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Cespedes to Mets

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I think we will have closer to 60 million to spend next season.

I just ran it, using some Arbitration estimates for some guys and minor increases for pre-arb guys. Looks like it's closer to $47.6 million to spend, to get us back to $178.8 million, which is what Cots says we started 2015 at.

Fielder money starts in 2016 (I'm sure you already know that). Cabrera gets a $6 million bump and VMart gets $4 million more.

I put JD at $6 million, and Iglesias and AlAl at $3 million each. Nick and Romine at $1 million each. I left room for five free agents and filled in the rest with pre-arb estimates.

Edit: Also $1 million for the Nathan buyout.

Edited by ballmich

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Reasons for Ces to not come back?

1. City of Detroit. Better than Havana, but it's not Boston or Frisco. Detroit's a little rough.

2. Termperature - Like Jack Lemmon, Some Like it Hot.

3. Mgr

We did let him play LF only which is good I suppose.

I suppose I can always remember now that we got Cessa for Ces. But not Price for Prince.

He sure seemed to get himself out of Boston fairly quickly, so I'm guessing it may not hold the same appeal to him as it may to others.

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When is our TV deal up? I thought we had one coming soon. If so maybe Illitch spends a little more to make sure we keep up our high TV ratings next year.

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I disagree. It's one of the few things that helps the smaller markets compete in the absence of a salary cap.

And if we end up picking in the top ten it wouldn't matter to us anyhow. And with our subtractions I think that is a real possibility.

I think it's fine to have a comp pick round 1a for teams that lose elite FAs, but I don't think teams signing FAs should be punished and lose their pick.

It artificially limits the market for players and keeps many teams out of the discussion for players they'd otherwise be interested in.

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I think it's fine to have a comp pick round 1a for teams that lose elite FAs, but I don't think teams signing FAs should be punished and lose their pick.

It artificially limits the market for players and keeps many teams out of the discussion for players they'd otherwise be interested in.

That's kind of the point. The players agreed to it as well. Shouldn't really matter to fans. Its how MLB and the players deciced to do business. Its as relevant to us as what kind of hotel they stay in.

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I think it's fine to have a comp pick round 1a for teams that lose elite FAs, but I don't think teams signing FAs should be punished and lose their pick.

It artificially limits the market for players and keeps many teams out of the discussion for players they'd otherwise be interested in.

I agree. I also think it should take more than just a QO to get it. I think you should have to submit a multi year deal at a competitive rate and show that you are really trying to sign the player before getting it. Not just put out a half assed QO that you know they are never going to accept. You shouldn't get compensated when you don't put forth the effort to keep them.

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Some more good stuff on Fulmer:

All of these teams did it by using the stockpile of prospects they had been building in the bad years — all gave away some tomorrow for today. A scout who had recently seen Michael Fulmer likened him to a young Matt Garza or Garrett Richards. One reason the Mets were willing to give up Zack Wheeler for Gomez or for Jay Bruce was the sense Fulmer was coming in the left lane. So the Mets had to endure some pain to get Cespedes.

7 trade deadline takeways: How misery fueled biggest buyers | New York Post

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So we got (in order of age):

- Boyd (LHP, 24 yrs, MLB - 2 games, 6th round, 2013) - nice peripherals, could be a real sleeper....if he doesn't develop a changeup he could be a nice bullpen guy, maybe in 2016.

- Cessa (RHP. 23 yrs, AAA, undrafted, 2008 FA) - nice peripherals, great changeup, two-pitches, velocity issues....we'll see, probably middle-relief help in 2016

- Jones (SS, 23 yrs, AA, 3rd round, 2013) - struggling mightily to hit A-ball pitching at age 23 over the last two years...some pop there. Seems like a reach.

- Fulmer (RHP, 22 yrs, AA, 1st round, 2013) - eating up AA pitching...two-pitches, injury issues...maybe able to help in bullpen in 2016?

- Norris (LHP, 22 yrs, MLB - 10 games, 2nd round, 2011) - already getting a shot in the rotation...will he continue to progress after elbow surgery?

- Labourt (LHP, 21 yrs, A, undrafted, 2011 FA) - looks like a project, maybe ready in 2017/2018

Norris is already in the rotation, and I'm guessing that 3 others (Cessa, Fulmer and Boyd) get shots at big-league time in 2016.

Seems to me that Norris is the only one who stands a decent chance of sticking in the rotation.

The other 3 look like bullpen candidates, and not bad ones.

