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John_Brian_K

Campbell Ewald Returning to Detroit

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Not to mention the 2% payroll tax cut expired recently. I am familar with that area in Warren as I used to work there out of college and would drive by. Lots of places around to eat and run quick errands if you had to. That's gone by moving to Detroit. But "Hey, it's cool to be down here....."

(edit- I see Zimm said the Van Dyke area's dead now.... that could be. I worked out there in 1998/1999. That was one of the things I liked about it. Lots of places to eat out for lunch. But that was before kids when doing that wasn't an issue)

This is exactly the reason it is a good idea for the city. 600 extra employees in that one little area....right next to an already bustling Comerica Park and Ford Field...do you think that will spark some growth in the area?

I know I was already looking at the areas immediately around there because of all the extra foot traffic (on a daily basis, not just during baseball/football season)...how long before we start seeing a few small business open up in that area? Maybe never, but my money would be on soon.

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And that would help negate their reason for moving in the first place.....

But I have seen cases in the past where companies that moved to Detroit did adjust compensation to accommodate the new tax.

I personally would hate working downtown. Then again, I work 2.3 miles from home and go home nearly every day for lunch so I guess I'm spoiled.

Not if the overall benefit is still in their favor. Save 10% on rent and have to pay an extra 2% in salary....now that 2% in salary MAY very well be more than what they are saving or it may NOT. Neither one of us knows. I was looking at the possible solution to a possible problem.

I would hope the company would do SOMETHING a little more than they normally would for the employees.

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3 things that would need to happen to bolster this area IMO:

1. Somehow, someway move Detroit Thermal...it is in a prime location and there is no need for an industrial type heating company to be there anymore. This is a SERIOUS pipe dream though because of all the pipe work and infrastructure that would need to move in order to supplant that building.

2. Build a parking garage across the street from the Frank Murphy Hall for employee parking.

3. Then turn that block at Gratiot/Chrysler/Mullett/St Antoine into a tailgate area for football games....nothing fancy....just lay down some concrete, add some gates and maybe a small building for bathrooms or something and off you go.

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Not if the overall benefit is still in their favor. Save 10% on rent and have to pay an extra 2% in salary....now that 2% in salary MAY very well be more than what they are saving or it may NOT. Neither one of us knows. I was looking at the possible solution to a possible problem.

I would hope the company would do SOMETHING a little more than they normally would for the employees.

I think we can be assured that the company would only do this if felt it would increase their revenue/exposure. From what I can tell it is 1.2% for non-residents (which is definitely better than 3%) and it will cost the company 2.4%...which should be a substantial amount of money. Obviously it is probably being sold to the employee as a move that could increase compensation/job security for both of them in the long run. I worked downtown for a while, and it was a rough commute.

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I don't care how you break it down, it is $1,500 a year per $50,000. It's like the time share salesmen I recently talked to. He kept asking me, "How much can I afford a month? $50? $100?" The time share was $12,000. The total cost was what I cared about. $1,500 a year is a lot of money...at least to me it is, even if it is simply $125 a month or $31.25 a week (I don't make $50,000 so perhaps the tax wouldn't matter as much if I did)

Again, hopefully the employees see a decent jump in sales and it off sets the 3% tax, and/or it keeps the company from going under.

EDIT: Is my math wrong or wouldn't the tax be closer to $.75 an hour on a normal 40 hour work week for someone making $50,000 a year? (That seems way too high to me)

I was being sarcastic.

And I was assuming all hours in a day on a $1500 tax bill, as opposed to working hours. If it is based on working hours, someone paying $1500 would pay roughly $0.75 per working hour.

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This is exactly the reason it is a good idea for the city. 600 extra employees in that one little area....right next to an already bustling Comerica Park and Ford Field...do you think that will spark some growth in the area?

I know I was already looking at the areas immediately around there because of all the extra foot traffic (on a daily basis, not just during baseball/football season)...how long before we start seeing a few small business open up in that area? Maybe never, but my money would be on soon.

No I do not think it will make any difference to the area. Its 600 people not 3000 like an auto plant.

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I was being sarcastic.

And I was assuming all hours in a day on a $1500 tax bill, as opposed to working hours. If it is based on working hours, someone paying $1500 would pay roughly $0.75 per working hour.

Oh, I'm sorry! I missed the sarcasm.

I'm glad we don't use all hours of the day when talking about our pay wages. I'd be making less than $5 an hour! LOL

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3 things that would need to happen to bolster this area IMO:

1. Somehow, someway move Detroit Thermal...it is in a prime location and there is no need for an industrial type heating company to be there anymore. This is a SERIOUS pipe dream though because of all the pipe work and infrastructure that would need to move in order to supplant that building.

2. Build a parking garage across the street from the Frank Murphy Hall for employee parking.

3. Then turn that block at Gratiot/Chrysler/Mullett/St Antoine into a tailgate area for football games....nothing fancy....just lay down some concrete, add some gates and maybe a small building for bathrooms or something and off you go.

Who pays for all of that and what is their incentive for doing it?

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No I do not think it will make any difference to the area. Its 600 people not 3000 like an auto plant.

I completely disagree, but we can leave it at that...nothing to gain trying to change the others mind.

I will revisit it a year or 2 from now and see if there was any change in the area.

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Who pays for all of that and what is their incentive for doing it?

For #1: Noone because it will never happen, but for S&G's Detroit Thermal would pay for it and the city would kick in with some kind of benefit for the company moving...do not ask for specifics because I do not have them and just guessing here.

2: The city would pay for it as it would be used for a city owned/operated building. I have had to go to Frank Murphy quite a bit...parking around that area SUCKS bigtime. The incentive? Simply improving the city by adding adequate parking.

