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2016 Presidential Election - Who will the nominees be? Make your prediction here.

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Whats amazing to me are the idiots that believe Hillary.

I'm voting for her over any Republican and it isn't close.

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Its not that hard to figure out. When you believe what you say and your positions are born of your own logic and conviction it gives you the ability to challenge your opponents. When all your positions are born of media analysis, campaign triangulation calculation and handler's advice, you don't have the intellectual tools or courage to take on a Trump. Even an idiot who believes what he says is a big challenge for a bunch of empty suits.

Bernie and Rand.

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A snippet from the article. I'm removing the words Hitler and Germans. Insert Trump and Republican.

"Yet you had Americans meeting _______ and saying, "This guy is a clown. He's like a caricature of himself." And a lot of them went through this whole litany about how even if __________ got into a position of power, other ________________ politicians would somehow be able to control him. A lot of ______________ politicians believed this themselves."

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I am more referring to the other candidates. It surprised and troubled me that there was nary a peep, for example, to McCain being called out.

It does seem like so many are afraid to call him out for what are un-defendable positions, or to at least to debate him on specifics, if the DO disagree with him.

It just seems bizarre.

Some candidates have. Perry went after earlier comments, as have Bush, Graham, Carly...actually pretty much all of them with the exception of Cruz. And each time they do, Trump has called them stupid, morons, losers, etc. Then he prances around and takes credit for their polling numbers sliding.

There isn't a way to attack him, he's vicious and makes it personal. He doesn't stay on topic...when Graham challenged him on the McCain comments he gave out his phone number. And Clinton, Sanders or anybody else wouldn't handle him any better. It's up to voters to reject him.

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They keep waiting for him to go away.

What's the plan when he doesn't?

I just think they're playing it much too safe, and they're going to be stuck with him through the whole cycle because they haven't displayed a united front.

It's probably already too late.

Any moderate Republican is already wondering what the hell happened.

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It blows my mind some of the people that support or defend him. Mark Levin for one.

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They keep waiting for him to go away.

What's the plan when he doesn't?

I just think they're playing it much too safe, and they're going to be stuck with him through the whole cycle because they haven't displayed a united front.

It's probably already too late.

Any moderate Republican is already wondering what the hell happened.

Are you saying THEY as in the candidates again? Because the candidates make up about 19 votes. Wouldn't even move the needle in his support.

Its the people who are supporting him.

But hey, I think Bernie should be asking Hillary about why she scrubbed her email server or whatever she did. There's a possible crime. Why aren't Dems standing up to figure out of there is a criminal running for the Dems?

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Some candidates have. Perry went after earlier comments, as have Bush, Graham, Carly...actually pretty much all of them with the exception of Cruz. And each time they do, Trump has called them stupid, morons, losers, etc. Then he prances around and takes credit for their polling numbers sliding.

There isn't a way to attack him, he's vicious and makes it personal. He doesn't stay on topic...when Graham challenged him on the McCain comments he gave out his phone number. And Clinton, Sanders or anybody else wouldn't handle him any better. It's up to voters to reject him.

I'm calling BS on that. When they're involved, it's a different voting bloc. That's a huge reason why the other candidates won't attack him. It's weak. Don't forget there's roughly ~50% or so that are pointing and laughing right now.

Edited by pfife

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But hey, I think Bernie should be asking Hillary about why she scrubbed her email server or whatever she did. There's a possible crime. Why aren't Dems standing up to figure out of there is a criminal running for the Dems?

Good question.

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I'm calling BS on that. When they're involved, it's a different voting bloc. That's a huge reason why the other candidates won't attack him. It's weak. Don't forget there's roughly ~50% or so that are pointing and laughing right now.

Until this weekend what policy position did you expect them to attack? They have called him out, every one of them with the exception of Cruz, and he's personally attacked them. And if you think Clinton or Sanders wouldn't be tongue tied by his tactics I think you're wrong. In fact we have already seen how Clinton did when Obama made even subtle swipes, like "you're likeable enough."

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Until this weekend what policy position did you expect them to attack? They have called him out, every one of them with the exception of Cruz, and he's personally attacked them. And if you think Clinton or Sanders wouldn't be tongue tied by his tactics I think you're wrong. In fact we have already seen how Clinton did when Obama made even subtle swipes, like "you're likeable enough."

Yeah I remember Hillary attacking Obama a lot. She wouldn't stand there and take **** from him.

I'll be honest, I don't know how Sanders would be. I suspect he wouldn't have the calculus that it's politically disadvantageous to attack Trump, which is what's going on here. I also suspect he's too principled to fight dirty, where Clinton reminds me of someone who throws dirt in someone's eyes in a street fight.

Tongue tied? Seriously? I'd say a severe case of jelly spine. At any rate, getting tongue tied around the Donald isn't really a ringing endorsement for any of these candidates.

