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2015 Off-season thread

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As a long time Tiger fan, I am absolutely thrilled at what Avila and Mr. Illitch have done in this offseason. I realize that we have to go through the entire spring training schedule, but I can't wait for this 2016 season to get underway.

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Justin Verlander was just an answer on Jeopardy!

So was Dennis Exclerslay. Well, OK, he wasn't the correct answer for that question.

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I think I McCann. I think I McCann.

(The little engine that could (catch))

In all honesty, I hope the kid has a helluva season. I'm not talking silver slugger or gold glove or all star mention. I mean, that'd be great if he earned those accolades, but I don't see it as possible. I just hope he forms a solid everyday catching tandem with Saltalamacchia, solid at the plate, solid behind the plate. Just go out and be a league average catching duo at league minimum cost to the Tigers. That'd be a helluva season for them in my eyes.

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The Tigers seem persuaded that Pelfrey is poised for a breakout year. If by June 1 Pelfrey's ERA is north of 5 and Greene or one of the other ninos has been unhittable in Toledo they are going to have to figure out how to walk back their continuing rhetoric that only one starting job is open this spring without looking too foolish. OTOH, if Pelfrey performs, that plus JD is going to have people starting to put 'legendary' in front of Avila's name when it comes to player scouting.

That's the thing with Pelfrey's signing. If he can get back to his 2008-2011 of ~ 200 IPs of ~ 4.00 FIP, he becomes a league average pitcher at the end of the rotation. That's not bad. Plus it's simply another arm for depth purposes. He wasn't too far off of that last season.

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How they look in spring doesn't really mean much for those guys. Only an mild indication of relative health/shape.

I think victor's performance this coming season is a big question mark given his health. If he comes out and hits like good victor, and castellanos does nothing to show he's improved at all, then I think it makes a lot of sense to get victor's bat in to the lineup.

That's why I made the initial comment about health. Now, if victor looks healthy and good, but castellanos is crushing it all spring, then I might just say forget it, hoping that nick has turned a corner.

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That's the thing with Pelfrey's signing. If he can get back to his 2008-2011 of ~ 200 IPs of ~ 4.00 FIP, he becomes a league average pitcher at the end of the rotation. That's not bad.

A league average pitcher at the 5th (hell, at the 4th) spot in the rotation would be a tremendous outcome for any team. I really believe fans overrate just how good the typical 4th/5th starters are around the league. League average performance from those spots is an excellent outcome for a team with designs on competing.

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A league average pitcher at the 5th (hell, at the 4th) spot in the rotation would be a tremendous outcome for any team. I really believe fans overrate just how good the typical 4th/5th starters are around the league. League average performance from those spots is an excellent outcome for a team with designs on competing.

I didn't think that the signing was wise, I thought it was an overpay. I still think it is a bit of an overpay. But I am not as pessimistic about it as I previously was.

(1) I never had a problem with pushing arms down a peg in an effort to protect them a bit. I don't want to see Fulmer in the bigs until he's ready. I prefer they take it easy on Greene given his ailment. Boyd didn't seem ready to add to the rotation. Adding someone to fill the role of 4th/5th starter was a necessity.

(2) It won't take much improvement upon his 2015 to be a solid 4th/5th. If the Tigers see something mechanical to add to that improvement, then have at it. If it doesn't work out, he's still going to be able to gobble up some innings while the Tigers can evaluate the Toledo starters.

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.......If the Tigers see something mechanical to add to that improvement, then have at it. If it doesn't work out, he's still going to be able to gobble up some innings while the Tigers can evaluate the Toledo starters.

The reporting seems to be that the Tigers saw that he was effective early in the season but appeared to run out of gas after having a short season in 2014 (23 IP) and think that he may be able to sustain what he did in the 1st half (Twins were 9-6 in his 1st 15 starts, 5-10 in his last) for over a full season this year.

So curiously enough, while Avila said Pelfrey was a scouting signing and not an analytics one, breaking down his aggregate numbers at finer time scales (which is at least a somewhat more nuanced use of statistical data) does support seeing Pelfrey in a different light than his simple season totals.

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So was Dennis Exclerslay. Well, OK, he wasn't the correct answer for that question.

Lol she butchered that one! The other woman got JV though and won the game. Nothing sexier than a female who knows her baseball!!

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Gallardo might be junk. Fowler is good and was a goof fit for the Tigers, but Upton is better.

Yes. It's hard to criticize what A2 did this offseason. While I'd rather have Bob Feller, I can live with Pelfry as the #5 starter.

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I would just sit Vmart, it's not ideal, but more ideal than playing Cabrera and VMart out of position. Also, it would be mostly pointless if we face any LHP, since Castellanos hits LHP fairly well. Maybe just if it's a RHP you could consider this. Though I still wouldn't.

This would be my thinking, against RH'ers only. No reason to put Victor in against LH'ers because he's weaker from the right side anyways IIRC. So Casty at 3rd and Cabrera at 1st is definitely a better option against Lefties...

