed to the team yet.  in fact, theyve all been negatives on the team.  that means that he has so far failed at drafting.

we'll see about kennard.  he does bring shooting which is the thing this team needed most last year.

Alternately, can one plausibly claim that SVG has succeeded at drafting?

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5 hours ago, Buddha said:

none of his draft picks have contributed to the team yet.  in fact, theyve all been negatives on the team.  that means that he has so far failed at drafting.

we'll see about kennard.  he does bring shooting which is the thing this team needed most last year.

By none of the picks you mean 2nd round picks and Stanley right?

Because he doesn't have a long track record of failed draft picks. In fact, he has almost no record here. Second round picks almost never contribute, and you shouldn't judge the success or failure in the first couple years. 

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4 hours ago, Mr. Bigglesworth said:

Alternately, can one plausibly claim that SVG has succeeded at drafting?

I would say you can't judge his drafting at this point. 

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27 minutes ago, 313DetroitCity said:

By none of the picks you mean 2nd round picks and Stanley right?

Because he doesn't have a long track record of failed draft picks. In fact, he has almost no record here. Second round picks almost never contribute, and you shouldn't judge the success or failure in the first couple years. 

by "none of his picks" i mean "none of his picks" because "none of his picks" have contributed to the team.

if you would like to argue that it is too early to judge ellenson as a failed draft pick, thats fair.  i agree with that.  i also agree its too early to judge stanley as a failed pick too.  

but i dont think you can argue that any of his picks have contributed to the team in a meaningful way.  to me as of now, thats a failure of drafting so far.  but that could change, both those guys are pretty young still.

i dont see it with ellenson or stanley, but kennard looks like he could be a good shooter.

 

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Just now, Buddha said:

by "none of his picks" i mean "none of his picks" because "none of his picks" have contributed to the team.

if you would like to argue that it is too early to judge ellenson as a failed draft pick, thats fair.  i agree with that.  i also agree its too early to judge stanley as a failed pick too.  

but i dont think you can argue that any of his picks have contributed to the team in a meaningful way.  to me as of now, thats a failure of drafting so far.  but that could change, both those guys are pretty young still.

i dont see it with ellenson or stanley, but kennard looks like he could be a good shooter.

 

Fair enough. I think we should wait to judge Stanley. If he has a disastrous season, I am comfortable calling it a failed pick. But as it stands, it is too early to tell. 

I think calling something a "failure" is strong when it you agree it is too early to judge. 

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Just now, 313DetroitCity said:

Fair enough. I think we should wait to judge Stanley. If he has a disastrous season, I am comfortable calling it a failed pick. But as it stands, it is too early to tell. 

I think calling something a "failure" is strong when it you agree it is too early to judge. 

thats fair.  but when it comes to stanley i use strong language because that pick pissed me off.

and if there is any truth to the rumor that he was offered multiple first rounders and turned it down then it makes it even worse.

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1 minute ago, Buddha said:

i also dont think stanley or ellenson will ever be major contributors.

Even if Ellenson isn't a major contributor, is it a "failure"? What percentage of 18th overall draft picks are "major contributors"? 

If you get a rotation player with the 18th pick you are doing okay. I think Ellenson has the capability of becoming that. 

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1 minute ago, 313DetroitCity said:

Even if Ellenson isn't a major contributor, is it a "failure"? What percentage of 18th overall draft picks are "major contributors"? 

If you get a rotation player with the 18th pick you are doing okay. I think Ellenson has the capability of becoming that. 

possibly.

i'm not sure he has a position unless he gets stronger.  he gets pushed around inside and isnt quick enough to guard anyone outside.

if he becomes a dead eye shooter then he could be ryan anderson or robert horry.  other than that, i think he might just be too slow to play nowadays.

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Just now, Buddha said:

possibly.

i'm not sure he has a position unless he gets stronger.  he gets pushed around inside and isnt quick enough to guard anyone outside.

if he becomes a dead eye shooter then he could be ryan anderson or robert horry.  other than that, i think he might just be too slow to play nowadays.

If your major concern is strength, that is good news. He is only 20 years old, and it is very common to see guys bulk up in due time. 

While I am not high on Ellenson, I do see some things to like. He seems to be fairly skilled offensively, to where I can see him as a + offensive player who needs to be protected on defense. 

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