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Game 82: Pistons @ Magic

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55 minutes ago, Deleterious said:

It's funny watching people trying to deny the Pistons had a top 10 defense.  

And that means what? Good defense? A playoff appearance? Nope. None of the above. This was a bad defense and the stats show it. 20th in OppFG%, 21st in Opp3PT%, bottom of the league in blocks, steals, and OppTOs. Look, I can repeat the same words over and over again too.

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1 minute ago, Betrayer said:

And that means what? Good defense? A playoff appearance? Nope. None of the above. This was a bad defense and the stats show it. 20th in OppFG%, 21st in Opp3PT%, bottom of the league in blocks, steals, and OppTOs. Look, I can repeat the same words over and over again too.

Top ten defense.

http://stats.nba.com/teams/opponent/#!?sort=OPP_PTS&dir=-1&Season=2016-17&SeasonType=Regular Season&PerMode=Per100Possessions

You can try to rationalize it away however you wish with any bad logic you want.  Still a top ten defense.

You can be 100% wrong like you were earlier trying to blame it on pace.  Still a top ten defense.

TL;DR Top ten defense.  

 

 

 

 

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At the end of the day, we're arguing over a middling basketball team that had a bad year.

I think it is OK to say that the team needs help on the perimeter in the form of both shooting and defense, just the same as it is OK to say that the Pistons were actually, collectively, an OK defensive team.

The Pistons having a bad year this was OK by me because it forces SVG's hand to address some problems that he didn't have to when we made the playoffs.  These problems are pretty similar to the problems we had a season ago, but heightened expectations + an underachieving team  = pressure to address the team's weaknesses.

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Nobody is denying the stat exists. If your point is to quote the stat without drawing any conclusion from it, then nice job. Thanks, but I can find the stat myself on NBA.com.

The difference is that I'm actually taking some stats and using them to make a point. 20th in OppFG%, 21st in Opp3PT%, bottom of the league in blocks, steals, and OppTOs. This was a bad defense. Feel free to disagree with my point and say it was a good defense...or just go ahead and quote your ranking stat again and see if that means anything to anyone.

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Just now, Betrayer said:

Nobody is denying the stat exists. If your point is to quote the stat without drawing any conclusion from it, then nice job. Thanks, but I can find the stat myself on NBA.com.

The difference is that I'm actually taking some stats and using them to make a point. 20th in OppFG%, 21st in Opp3PT%, bottom of the league in blocks, steals, and OppTOs. This was a bad defense. Feel free to disagree with my point and say it was a good defense...or just go ahead and quote your ranking stat again and see if that means anything to anyone.

But your stats mean absolutely nothing in the grand scheme of things.  Nobody has ever won a game 108 points to 34OppFG%.  

I care about how many points I give up.  And when equalized for pace, the Pistons give up the 9th least amount of points in the league.  When each team is given 100 possessions, the Pistons will allow less points than 21 other teams.  

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23 minutes ago, mickeyb105 said:

At the end of the day, we're arguing over a middling basketball team that had a bad year.

I think it is OK to say that the team needs help on the perimeter in the form of both shooting and defense, just the same as it is OK to say that the Pistons were actually, collectively, an OK defensive team.

The Pistons having a bad year this was OK by me because it forces SVG's hand to address some problems that he didn't have to when we made the playoffs.  These problems are pretty similar to the problems we had a season ago, but heightened expectations + an underachieving team  = pressure to address the team's weaknesses.

The offense is the main issue here.  

They had the 25th ranked offense at 103.3 points per/100.  

Wanna know how much scoring went up in the league this year?  The Pistons also scored 103.3 points per/100 last year.  Their offense ranked 15th that year.

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The Pistons were a bad team.  They were only in the playoff hunt because other teams were playing poorly.  They had a stretch before Reggie came back and right before the season ending collapse where they were looking like a competent basketball team but the majority of the season was filled with inconsistency, poor execution, lack of effort, poor coaching etc. 