The question, based on an extreme reluctance to put Victor in the field (don't wanna play with fire with his health, his fielding ability or lack thereof, etc.), I wanna ask is: why not give Salty some time at 1B? He can't be much worse than Victor in the field... and then it comes down to the question of which is more important to our team's success this year: Victors lefty bat against RH'ers, or his health?

If his health is more critical to this team's success than a few interleague games against RH'ers, than Salty at 1st should be considered an option. Hell, teach him 3rd and leave Cabrera at 1st. Would Salty be that much worse than Castellanos at 3rd? (Probably yes... just being a bit rhetorical here...)

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What was the question? About Cy Young-MVP winners?

The category was something like "strikeout pitchers." I recall the first question being something like "he has the most strikeouts and the most walks" (Nolan Ryan). The question about JV showed his pic and said something about him winning the Cy Young and MVP IIRC

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I was watching from the kitchen while I was doing dishes. I could barely see the TV but I got all those in that category. I am not even sure what the category was called, but it was all about pitchers.

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Gallardo might be junk. Fowler is good and was a goof fit for the Tigers, but Upton is better.

Replace Zimmermann and Upton with:

Maybin and Pelfrey, and then answer that question again. If we use Maybin's 2017 team option, then basically we would have Maybin and Pelfrey for 2016 and 2017 for roughly $34M IIRC.

So... would we rather have Maybin and Pelfrey for two years and $34M? Or Fowler (I really liked the idea of signing him a lot) and Gallardo (or substitute any other 5th starter option that signed this offseason that you may prefer) for 3 and 2 years for $55M.

Personally, I like the 1 year contract that Latos signed, and would have preferred that, or even signing back Simon for a year, over the Pelfrey contract.

These are minor quibbles, and I like what AA has done overall. But I still would have preferred Fowler, and I still would have preferred Simon as our 5th starter (he's no worse than Pelfrey) on a 1 year cheap contract. And I like Simon, significantly because he is someone that could've been pushed into the Bullpen by Greene or Fulmer, later in the year, where he (Simon) has performed quite well previously. Pelfrey might be able to do exactly the same... but then there's the cost difference. This is EXACTLY why I think Pelfrey was not a good signing, and would've preferred Simon for 1 year with the ability to push him into the bullpen (just around the corner, IMO).

Minor issues. But I said my piece.

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A league average pitcher at the 5th (hell, at the 4th) spot in the rotation would be a tremendous outcome for any team. I really believe fans overrate just how good the typical 4th/5th starters are around the league. League average performance from those spots is an excellent outcome for a team with designs on competing.

On THIS basis I am fine with the Pelfrey signing. I understand what AA was looking for in his 5th starter (or 4th if we're calling Norris the 5th...).

I just had a different direction/ cost in mind.

By the end of this season, rightly or wrongly, I pictured two out of three of Norris/ Fulmer/ Greene at the back end of the rotation, and our FA 5th starter pushed into the bullpen.

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...

By the end of this season, rightly or wrongly, I pictured two out of three of Norris/ Fulmer/ Greene at the back end of the rotation, and our FA 5th starter pushed into the bullpen.

I would agree to the point that I believe if the Tigers are to have a really successful - i.e. 95 win range - season, then it will be because Norris and Greene are both exceeding expectations as starters and either Pelfrey has been dealt or sent to the Pen, or Sanchez is hurt or has been traded. I'm not expecting to see the Tigers finish the season with both Greene and Norris in the rotation, (or even Fulmer) but I think that if we want to look at maximum upside *potential* - that's were it would be. At this point those two guys have upside to #2 and #3 in the rotation levels if they both maximized their potential - not that it is ever all that likely for any guy to do that, let alone two.

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McCan't.

McCannot for those who refuse to apostrophize.

McCancel those World Series tickets if he's catching....

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Sanchez not fully participating in workouts due to undisclosed injury. Id be stunned if he threw more than 140 innings this year.

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Wow, Fowler to the Cubs on a 1-year deal. It had been reported he was going to the O's on a 3 year deal. That's quite the last second reversal. I guess that deal was never finalized.

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Wow, Fowler to the Cubs on a 1-year deal. It had been reported he was going to the O's on a 3 year deal. That's quite the last second reversal. I guess that deal was never finalized.

From what I understand, Fowler wanted a 1 year opt out from the O's and they balked because they didn't want to give up a draft pick for potentially only 1 season of him.

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From what I understand, Fowler wanted a 1 year opt out from the O's and they balked because they didn't want to give up a draft pick for potentially only 1 season of him.

They should've, could have QO'd him and gotten a higher pick back next year.

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From what I understand, Fowler wanted a 1 year opt out from the O's and they balked because they didn't want to give up a draft pick for potentially only 1 season of him.

Didn't the Orioles give up a draft pick for one year of Nelson Cruz? I wonder how this will affect the Orioles? There seems to be a couple supposedly done deals that were undone with this team.

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They should've, could have QO'd him and gotten a higher pick back next year.

The O's got semi-burned with Wieters though, and have to now pay him $15.8 million to be an oft-injured, mediocre catcher. I can see why they may not wanted to have rolled those dice.

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