Not a bad haul.

If we get Cespedes back and acquire a top-15 starter, these trades would work out fine.

Edited by sabretooth
mixed up Boyd and Cessa's handedness

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Guys I have a question.

I'm not near the baseball guy that most of you are so I need to ask.

Do baseball contracts ever get restructured? We see it routinely in the NFL, and I was just wondering if (hypothetically) restructuring, say Verlander's contract, is a possibility?

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Guys I have a question.

I'm not near the baseball guy that most of you are so I need to ask.

Do baseball contracts ever get restructured? We see it routinely in the NFL, and I was just wondering if (hypothetically) restructuring, say Verlander's contract, is a possibility?

I've never heard of it and I don't think the union would allow it anyway. I maybe wrong but I think the NFL restructures them just for salary cap reasons, they just shuffle some money to bonuses etc. to create more room. With no cap in baseball that really isn't necessary. I guess they probably would be able to do a Scherzer thing and spread the total amount over 15 years or something, if Verlander wanted that of course.

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I agree with this. I can't help but have mixed feelings about all these deals. They had to do this because they are losers this year, but they did add some good prospects to an empty system. I also like that they are mostly upper level guys, so we can find out about them quickly. This should make off-season building easier.

Price I agreed with because I saw no way he'd be coming back here, even if we could (or wanted to) afford him. 3 LHP? It would be great if they at least turned into a #3 and #5 SP. Or at least be pieces we use to get a SP.

Soria? I really think that the kid we got for him is going to be good, maybe very good. We may look back on this trade as one of the best ever for the Tigers.

Mike Trout Jr.? My head tells me no but my heart says "Hell, Yeah"

Cespedes? I would have preferred to hear he was extended for three (or four) years. I just hope we find a true LF in the off-season. Cespedes would be my top choice but there very well could be several other options. But I really think we're going to get a 5 tool player for LF in 2016.

Huge number of arms acquired, all with the same name, prospect. Daniel Norris shouldn't be starting Sunday, why rush him on a lost season? And maybe destroy his confidence?

But maybe the worst was keeping Davis (and Avila). I guess we need an OF and C/1st Base, but I would rather see kids out there.

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I've never heard of it and I don't think the union would allow it anyway. I maybe wrong but I think the NFL restructures them just for salary cap reasons, they just shuffle some money to bonuses etc. to create more room. With no cap in baseball that really isn't necessary. I guess they probably would be able to do a Scherzer thing and spread the total amount over 15 years or something, if Verlander wanted that of course.

Okay thanks, that's what I figured.

I was just wondering because, even though there's no salary cap per se -- teams do have a cap of sorts that's predicated on how much an owner/franchise is willing to spend, so I was curious as to whether restructuring a current contract to free up spending money elsewhere would be possible.

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Daniel Norris shouldn't be starting Sunday, why rush him on a lost season? And maybe destroy his confidence?

Yeah this is definitely a concern of mine as well.

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I also don't really like the fact that Norris is starting on Sunday. He seems to be having a down year, I'd rather him stay in the minors this year and work on things. Having him come up and start in Camden Yards when he is struggling just doesn't seem necessary to me.

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Finally sitting down to watch the game with a cold one, but is anyone else concerned about starting Norris so soon? Might hurt his confidence or something.

jm2c

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When is our TV deal up? I thought we had one coming soon. If so maybe Illitch spends a little more to make sure we keep up our high TV ratings next year.

That's not our limit.

The limit is when the Tax Penalties kick in. Ilitch won't authorize paying Tax Penalties. The Tax Cap is $189MM for 2015 and for 2016 as well, I believe.

You have to subtract ~$12MM for mandated Benefits. So... our Hard Cap (per Ilitch's direction) will be $177MM. But you don't go into the season aginst that #... you have top leave a few $MM for "just in case" needs. Which means peg us for about $173-174MM at the start of 2016.

Ballmich is correct, in an earlier post after calculating Raises and Arb cases, etc., I calculated us having between $45-50MM available to sign FA's, depending on what we do with Feliz's option. Ballmich has us at $47.6MM. Sounds about right.

So that's our 2016 Budget to spend on FA's: ~$47.6MM.

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So we got (in order of age):

... Norris is already in the rotation, and I'm guessing that 3 others (Cessa, Fullmer and Boyd) get shots at big-league time in 2016.

Seems to me that Norris is the only one who stands a decent chance of sticking in the rotation.

