Jump to content

TheCouga

2012-13 Offseason Discussion

Recommended Posts

I see no way that Sanchez gets less than $12MM per year. He is a really good pitcher and young.

More importantly, I don't see him getting any less than five years.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Would Rick's value as a closer be greater than he would be worth in trade?

That is a good question. In particular, we don't know what kind of velocity the coaching staff might think he can achieve in a short outing. For guys like Coke the difference has been up to 3 mph. IF (and yes it is a big one) that were to be the case for RP, a hypothetical 3 mph would give him 96-97 as a reliever, which might be something to work from. Certainly if you are RP and you want to stay in Detroit and you see them sign Sanchez, it's in your interest to volunteer to go to pen in ST and see what you can do. But then again, we have no way of knowing whether starting is more important to him than not being traded.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I should add that a not insignificant part of my objection on Delmon bit chasfh posted was the $7MM contract.

Tough I really don't care to watch him play, if (and this is a *big* if) the Tigers signed Delmon to something like a $3MM deal with the right incentives with the thought that he is a platoon player / bench piece with some upside potential, I probably wouldn't be apopletic. I'd probably be less than happy, though.

I want to be clear that I am not advocating signing Delmon to another year at $7MM. I actually predicted that he's gone. I'm just saying that this could be a surprise move by the Tigers.

And unlike you, it doesn't matter to me whether it's for $3MM or $7MM, because I believe Delmon would see the exact same amount of playing time at various positions no matter what: primary starter in LF versus LHP, against whom he rakes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There is no way porcello goes to the pen by choice. And the tigers would be foolish to move him there.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The Reed Johnsons of the world make $1-3 million per year, however. That's quite a haircut from what Young has been making. Eventually he may settle into that role, but it probably takes him a few seasons of struggling to find a job before he succomes to the idea that he's a platoon OF type -- particularly given his age. And if we spend $7 million on him to fit that kind of role, then we are just being terrible fidiciaries of Mr. Illitch's money.

My guess is that Mike Ilitch drives more signings and their pricing then we would hope. I'm guessing he is the fiduciary of his own money in that regard.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I want to be clear that I am not advocating signing Delmon to another year at $7MM. I actually predicted that he's gone. I'm just saying that this could be a surprise move by the Tigers.

And unlike you, it doesn't matter to me whether it's for $3MM or $7MM, because I believe Delmon would see the exact same amount of playing time at various positions no matter what: primary starter in LF versus LHP, against whom he rakes.

Not sure an .833 OPS qualifies as "rakes" 7th/13 amongst DH's vs lefties

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
My guess is that Mike Ilitch drives more signings and their pricing then we would hope. I'm guessing he is the fiduciary of his own money in that regard.

I doubt someone like DD would have stuck around so long if Illitch was pulling the levers behind the scene, outside of the occassional big ticket signing. All President/GM's hate it when ownership gets involved in personnel decisions. That ran Theo out of Boston, in part, and has come close to pushing Cashman out of NY.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
There is no way porcello goes to the pen by choice. And the tigers would be foolish to move him there.

I don't think the pen would be a choice in general, but as a closer, he could really increase his value rather than being the 5th started on a team with 4 guys that are dominate compared to him

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Not sure an .833 OPS qualifies as "rakes" 7th/13 amongst DH's vs lefties

He will not be a DH next year, so that's not part of the equation. How is he versus other LFs?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Chris Iott ‏@Chris_Iott

Dave Dombrowski said the Tigers will not pursue signing Jose Valverde.

Chris Iott ‏@Chris_Iott

Dave Dombrowski says the Tigers will not pursue Delmon Young. See him as a DH.

DKnobler ‏@DKnobler

No surprise at all that Tigers pick up Peralta option. Real question is whether they can get a better shortstop and trade Jhonny.

Chris Iott ‏@Chris_Iott

Dave Dombrowski said the Tigers will pursue Anibal Sanchez.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I doubt someone like DD would have stuck around so long if Illitch was pulling the levers behind the scene, outside of the occassional big ticket signing. All President/GM's hate it when ownership gets involved in personnel decisions. That ran Theo out of Boston, in part, and has come close to pushing Cashman out of NY.

