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The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

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4 hours ago, stanpapi said:

My statement still stands...

This political forum is filled with a lot of quality, nuanced debate.   Neither of which you provide.   Believe it or not, there are conservatives who able to make good points and provide a little give and take.  You do neither.  You're a one trick pony.  

Dont you ever get sick of such hardline declarations?  Im familiar with this style of posting, I do the same in the sports forums.  I'm an unabashed homer. But that's a game, which has nothing to do with how our country is governed.   America is better than the drivel you offer in this forum.  You're a terrible ambassador to America.  

Go back and read the obama forum.  Many of posters criticizing trump were also criticizing obama.  You've completely lost the ability to have a civil back and forth.  

And all for Donald Trump.  

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12 minutes ago, stanpapi said:

Well, the thing is, DACA shouldn't even be part of this discussion. I don't think Trump really wants to give the DACA people a free ticket in. At least I hope he doesn't. I think all of them should be deported. Having said that, you can set up a system where there is some intense background checks into these folks. Your all A student who has stayed out of trouble....he or she might get to apply for re-entry legally and the chance for citizenship. Not all of them will- or should, be able to reapply, however. And certainly not all at once. Maybe only 20% or so- who knows what that number is, but it sure isn't all of them.  

Trump shouldn't just give in on this one. It was a misguided program from the start. The BS compassion argument coming from the dems now on this is just a scam. They don't give two rips about these people and they never did. They just wanted the shot at more voters- nothing more. 

As an immigrant, recognize you should also be on that list. 

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I'd be curious to know the percentage of DACA recipients to whom English is their first language. Ill bet it's pretty high.

We select politicians to fix problems. Our President appears incapable of tackling this one. Other than for throwing bromides for his base.

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32 minutes ago, stanpapi said:

Well, the thing is, DACA shouldn't even be part of this discussion. I don't think Trump really wants to give the DACA people a free ticket in. At least I hope he doesn't. I think all of them should be deported. Having said that, you can set up a system where there is some intense background checks into these folks. Your all A student who has stayed out of trouble....he or she might get to apply for re-entry legally and the chance for citizenship. Not all of them will- or should, be able to reapply, however. And certainly not all at once. Maybe only 20% or so- who knows what that number is, but it sure isn't all of them.  

Trump shouldn't just give in on this one. It was a misguided program from the start. The BS compassion argument coming from the dems now on this is just a scam. They don't give two rips about these people and they never did. They just wanted the shot at more voters- nothing more. 

The pols. might not care about DACA, but the American people do:

http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/368959-poll-most-americans-support-daca

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5 minutes ago, mtutiger said:

I'd be curious to know the percentage of DACA recipients to whom English is their first language. Ill bet it's pretty high.

We select politicians to fix problems. Our President appears incapable of tackling this one. Other than for throwing bromides for his base.

It's becoming pretty clear that racism and xenophobia are what lie just below the layer of whatever NYC urban sophistication  Donald Trump has managed to appropriate to his persona over a lifetime. Scratch the facade even lightly and the animal spirit is ever lurking, ready to master any weak tendencies originating in his more urbane but less deeply held self.

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10 minutes ago, mtutiger said:

I'd be curious to know the percentage of DACA recipients to whom English is their first language. Ill bet it's pretty high.

We select politicians to fix problems. Our President appears incapable of tackling this one. Other than for throwing bromides for his base.

No president should have had to "fix" this. It never should have happened to begin with.

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Just now, stanpapi said:

No president should have had to "fix" this. It never should have happened to begin with.

But it's there. And clearly, it's not going away.

There hasn't been a President in our history that has not had to tackle problems that shouldn't have been there. If the POTUS wants to do something of consequence, maybe he should start fixing some problems.

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7 minutes ago, mtutiger said:

But it's there. And clearly, it's not going away.

 

And the American people support it.  

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40 minutes ago, mtutiger said:

I'd be curious to know the percentage of DACA recipients to whom English is their first language. Ill bet it's pretty high.

We select politicians to fix problems. Our President appears incapable of tackling this one. Other than for throwing bromides for his base.

the courts missed an opportunity somewhere in last century to set a new common law standard. Something analogous to the 'common-law' marriage. It should go something to the effect that if you are here, and the government hasn't bothered to look for you or deport you for say 10 yrs, then you become a 'common-law' citizen. Would have put an end to a lot this nonsense - the choice would be what the choice always should have been - actually remove people in a timely manner or else accept them as citizens with full rights. Everything else on this issue is BS.

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1 hour ago, mtutiger said:

But it's there. And clearly, it's not going away.

There hasn't been a President in our history that has not had to tackle problems that shouldn't have been there. If the POTUS wants to do something of consequence, maybe he should start fixing some problems.

A decision to let illegals stay in the country is not something that should have ever happened via executive order. That is what I meant.

Trump can fix it. He can simply let it expire and choose whether to deport or not. 

If the democrats were smart, they would take this thing out of the CR to keep the government open and make it its own standalone issue. But fortunately they have leadership that is completely inept, so now they've boxed themselves into looking like they want to keep the government closed because they care more about illegals than the American people. It is a 'brilliant' strategy.

