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Is it an optical illusion though?

Utah and Vegas are both played in real stadiums.  Orlando is played in a practice facility.  

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My take so far:

Gbinije - Sorry kid, you're getting cut. Doesn't really add much on either end of the court. Shot doesn't look good and just hasn't found a way to make an impression even though he's fighting to show he should be on an NBA roster. Defense is ok, but not worthy of a roster spot with all of the 2s and 3s on this team now.

Ellenson - His numbers are flashy and he can shoot the rock, especially for a big man. That's good. Problem is he's too weak to rebound and too slow to defend anyone. When the opposition needed a bucket, they went right at him. He couldn't match the strength or speed of players on the defensive end of the court, even in summer league. Another problem was what happened to his offensive game when guys got physical with him like the 2nd half of the Miami game. In the regular season he might get some duty if we have an injury or SVG is looking for an offensive spark off the bench, but I don't see SVG giving him regular minutes this year because he can't defend.

Kennard - Kennard looks like the more NBA ready player between him and Ellenson. His shot is beautiful, even when it doesn't go in - it just looks silky smooth. He showed some nice court vision with the ball in his hands as well. However, he's not driving by anybody at the NBA level and those pump fakes aren't going to work, so he's really going to need to work on his Reggie Miller game, running off screens for quick shots when he's not spotting up in the corner on offense. On defense I thought he was decent. Not great by any means, but seemed to do an ok job of moving his feet and even grabbed a couple of steals. Highly doubt SVG gives him any minutes before the All-Star break but it all depends upon KCPs situation, how much time Galloway will put in at the 2, and how much SVG wants to run Stanley out there at SG again this year (Ugh).

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i'm a lot more pessimistic about ellenson after this summer league, even if he did show signs of improvement over last year.

ellenson is going to struggle in an nba of athletic 4s and 5s.  not sure who he can guard.

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This is the only place I'm hearing negative talk about Ellenson. I trust most of your assessments but most of the guys covering the team seem to think he's looked solid to great.

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2 hours ago, DaBishop said:

This is the only place I'm hearing negative talk about Ellenson. I trust most of your assessments but most of the guys covering the team seem to think he's looked solid to great.

beat guys who rely on access for their jobs are giving glowing reviews to players drafted by people who grant that access?  hmmm...

but seriously, watch ellenson and tell me what you think.  he was totally bullied in the post by anyone physical.  he looked comically uncoordinated when he tried to drive and score.  he was beaten off the dribble by anyone with a first step.  he has no jumping ability and couldnt defend the basket despite being 6'11.

his shot was ok, but it comes out relatively low.  its going to get blocked by nba athletes when they want to play defense. his best move is his three point shot which was better, but still not great.  his ceiling looks to be as a stretch four who can knock down threes and do nothing else.  there are worse things to be and he's still young and could get better especially if he gets stronger, but i imagine he'll be ryan anderson if he develops completely.

yes, i know ryan anderson is white but i cant think of a better comp.

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I don't know if the guys at Piston Powered and Detroit Bad Gusy fit into the beat guy category.

I'm not saying at all who I think is right...would hope it's the other guys. That said, I think not all these guys are going to have their fully developed bodies at 20. I didn't like that all of his highlights were of him taking fade aways and threes, and almost nothing inside.

I get the vibe he's gonna fight for minutes and if he can build up his body over the year, get more if he earns them. I did think his shot looked great and I didn't see the ball coming out low...almost every shot I saw showed a ball coming out above eye level.

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Ellenson is too slow to play PF and not strong enough to play C.  

I'm not sure how much you can improve quickness.  But he can work on his body and add strength.  Hopefully he can do that because I feel his future is at C, not PF.

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i just read pistonpowered on ellenson and think theyre full of ****.  thats not the player i saw at all.

"Ellenson has passed they eye test this offseason. He’s got a dribble-drive game, he can hit face-up jumpers, fallaway jumpers, he can body up and finish at the rim, and he can hit three’s with efficiency.  He’s also demonstrated that he is a very capable passer.