Edited by pfife

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Its not that hard to figure out. When you believe what you say and your positions are born of your own logic and conviction it gives you the ability to challenge your opponents. When all your positions are born of media analysis, campaign triangulation calculation and handler's advice, you don't have the intellectual tools or courage to take on a Trump. Even an idiot who believes what he says is a big challenge for a bunch of empty suits.

Come on now, Trump just issued his first position paper. This isn't about courage or intellectual tools, nor has he waged his campaign thus far on that foundation. I think you are really missing the anger that exists on the right.

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Come on now, Trump just issued his first position paper. This isn't about courage or intellectual tools, nor has he waged his campaign thus far on that foundation. I think you are really missing the anger that exists on the right.

I know how much anger exists on the right, and it's the GOP's big problem, because they have a bunch of voters mad as hell and trying like crazy to drive the bus, but they don't represent numbers sufficient to elect anyone in a general election. And that is primarily the legacy of Limbaugh and Ailes and Co. For 20 years they have been stoking the fires of discontent on the right, but when the fire stopped getting bigger they made the mistake (well, not for them - but for the GOP) of just settling for making it hotter. Good for Cable and radio ratings, not so good for electoral politics.

Edited by Gehringer_2

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Yeah I remember Hillary attacking Obama a lot. She wouldn't stand there and take **** from him.

I'll be honest, I don't know how Sanders would be. I suspect he wouldn't have the calculus that it's politically disadvantageous to attack Trump, which is what's going on here. I also suspect he's too principled to fight dirty, where Clinton reminds me of someone who throws dirt in someone's eyes in a street fight.

Tongue tied? Seriously? I'd say a severe case of jelly spine. At any rate, getting tongue tied around the Donald isn't really a ringing endorsement for any of these candidates.

I don't remember Clinton ever having a good come back to an Obama swipe. Trump hits below the belt. So is Sanders jelly spined or civil? I suspect he is civil and might not be prepared for Trump. Regardless, everyone of the Republicans excepting Cruz, have responded to Trump. I'm not sure what you want them to do.

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I know how much anger exists on the right, and it's the GOP's big problem, because they have a bunch of voters mad as hell and trying like crazy to drive the bus, but they don't represent numbers sufficient to elect anyone in a general election. And that is primarily the legacy of Limbaugh and Ailes and Co. For 20 years they have been stoking the fires of discontent on the right, but when the fire stopped getting bigger they made the mistake (well, not for them - but for the GOP) of just settling for making it hotter. Good for Cable and radio ratings, not so good for electoral politics.

LMAO!

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I know how much anger exists on the right, and it's the GOP's big problem, because they have a bunch of voters mad as hell and trying like crazy to drive the bus, but they don't represent numbers sufficient to elect anyone in a general election. And that is primarily the legacy of Limbaugh and Ailes and Co. For 20 years they have been stoking the fires of discontent on the right, but when the fire stopped getting bigger they made the mistake (well, not for them - but for the GOP) of just settling for making it hotter. Good for Cable and radio ratings, not so good for electoral politics.

I don't think the anger on the right is being driven by Fox News. In fact, Fox News is considered part of the problem by many of those fueling the anger. The funny thing is that Glen Beck who Fox determined to be too far out there is the only one of the conservative talking heads I know of who has called Trump out. In fact, he called him a "son of a b**ch, loser."

Are you suggesting that non-conservative media doesn't sew seeds of discontent? Or is it just that those are valid seeds?

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You can be put on ignore site-wide, permanently.

I realize that.

I'm talking about a mod that associates Trump with Hitler. I really don't care to hear or read what she has to say after that.

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... In fact, Fox News is considered part of the problem by many of those fueling the anger...

Indeed. But that is just the conservative media movement reaping the very same whirlwind they have been sowing for a long time.

And I would not argue that the left has not tried to mirror Fox - obviously MSNBC being the case in point, but it hasn't worked the same way. The target demographics at MSNBC are just not as interested in being mad about politics as the target demo on the right. The more 'Angry' liberals like Ed Schultz have not found wide audience. In fact on the left its the satirists like John Stewart that have the movement's pulse and ear. There are probably a thousand interesting and complex sociological reasons why that is true, but it is what it is. EDIT: also why I think an "angry guy" like Bernie is going to have a hard time expanding his base enough......

Ailes started FXN with a mission, which was to help empower conservatives in American politics. This is not anything controversial to say, he had said it openly. It's not a secret, and that is fine, it is his 1st amendment right. But somewhere along the line, either in the competition with the most strident voices for ratings, or just momentum, he ended up contributing in a big way to the creation of the Donald, and now the GOP establishment, which is where Ailes comes from, is not happy about it. To the degree that Ailes were to try to use Fox to tamp down the fervor, it is exactly going to cost him more people/viewers thinking Fox 'is part of the problem'. I guess he is just now more a slave to his ratings than to his original ideology, otherwise I wouldn't have imagined him throwing a prized understudy like Megyn Kelly under the bus to the extent of personally pleading with Trump last week not to embargo Fox.

Edited by Gehringer_2

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