The other 3 look like bullpen candidates, and not bad ones.

Not a bad haul.

If we get Cespedes back and acquire a top-15 starter, these trades would work out fine.

I like the looks of Fulmer & Boyd as well.

Fulmer seems like he could be a mid-rotation guy. Boyd a 5th starter. If they don't get that far... then stick 'em in the BP as long relievers.

But I could really see us getting two starters out of this (Norris/ Fulmer) and other useful arms (looks like LaBourt could be a very high-leverage BP arm) for the BP, or for trade.

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I like the looks of Fulmer & Boyd as well.

Fulmer seems like he could be a mid-rotation guy. Boyd a 5th starter. If they don't get that far... then stick 'em in the BP as long relievers.

But I could really see us getting two starters out of this (Norris/ Fulmer) and other useful arms (looks like LaBourt could be a very high-leverage BP arm) for the BP, or for trade.

Of the guys other than Norris, I actually like Boyd the most...he's pretty much ready to go at the big-league level as a LHer.

Fulmer and Cessa need a 3rd pitch.

LaBourt just seems like a shot in the dark, but you never know.

Edited by sabretooth
Had Boyd and Cessa mixed-up...whoops

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...Soria? I really think that the kid we got for him is going to be good, maybe very good. We may look back on this trade as one of the best ever for the Tigers. Mike Trout Jr.? My head tells me no but my heart says "Hell, Yeah"...

Absolutely NO possible way. He has power, speed, and athleticism. But has a sucky hit tool (averaging .250 in the minors) and draws very few walks. Think more along the lines of a Craig Counsell, but with power. A scrappy 2nd baseman who is useful.

At best.

But I would be very fine with useful if he can be the RH'ed part of a platoon in CF with Gose, or a backup there, and a backup at 2B too.

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Of the guys other than Norris, I actually like Cessa the most...he's pretty much ready to go at the big-league level as a LHer, and I think could be effective as a starter or in the 'pen.

Fulmer needs to add a 3rd pitch and Boyd just doesn't have the velocity to be an effective starter IMO. Between the two, Fulmer has the better chance I think.

LaBourt just seems like a shot in the dark, but you never know.

I was watching highlights on MLB.com of Boyd's Major League debut and judging by that he appeared to have the stuff to be a decent starter. He topped out at 96 and when his FB was around 92-93 it appeared to have some life to it. He also mixed in some nasty sliders. He ended up striking out 7 with 12 swings and misses. So not bad for an MLB debut.

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Of the guys other than Norris, I actually like Cessa the most...he's pretty much ready to go at the big-league level as a LHer, and I think could be effective as a starter or in the 'pen.

Fulmer needs to add a 3rd pitch and Boyd just doesn't have the velocity to be an effective starter IMO. Between the two, Fulmer has the better chance I think.

LaBourt just seems like a shot in the dark, but you never know.

Couple things:

Cessa actually is a RH'er... Boyd is the LH'er. These two actually look pretty similar to me. Neither are overpowering (although Boyd was getting 9K's/9 in the high minors, Cessa 7K's/9 high minors). Both have good control it appears (keeping walks to a minimum). So they're both 5th starter/ long reliever types, it looks like to me.

Fulmer is the key though. His stuff and arm are more overpowering than either of these two, scouting reports have him much higher... He might not be ready at Opening Day 2016, but I think he's knocking on the door by mid-season. He should be a better starter than either of those two... but at this point, he's still a prospect. Don't know how he turns out... but his upside is higher than Cessa or Boyd's.

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I was watching highlights on MLB.com of Boyd's Major League debut and judging by that he appeared to have the stuff to be a decent starter. He topped out at 96 and when his FB was around 92-93 it appeared to have some life to it. He also mixed in some nasty sliders. He ended up striking out 7 with 12 swings and misses. So not bad for an MLB debut.

That's why I like Boyd next best after Norris and Fulmer.

I actually like his "pitchability" upside quite a lot.

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Plus, he's a late-bloomer who added several MPH's this year. If he has good command of his pitches, there's some upside...

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What do you think about the Tigers selling?

Cespedes: "I don’t think that was a very smart move. The team is only three games out of the wild card, and there is still a lot of baseball to be played -- about 60 games. I don’t think it was a good decision to throw in the towel this early. There’s still a lot of baseball to be played. But I know this is a business, and I am sure they know what they’re doing."

Yoenis Cespedes: 'I think the Mets are a team that can go very far' - Mets Blog - ESPN

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