While still figuring it out defensively, Ellenson is showing that he has the ability to become an elite and complete player offensively, particularly for his size, and potentially a passable defender."

i'm at a loss for words.  elite and complete offensive player?  finish at the rim?  dribble drive game?

did they watch the same games that i did?  betrayer?  del?

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I saw a guy that shot better than I expected, which is good.  But I didn't see a complete offensive player.

The one driver I remember happened in game one.  He made a nice baseline move to get past his defender, then tripped over his own feet when he was in for the open layup.  

I saw smaller defenders body him up and keep him from getting position, making him start his post up 3 feet outside the lane.  He wasn't able to power to the rim against them either, constantly going back to the fade away jumper.  

 

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5 minutes ago, Deleterious said:

I saw a guy that shot better than I expected, which is good.  But I didn't see a complete offensive player.

The one driver I remember happened in game one.  He made a nice baseline move to get past his defender, then tripped over his own feet when he was in for the open layup.  

I saw smaller defenders body him up and keep him from getting position, making him start his post up 3 feet outside the lane.  He wasn't able to power to the rim against them either, constantly going back to the fade away jumper.  

 

that's kind of what i saw.  i thought he was embarassingly bad going to the basket.  tripping over his own feet multiple times.  when the miami guys pushed him around he could do nothing in the post and just faded back to the three point line.

like you said, he has to get stronger.  the good news is that he can do it.  but the coordination thing and the quickness thing wont change.  

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13 hours ago, Deleterious said:

Ellenson is too slow to play PF and not strong enough to play C.  

I'm not sure how much you can improve quickness.  But he can work on his body and add strength.  Hopefully he can do that because I feel his future is at C, not PF.

Yup

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13 hours ago, Buddha said:

i just read pistonpowered on ellenson and think theyre full of ****.  thats not the player i saw at all.

"Ellenson has passed they eye test this offseason. He’s got a dribble-drive game, he can hit face-up jumpers, fallaway jumpers, he can body up and finish at the rim, and he can hit three’s with efficiency.  He’s also demonstrated that he is a very capable passer.

While still figuring it out defensively, Ellenson is showing that he has the ability to become an elite and complete player offensively, particularly for his size, and potentially a passable defender."

i'm at a loss for words.  elite and complete offensive player?  finish at the rim?  dribble drive game?

did they watch the same games that i did?  betrayer?  del?

Definitely saw some dribble drive. 

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37 minutes ago, T&P_Fan said:

Definitely saw some dribble drive. 

yeah but he was terrible at it.  he cant jump and cant finish and fell over his own feet a few times.

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I'm with Buddha and Del on this. I posted my thoughts above and the final game did nothing to change them - if anything it proved them right. He struggled mightily in the championship game because Dallas was playing good, tough defense. As Del said, he's not getting any quicker so he needs to work on his strength, rebounding, and defense so he can play stretch 5 (yes, that's a thing now...sigh, I really miss the old days).

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11 hours ago, Buddha said:

yeah but he was terrible at it.  he cant jump and cant finish and fell over his own feet a few times.

Ellenson's college days and Draft Express profile would lead you to believe he does have potential with the dribble drive.  I can't get it to copy and paste but if you read the scouting report, it is quite complimentary of his dribble drive game.  Whether this carries over to the NBA is a question.  I certainly wouldn't rule it out.  I agree with you his quickness is not changing but I do think coordination can change for big guys as they get more comfortable and develop their games.  Or maybe it doesn't really change; it just makes itself visible because the player is developing.  

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The Thomas and Mack Center is sold out tonight for the Lakers vs Celtics game.  It holds 15K for summer league.  They said it has sold out before but this is the first time it was sold out in advance. It usually sells out from walk ups.

Court side seats were going for $400.

 

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During the weekends LV gets a huge influx of LA people, to go along with all the LA transplants already here. They want the next Kobe so badly. 

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15 minutes ago, mickeyb105 said:

During the weekends LV gets a huge influx of LA people, to go along with all the LA transplants already here.

Yeah, OK, what do you know about LV?

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the bulls summer league team is basically its regular season team:

dunn, payne, zipser, markannen, and valentine.

ive never seen a summer league team that has so many nba players on it.   not a gleaguer in sight.  of course, one could argue that the bulls team should really be in the gleague....

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