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Deleterious

2016 NBA trade deadline

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Only thing I don't like about that deal is it takes us out of the running for Horford. But really, we weren't attracting him here anyway. So yeah, I love the deal. And on the plus side it saves us from Ryan Anderson.

However, I don't see Brooklyn doing it without our 1st round pick. They desperately need to get back into the draft. Although I'm happy to toss in our 1st round pick if they toss in Larkin.

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How reliable is he? I know he had the LeBron to Cleveland before anyone else

I don't think he's terrible.

Pretty rough job. He has to report on teams talking and the majority of the time nothing happens, so they appear to be wrong a lot.

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A 2016 & 2017 1st + Stanley Johnson + Brandon Jennings for Boogie and Marco Belinelli?

Edited by Mr.TaterSalad

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That isn't enough for Cousins.

I added an extra first in my update but also had us getting back Marco Belinelli. Without giving up Drummond, what could we offer that would be enough?

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I added an extra first in my update but also had us getting back Marco Belinelli. Without giving up Drummond, what could we offer that would be enough?

Not much to be honest.

Our draft picks are likely to be out of the lottery so they don't hold a ton of value.

But losing Drummond doesn't matter much if you gain Cousins.

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I'm a big fan of DMC but I wouldn't empty our assets for him.

SVG said there's nothing to Jennings/Young, FWIW. But what did you expect him to say?

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That deal makes sense to me. SVG has gone on the record that they need to build through trade and the draft. Going into the summer when everyone has cap space and getting into bidding wars for Horford and Anderson is very risky. Horford may not want to come here and Anderson is injury prone and plays zero defense. The idea of having cap space kind of goes out the window this summer when everyone will have it. I think this would be the smart, safe bet.

Jennings is a goner. He isn't coming back. Young is still 27, on a nice deal like Del said, and brings a quality all-around game. No he doesn't shoot the 3 very well. But he does everything else better. The guy has 22 double-doubles this year. He's got a mid-range game and can attack off the bounce.... Pair him with Ilyasova and I think we have a decent PF combination moving forward without breaking the bank on one guy.

Don't count out Anderson just because we get Thad Young (I mean, IF we get TY...).

SVG could very easily decline Ersan's 2016 option, let Tolliver walk, sign Anderson, and draft a backup/ developmental PF/C with the #18-20 (or whatever pick we end up with ...) pick.

That would make for a 3-and-no-D and D-and-midrange-no-3pt combination with Anderson and TY.

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I mean what would Anderson bring to the table that Ersan doesn't? Other than the SVG connection I don't get why he is linked to us.

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I mean what would Anderson bring to the table that Ersan doesn't? Other than the SVG connection I don't get why he is linked to us.

Leadership and a big contract?

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Couple thoughts on Anderson, PF, Salaries, etc... (actually, this is ending up a dissertation so, bear with me):

The cap is supposed to bump up to about $90M or so next year... do I have that right? So... I'm going to assume that most of that money (let's say ~$75M or so) will be spent on the top 8 guys, with the balance spent on rookie contract players and bottom of the roster types. That's roughly $10M per player at 8 players, plus roster filler. One or two guys will get the max (hopefully, meaning that you have 1 or 2 superstars WORTH getting max), a few players may slip under the $10M/ per year average, and then you have guys in-between. Stars or really good players, but not superstars, making the ~10M +/-; like Reggie Jackson for us.

Now, I recently saw an article that said Anderson might get max which equals ~$24.9M next year. Now THAT's ridiculous! But the $15M/ year quoted above doesn't necessarily bother me in the sense that we might have 2-3 of those guys. Guys that aren't perfect, not superstars, but bring a LOT to the team. Right now that's Reggie Jackson. I'm not certain that Ryan Anderson should be included in this group, but I'm just following a line of logic here...

So... this leads to some questions... such as, how is the Piston's salary projections for the next few years set up? By player? By fit to the team? Who can we afford, to build the team? Who is the RIGHT person to afford to help build the team? Who becomes expendable, if needed, to make room for a better player/ fit/ salary structure? Etc.

This year we have ~$54M committed to our top 8 players, and that includes Jennings and Tolliver, both of whom could be gone next year. And roughly ~$13M to the bottom 7 players.

Next year, we project to be committed to:

~$24M to Drummond

~$14M to Jackson

~$ 8M to Ilyasova

~$6.5M to Baynes

~$6.3M to Meeks

~$ 5M to Morris

~$ 3M to KCP

~$ 3M to Stanimal

~$2.5M to Anthony

~$1.3M to Bullock

~$900K to Dinwiddie

~$600K to Hilliard

These numbers are approximate because I'm just using current salaries (except for Drummond) and didn't look up future salaries. And a guess on the max for Drummond. That's ~$75M. And Meeks is expendable, IMO; and Anthony to for that matter. And Ilyasova as well, but IF, and ONLY if we get both a starting PF and a better/ cheaper backup PF to replace Ersan. Not an easy task so I'm putting that aside just for the moment. I'm just ruminating thoughts on roster construction. That also makes PF's with set future commitments more valuable than Free Agents (Ibaka at ~$12M at the high performance end, Markieff (~$8M) and Thad Young (~$11-12M) at the lower performance end). Also, we're going to tie ourselves to Drummond, for better or for worse (let's hope that's for the better) and we can go over the cap to sign him if need be.