Maybe you have inside knowledge about DD's personality that I don't, but for all I know, maybe he likes the money too much to complain about Ilitich's over-involvement?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

According to Dd, Tigers will not bring back Delmon or Valverde and Sanchez is a priority.

Apparently comfortable with Holaday as back up.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I don't think the pen would be a choice in general, but as a closer, he could really increase his value rather than being the 5th started on a team with 4 guys that are dominate compared to him

There's no evidence that he'd have more value as a closer than a 5th starter behind 4 guys that dominate.

His value as a starter isn't diminished by being a 5th starter, or being behind 4 guys who might be better. It's diminished by the fact that he has only been so-so and never really progressed despite being a four year veteran.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Chris Iott ‏@Chris_Iott

Dave Dombrowski said the Tigers would feel comfortable with Bryan Holaday as a backup catcher.

Chris Iott ‏@Chris_Iott

Dave Dombrowski: The Tigers seriously considered recalling Bruce Rondon prior to Sept. 1 so he could be with the team in the postseason.

Chris Iott ‏@Chris_Iott

Dave Dombrowski on Bruce Rondon: "There are not many arms like this."

Chris Iott ‏@Chris_Iott

Dave Dombrowski said he did not close the door on Gerald Laird, but told him to pursue what is out there and see what develops.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The more I think about it, the more I think the Tigers will not pursue Sanchez all that hard. They already have among the best 1-2-3 starters in the game, so how badly do they need to give 5/70 or better to a guy who could be most team's ace? Besides, Porcello and Smyly would make fine a 4-5, and that's even considering most teams see the #5 starter as much less essential and will not require a light-out pitcher there. Lastly, there is a team with bottomless pockets and a disappointing playoff performance that could use a third ace-level starter.

I'm not saying the Tigers won't try at all to re-sign Sanchez--they have already said they will--but I think they just won't try hard enough to get into a bidding war over it. I think they will pick a number--say, 4/55--and bid adios if he doesn't bite.

So, I'm now predicting Sanchez does not come back.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
There's no evidence that he'd have more value as a closer than a 5th starter behind 4 guys that dominate.

His value as a starter isn't diminished by being a 5th starter, or being behind 4 guys who might be better. It's diminished by the fact that he has only been so-so and never really progressed despite being a four year veteran.

exactly. His value as a starter on a piss poor defensive team is very limited, the chance to close and rack up 40 easy saves could put him into a different level. The only evidence I can go with is his .651 OPS the first time through the lineup, it's not a lock, but IMO he'd be more valuable than being the 5th starter

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Chris Iott ‏@Chris_Iott

The Tigers will tender Brennan Boesch a contract. #Tigers

Jason Beck ‏@beckjason

Dombrowski on Rondon: "People know how good of an arm Zumaya had. This guy has every bit, but it comes out easier and with less effort."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Pagan did have a monster season though.

If Delmon got 7 last year, Pagan is well worth 1.5 times that. He had a 121 OPS+ with sped and average defense in centerfield

Pagan is 31 with a history of injuries. I'd say he rates out as an average cf defensively. He is a good player.

The article claims he will command 10M+ for multiple years. Perhaps that means 2/20 contract. I could see that. 3 or more years, hell no.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
exactly. His value as a starter on a piss poor defensive team is very limited, the chance to close and rack up 40 easy saves could put him into a different level. The only evidence I can go with is his .651 OPS the first time through the lineup, it's not a lock, but IMO he'd be more valuable than being the 5th starter

I'd think Porcello's value to an outside team as a starter is greater than the value he would deliver the Tigers as a bullpen arm, which would make him a trade candidate if he isn't starting for the Tigers.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Chris Iott ‏@Chris_Iott

Dave Dombrowski: The Tigers will remove Don Kelly from the 40-man roster. Would be interested in having him in camp if no on picks him up.

Chris Iott ‏@Chris_Iott

Dave Dombrowski said the Tigers see Quintin Berry as a guy who should compete for a spot during spring training.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Chris Iott ‏@Chris_Iott

The Tigers will tender Brennan Boesch a contract. #Tigers

Not surprising. Brennan will, barring disaster, start the season in the minors.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Chris Iott ‏@Chris_Iott

Dave Dombrowski said he cannot address Ryan Raburn's status. Has not spoken with Raburn yet.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...