No stat will tell me that this team was a top 10 team in any meaningful category. There's no rationalizing any of this with handpicked stats, it was a fail of a season on both ends of the court and SVG has his work cut out for him this offseason although I don't expect sweeping changes because who wants the Pistons overpriced, diminishing assets.  I think these guys have it in them to be better with a healthy, locked in Reggie but that's a big if at this point.

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7 minutes ago, Deleterious said:

The offense is the main issue here.  

They had the 25th ranked offense at 103.3 points per/100.  

Wanna know how much scoring went up in the league this year?  The Pistons also scored 103.3 points per/100 last year.  Their offense ranked 15th that year.

SVG failing to upgrade the outside shooting of the backcourt was a huge mistake last season, and he compounded that mistake by being hesitant to make changes to the rotation aside from adding Leuer and Ish as FA.

As much as we complain about Dre's defense, it really begs the question--Why not Boban 20 min per night?  He essentially rebounds at Dre's rate but he's a legit source of offense around the basket--and at the foul line. 

I know Detroit shot much better vs the league on contested threes than they did open threes this season, but with Dre out there the defense has zero reason to double the post.  With Boban's ability to pass out of the post, it seems like there's a potential for a couple more easy looks every game.  Especially if SVG gets his hands on two more guys who can put the ball in the basket.

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I look forward to Boban getting 20 mins a game next year.

It will be funny watching you guys ***** about him playing at all.  

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Just now, Deleterious said:

I look forward to Boban getting 20 mins a game next year.

It will be funny watching you guys ***** about him playing at all.  

There are only a few guys I ******* about getting any PT at all.  Singler, Lance Blanks, Brian Cardinal and Michael Curry instantly come to mind.

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9 minutes ago, Nastradamus said:

I think you gotta give it a shot. 

I would try to pawn him off on a stupid team with cap space.

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1 hour ago, Deleterious said:

Top ten defense.

http://stats.nba.com/teams/opponent/#!?sort=OPP_PTS&dir=-1&Season=2016-17&SeasonType=Regular Season&PerMode=Per100Possessions

You can try to rationalize it away however you wish with any bad logic you want.  Still a top ten defense.

You can be 100% wrong like you were earlier trying to blame it on pace.  Still a top ten defense.

TL;DR Top ten defense.  

 

 

 

 

I see two things that make the Pistons a "good" defense -

Allow very few offensive rebounds (Andre effect I assume)

Don't turn the ball over much (probably the one benefit to a bunch of 1 on 1 bball?)

Both of these activities are going to greatly reduce the amount of incredibly easy shots opposing teams receive.

So, I can agree that due to this, they were a good overall defense, while still feeling that they have many players who are not good 1 on 1 defenders. If there was some way to maintain these positive attributes while improving that facet of their game, they may well be a top 5 or better defense, which would help alleviate their garbage offense.

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4 hours ago, Mr. Bigglesworth said:

Don Reid got a fair bit of playing time as well.

I have love for Don Reid.  He was part of the team when they were terrible, and yes, he was a bad rotation player.

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4 hours ago, Mr. Bigglesworth said:

I had a friend who loved Brian Cardinal.

I feel like I just got punked by Brian Cardinal.

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1 hour ago, mickeyb105 said:

I feel like I just got punked by Brian Cardinal.

I figured his friend was Dick Versace.  Isn't he the one that gave Cardinal that $40M contract?

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18 minutes ago, Deleterious said:

I figured his friend was Dick Versace.  Isn't he the one that gave Cardinal that $40M contract?

Cardinal file photo

1e564bf9909aa344df9b0f0dbbeb6b8d.gif

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On 4/17/2017 at 10:34 AM, Deleterious said:

It's funny watching people trying to deny the Pistons had a top 10 defense.  

you are easily amused.

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On 4/17/2017 at 0:43 PM, Deleterious said:

I look forward to Boban getting 20 mins a game next year.

It will be funny watching you guys ***** about him playing at all.  

tell us wise one, what would you do this offseason?

i would like to hear what you think they can do to become a 50 win team.  oh wait, ypu thought THIS team was going to win 50 games.  maybe i'll ask someone else? :)

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