The biggest holes are a reliable backup to PG (Dinwiddie may or may not be the answer. If he IS the answer at backup, then the need shifts to 3rd PG...); and a starting PF that fits what this team really needs to take the next step, whether that's Anderson or someone else. I also see a need for a defense oriented PF/C to grab a few minutes when you want just that type of player in the game. If he's weak on O, that's OK because you want the defense (say a Biyombo), but if they have some offensive game, so much the better. That's 3 needs that I see. If we dump a current player however, that player would also need to be replaced (IE: Meeks is dumped in a salary move, but then we need a Meeks-replacement at SG; or Ersan is dumped, but then another PF will need to be found to replace him, etc.). But let's just stick with the 3 needs so far.

We have our 1st and 2nd rounder this year? That should get us a drafted PG and/or defensive/developmental frontcourt player, but these are bottom of the roster players. We MIGHT need a better backup PG than what we can draft, if Dinwiddie or the draft pick aren't up to the task. I'm going to table the PG discussion though.

This REALLY all boils down to setting up our future at PF for the next several years. Getting the right player (and Drummond/ RJ/ KCP/ Stanley/ etc. developing correctly) could help propel us to shooting for Championships, and the wrong player could hamstring us salary-wise and cost us a level or two (say... we miss the ECF's due to bad defense, or miss getting into the Championship games due to same...). So this could be an absolutely critical off-season.

Is Anderson the right guy? The wrong guy? Who is on your want list at PF (thru trade or Free Agency), and how do you rank them? This is considering salary/ fit/ etc., for the next 3-4 years. My ranking, at this early stage, would be:

1) Ibaka (~$12M next year, more afterwards)

2) Horford (I think same, or more affordable, than Anderson (due to age) and better all-around fit. But you have to get him away from Atlanta)

3) Terrence Jones (cheaper, younger than anyone else, hope for upside/ bounceback, but he's not a great outside shot)

4) Anderson (at ~15M +/-, I don't think that hamstrings us. Best O fit, but bad on D. Hope for Orlando repeat at avg. 120 O rating vs. avg. 104 D rating, than his Non-Orlando #'s which are closer to average 112 O and 112 D rating. Maybe SVG can get the "best" outta him?)

5) Markieff (good value at $8M per. But I don't see a great fit with a not-good 3-pt shot, average defense. There has to be better options. Especially if we're shooting for the stars. I would certainly dump Ersan for him. Think of Markieff and Morris coming off the bench (with Stanley and "other" PF starting)... they would dominate!)

6) Thad Young (locked in at ~$11M per, same time frame as Markieff. But he's also a subpar option as a starter and imo, should really only be considered as a bench/ replace Ersan option.)

What would your rankings? (to anyone who wants to participate...).

But all of the key factors need to be considered IMO: Salary, fit, Offense and Defense, Age/ Upside/, the fact that we're shooting as high as we can get in the playoffs so subpar options (like Markieff or Thad Young) might not be the best option in trying to attain our goals. But also, availability (Ibaka would not be available UNLESS OKC makes a salary-cap decision against him, and it would cost us in trade...). There's not much in the way of difference-making FA's.

Maybe Horford is the BEST option out there, and we should go ALL OUT trying to get him. Can we get him outta Atlanta? Would it cost a Max contract?

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Detroit can offer Horford something that Atlanta cant, and its something he has wanted in the past. The chance to play PF instead of C.

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Detroit can offer Horford something that Atlanta cant, and its something he has wanted in the past. The chance to play PF instead of C.

Do you max him at age 30?

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Detroit can offer Horford something that Atlanta cant, and its something he has wanted in the past. The chance to play PF instead of C.

Interesting angle.

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Detroit can offer Horford something that Atlanta cant, and its something he has wanted in the past. The chance to play PF instead of C.

That may be our winning move.

Is there someone else who fits along my top 4? Because I'm looking at getting a top 4 (available) guy to get us over the top. And Ibaka isn't currently (and may never be) available. Anderson is bad on D. Terrence Jones has alot of uncertainty at this point and is not a 3-pt threat... I don't know of anyone else that we can get that's a better option than those top 4...

It looks from where I'm sitting at, that we go all out for Horford. And the ability to play him at PF, and also sell him on playing next to Drummond for the next several years, is part of the pitch. Team on the rise, he has a Michigan connection...

All out. For Horford.

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Do you max him at age 30?

That is such a hard question to answer. Under normal cap situations, no. But they are projecting a $108M cap in the summer of 2017. That means you could be getting another $18M in cap space next summer. So maxing someone like Horford at his age might not be that bad.

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Do you max him at age 30?

Yes

edit - let me rephrase. I'm not sure if Horford is 100% a guy I would go all in for, but if I did, his age wouldn't stop me.

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We can always move Meeks ($6.3M), or drop Ersan if we can find a younger, cheaper option at backup PF...

Which begs a question... How much is Terrence Jones going to command this offseason? I don't think he comes cheap. But cheaper than $8M per? That gives incentive to drop Ersan if we could also sign Jones at a cheaper contract. We might be a great destination this off-season also, we're a team on the rise.

Drop Ersan and re-sign Tolliver to back up Horford?

There are moves that we can make if we needed to...

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On a $90M salary cap his first year salary on a max deal would be $27M.

Huge number obviously but it really doesn't mean much. What we care about is the 30% of the cap he would consume.

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On a $90M salary cap his first year salary on a max deal would be $27M.

Huge number obviously but it really doesn't mean much. What we care about is the 30% of the cap he would consume.

Does Horford get the max though? Is he a max player at 30? Can he be gotten at around $20M per? More/ less?

I guess that'll be the great unknown until this summer...

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