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50 minutes ago, Gehringer_2 said:

the courts missed an opportunity somewhere in last century to set a new common law standard. Something analogous to the 'common-law' marriage. It should go something to the effect that if you are here, and the government hasn't bothered to look for you or deport you for say 10 yrs, then you become a 'common-law' citizen. Would have put an end to a lot this nonsense - the choice would be what the choice always should have been - actually remove people in a timely manner or else accept them as citizens with full rights. Everything else on this issue is BS.

That's kind of what happened with the mass amnesty during the Reagan administration.  Unfortunately, it resulted in a massive increase in illegal immigration without the increase in enforcement that was promised when the law was passed.

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53 minutes ago, CMRivdog said:

 

Well .. twitter... Definitely authoritative.  Not.  

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11 minutes ago, stanpapi said:

 looking like they want to keep the government closed because they care more about illegals than the American people. It is a 'brilliant' strategy.

The FoxNews Trumpers have a lot of lame talking points.  This is one of the worst.  

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11 minutes ago, Melody said:

That's kind of what happened with the mass amnesty during the Reagan administration.  Unfortunately, it resulted in a massive increase in illegal immigration without the increase in enforcement that was promised when the law was passed.

yes - absolutely. The 'original sin' here was that the Reagan amnesty was supposed to be coupled to border enforcement - just exactly like all the talk now. But as long as the Chamber of Commerce crowd doesn't want their cheap labor deported and just as much of the Dem crowd believe that most immigration restrictions are immoral, which side will ever enforce that part of the bargain? (I admit it - trick question).

The American public's appetite for myth and mendacity in place of fact and common sense is boundless. We are not governable because we don't tell the truth even to ourselves.

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4 minutes ago, tiger337 said:

The FoxNews Trumpers have a lot of lame talking points.  This is one of the worst.  

It's the truth. Immigration has no business being in the discussion about whether the government should stay open. Just like Chuck Schumer said in 2013. Putting it there makes this a flat loser for the dems. The longer it goes on, the better it actually gets for Republicans. 

Because remember....

DUAKlOtWsAA5DPv.jpg:large

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2 hours ago, stanpapi said:

Well, the thing is, DACA shouldn't even be part of this discussion. I don't think Trump really wants to give the DACA people a free ticket in. At least I hope he doesn't. I think all of them should be deported. Having said that, you can set up a system where there is some intense background checks into these folks. Your all A student who has stayed out of trouble....he or she might get to apply for re-entry legally and the chance for citizenship. Not all of them will- or should, be able to reapply, however. And certainly not all at once. Maybe only 20% or so- who knows what that number is, but it sure isn't all of them.  

Trump shouldn't just give in on this one. It was a misguided program from the start. The BS compassion argument coming from the dems now on this is just a scam. They don't give two rips about these people and they never did. They just wanted the shot at more voters- nothing more. 

Well, the thing is, DACA wouldn't even be part of this discussion had Stable Genius not rescinded it.  And, the thing is, it is part of the discussion. So where's the deal maker?  WHat, one little thing he disagrees with and he can't cut a deal?   He can only cut a deal when everyone agrees?  What a talent!

 

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12 minutes ago, stanpapi said:

It's the truth. Immigration has no business being in the discussion about whether the government should stay open. Just like Chuck Schumer said in 2013. Putting it there makes this a flat loser for the dems. The longer it goes on, the better it actually gets for Republicans. 

Because remember....

DUAKlOtWsAA5DPv.jpg:large

I agree with Schumer in 2013, and he's consistent.  The GOP is holding millions of people hostage through CHIP and DACA.

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15 minutes ago, pfife said:

Well, the thing is, DACA wouldn't even be part of this discussion had Stable Genius not rescinded it.  And, the thing is, it is part of the discussion. So where's the deal maker?  WHat, one little thing he disagrees with and he can't cut a deal?   He can only cut a deal when everyone agrees?  What a talent!

 

One 'little' thing. Good one.

I hope he just lets it lapse and deports them all. 

Happy to talk about re-application, on the government's terms.

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2 minutes ago, stanpapi said:

One 'little' thing. Good one.

I hope he just lets it lapse and deports them all. 

Happy to talk about re-application, on the government's terms.

You shouldn't hope for that.

 

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12 minutes ago, pfife said:

You shouldn't hope for that.

 

There should be no cart blanche on DACA. In my view, if the dems want anything remotely resembling a break for DACA folks, they have to allow funding of the wall and agree to stop chain and the lottery. Then there can be a discussion of whether *some* DACA folks can stay. It should be a rigorous process to even have the shot to stay. This was a BS program from the start.

That's my position, anyway. I have no idea with the President will do. 

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3 hours ago, stanpapi said:

No president should have had to "fix" this. It never should have happened to begin with.

 

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1 hour ago, stanpapi said:

There should be no cart blanche on DACA. In my view, if the dems want anything remotely resembling a break for DACA folks, they have to allow funding of the wall and agree to stop chain and the lottery. Then there can be a discussion of whether *some* DACA folks can stay. It should be a rigorous process to even have the shot to stay. This was a BS program from the start.

That's my position, anyway. I have no idea with the President will do. 

People are outraged over the families being broken up.

 

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6 minutes ago, pfife said:

People are outraged over the families being broken up.

 

People used to be outraged that people got in here illegally to begin with.

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