3: A private investor that sees profit there.

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I completely disagree, but we can leave it at that...nothing to gain trying to change the others mind.

I will revisit it a year or 2 from now and see if there was any change in the area.

I have to agree with Oblong. I don't think you'll see much in terms of new business because 600 people move to that area of Detroit. I haven't been to that area in about a year or so (I live in GA now), but it seemed they had enough small businesses around there to easily take care of an influx of 600 people. They should see a bump in monthly sales, but I don't think it would make a big difference overall on the amount of businesses that this company would attract to that area.

We'll have to see. I hope you are right. I would LOVE to see that area start to boom again.

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No I do not think it will make any difference to the area. Its 600 people not 3000 like an auto plant.

Now there are 600 more car radios to steal. So it actually will help the economy in more ways than one.

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No I do not think it will make any difference to the area. Its 600 people not 3000 like an auto plant.

I don't know what the effect ratio would be, but I think office workers would have some ratio of greater effect on an area than an auto plant. A plant is a closed/gated space and most of the hourlies are going to interact relatively less than office workers who can run out to do errands and eat lunch -etc. Of course the tax potential of industrial use can be a lot higher - no argument there.

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I have to agree with Oblong. I don't think you'll see much in terms of new business because 600 people move to that area of Detroit. I haven't been to that area in about a year or so (I live in GA now), but it seemed they had enough small businesses around there to easily take care of an influx of 600 people. They should see a bump in monthly sales, but I don't think it would make a big difference overall on the amount of businesses that this company would attract to that area.

We'll have to see. I hope you are right. I would LOVE to see that area start to boom again.

Within walking distance there really is only Elwoods for food. I am talking about lunch time traffic mainly. You can get to Greektown relatively easy, but not realistically for an hour lunch...maybe Woodward and Hockeytown, but more realistic that way would be Chelis. I would nto be shocked at all to see a deli of some sort open up across the street. You have the court right there and now more foot traffic with Ewald for daily business and another option for the hordes during baseball and football games.

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I don't care how you break it down, losing $1,500 from your salary would suck. It shouldn't stop people from eating or paying the bills, but it would easily make life less comfortable for those families making around $50,000 a year. Hopefully this increased expense due to moving is offset by increased revenue to the company and thusly (hopefully), an increase in everyone's pay.

People are not likely to receive a pay increase.

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I've worked in advertising (both agency and sales sides) for the past 15 years (and yes, I want out). Unless your office is on mahogany row your average employee is probably lucky if they earn 40k a year and you'd better plan on being with the company at least 5 years to make that (yes there are those who make more but I'd say your under 40k are the majority earning somewhere between 25k-40k).

As for moving to the city to be closer to work. I worked in the Fisher Bldg for a little over 3 years and would not want to work, or live, in Detroit again. Aside from the city taxes safety continues to be an issue. The apartments, flats, etc around the few thriving areas such as Mid-Town are filling up quickly and rent is not as cheap as some might like to believe.

Then there is shopping. Where do you go. Sure they are opening a Whole Foods but not everyone can afford to shop there. There is Honeybee Market in Mexicantown and Eastern Market which is more seasonal. The grocery shopping options are few and any other shopping you might have to do (say Target, Meijer, Home Depot, etc) will require you to drive to the suburbs. So now you're putting added wear and tear on your car and your gas expenses go up -- as do gas prices in the city. And let's not forget the cost of car insurance, even if you can walk to work you're still likely to have your car. You can expect your insurance rates to skyrocket. The last 2 places I lived were near the borders of Detroit and my car insurance rates took a beating due to the proximity to Detroit.

And as NML84 said, don't expect to receive a pay increase. Some ad agencies might be better than others but they are mostly sweatshops. Lots of revolving doors as people move from agency to agency hoping to score a better position with better pay.

I had been eyeballing jobs at C.E. but with the move they are definitely off my list. It would cost me too much.

Edited by Velma Dinkley

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People are not likely to receive a pay increase.

Like I said, I hope they would see some bonuses if revenue significantly increased after the move.

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Look at this guy: Campbell Ewald - Dave Lockwood

"Good Jazz. Good Conversation. What Else Do You Need?"

Come on.

As for Ian Lavavich, he was the right man at the right time. The old guys who were terrified of "The Internet" were crapping their Depends Undergarments, and he just stepped up and said he was an expert. They all believed him. But he is not a creative.

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Like I said, I hope they would see some bonuses if revenue significantly increased after the move.

I would be SHOCKED if that happens. CE thinks they are an elite agency that people are dying to get into. And they treat you like that. Like "hey we could get anyone to do your job and pay them less." I've worked at Campbell Ewald, Doner, McCann Erickson, Team Detroit and GSW in Columbus. I loved all of them and would recommend them to anyone except Campbell Ewald. If i know them (and i do) this new, hip, downtown Detroit location is considered a gift.

I should note, that while they are big they are not considered a great creative shop.

There are some very good people there btw. But it is a real high school environment. It's not enough to be good at your job. You have to fall in line with some sort of category out of central casting.

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Look at this guy: Campbell Ewald - Dave Lockwood

"Good Jazz. Good Conversation. What Else Do You Need?"

Come on.

As for Ian Lavavich, he was the right man at the right time. The old guys who were terrified of "The Internet" were crapping their Depends Undergarments, and he just stepped up and said he was an expert. They all believed him. But he is not a creative.

I bet that guy has refined taste and LOVES his craft beer.

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I bet that guy has refined taste and LOVES his craft beer.

You are probably true. I could also see him being really into wine. I'd also bet that Iain Lanvivich is a fan of Budweiser products.

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