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TheCouga

2012-13 Offseason Discussion

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I can't see us resigning Sanchez AND going after Torii Hunter (who is due to fall off a cliff any season now anyway). If inking Anibal to a new contract is a priority, then I think we'll be in the market for a more modest upgrade for LF. I'd be fine with any of Melky Cabrera, Angel Pagan, or Coco Crisp (assuming the trade cost isn't too high) for a year or two. If you give one of that trio LF and the #2 hole in the lineup, then you can afford to go with a Dirks/Garcia platoon in RF, IMO (or a cheap RH hitting RF if Garcia is better served starting in the minors).

The wild card is just how badly Mike Illitch wants to win. I've seen several people speculate that we could be a destination for Josh Hamilton. If money really is no object at this point, then I could see us resigning Sanchez for 4/$60, and then giving the same type of deal to Hamilton as well to play LF. But Hunter just doesn't make a lot of sense to me. He's not that good, and likely to be more expensive than he's worth. I see us either making more inexpensive tweaks (like an Angel Pagan) or going all in on Hamilton.

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That's not what stopped us this year. In fact, Peralta hit better than almost everyone else in the playoffs.
He was as much the problem as anyone, only .067 in the WS. Jackson, Infante, Young and even Miggy hit for higher averages in the playoffs. The only good player he out hit was Fielder. Out hitting the rest is no feat, they are bench players at best.

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The Tigers should not be using 4 game sample sizes - even if the games in question are the World Series - to impact personel decisions.

Sean Casey was awesome in the 06 WS, 07 not so much.

Edited by Mr. Bigglesworth

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I see no way that Sanchez gets less than $12MM per year. He is a really good pitcher and young.

And he also by be the top free agent on the board, or at least top SP on the board, for a number of teams. Both Hamilton and Greinke come with some question marks. I can't imagine that he signs for less than $15/year. And he may get more than 5 years.

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And he also by be the top free agent on the board, or at least top SP on the board, for a number of teams. Both Hamilton and Greinke come with some question marks. I can't imagine that he signs for less than $15/year. And he may get more than 5 years.

I can see $15MM per year easily as well, but am not as confident as you he gets $15MM per. I think he has a 65% chance at that, depending on the bidders for his services and how those bidders view Greinke relative to Anibal.

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I'd like to see what Castellanos and Garcia are capable of in spring training. Maybe they could take over RF or a bench role.

I don't think having Castellanos and/or Garcia as bench/role players would benefit them. I'd rather see them start in Toledo and get a mid-season call up then have them on the bench.

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Hmmm...I didn't see this:

Tigers Notes: Sanchez, Valverde, Leyland: MLB Rumors - MLBTradeRumors.com

It looks like they are going to try and re-sign him. In this case, I hope they try and deal Porcello. I think Smyly is a better fit for this team, given his K rate (with our defense, that becomes more important), contract status, and the fact that he's a lefty.

It seems likely Sanchez will receive a competitive offer from the Tigers. Who knows if he will take it. The guy will be in high, high demand.

Even if the Tigers resign Sanchez, I wouldn't move Porcello. He is very valuable insurance against the inevitable injury. The Tigers really have no other options. One of the reasons they stunk in April and May was the detritus they ran out there in place of Fister.

Frankly, it shouldn't be that difficult to cure what ails the Tigers. They already have an amazing foundation, better than just about any franchise. And they have an owner willing to spend some money. Good god, if DD is worth the millions he makes he should be able to address the issues--and without getting incredibly lucky. How hard is it to find ONE corner outfielder who can hit, field, and run a bit? The guy doesn't have to be a star just not a 21-year old rookie who still has things to work on, a 27- year old rookie who can't hit, or a guy with a history of running hot but mostly cold and who can't field.

I wouldn't spend an extra dime on the bullpen, other than picking up Dotel's option. Who gives a you know what if we don't have a dedicated closer heading into season. Pretty much every team blows a few saves a year. The key is to have some decent arms and flexibility and the Tigers have that. For the record, I would not trade Porcello for a closer. Heck, I bet if they made Porcello the closer his save percentage would be the same as any guy they traded for.

And for the life of god upgrade the bench. All that requires is some cheap but judicious moves, nothing a guy getting paid millions shouldn't be able to do. This year's bench, especially during the postseason, was atrocious.

The upshot: all the tigers have to do is upgrade some at the margins and they should win 90 games and make the playoffs. That's all you can hope for.

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Dan Haren might be a nice fall back from Sanchez, if the Angels do buy-out his contract. Though I would be a little surprised to see them do that, but I have heard some rumblings about it.

I would love this because, as you all probably know, I am an unapologetic Dan Haren fangirl.

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I don't think signing Melky would be a bad thing at all. He's one of the few guys out there that you could both a) get him to sign a 1-year deal, and 2) isn't an injury or age risk. His value is low right now, but I have a feeling that most of that value is the overreaction to the steroids issue. As much as I think steroids are cheating and warrant large suspensions, I don't think they give you that much of a performance boost in that the player's production should be totally ignored. He was a very good player last year, and could be a real steal.

I think Hamilton might actually be a good deal for some of the same reasons--although DD/Leyland might not want to see what happens when they put Cabrera and Hamilton in the same clubhouse.

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I could see the Tigers signing Delmon again. He won't be their first choice, but if they haven't signed anybody else by January and Young is still out there not getting good offers, the Tigers might bring him back for cheap to play left field. He's the same player he was last year and they brought him back then, so I wouldn't discount that happening again in 2013.

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I think one big difference in how Delmon is viewed today vs. last year is that (I think)there was some thought by the front office that Delmon reached what should be his prime age for hitting, and they took a gamble based at least on some part on that.

They lost that bet, and I think the front office is less bullish on Delmon's ceiling. Just a guess or hunch on my part.

Edited by Mr. Bigglesworth

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I should add that a not insignificant part of my objection on Delmon bit chasfh posted was the $7MM contract.

Tough I really don't care to watch him play, if (and this is a *big* if) the Tigers signed Delmon to something like a $3MM deal with the right incentives with the thought that he is a platoon player / bench piece with some upside potential, I probably wouldn't be apopletic. I'd probably be less than happy, though.

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It seems likely Sanchez will receive a competitive offer from the Tigers. Who knows if he will take it. The guy will be in high, high demand.

Even if the Tigers resign Sanchez, I wouldn't move Porcello. He is very valuable insurance against the inevitable injury. The Tigers really have no other options. One of the reasons they stunk in April and May was the detritus they ran out there in place of Fister.

Frankly, it shouldn't be that difficult to cure what ails the Tigers. They already have an amazing foundation, better than just about any franchise. And they have an owner willing to spend some money. Good god, if DD is worth the millions he makes he should be able to address the issues--and without getting incredibly lucky. How hard is it to find ONE corner outfielder who can hit, field, and run a bit? The guy doesn't have to be a star just not a 21-year old rookie who still has things to work on, a 27- year old rookie who can't hit, or a guy with a history of running hot but mostly cold and who can't field.

I wouldn't spend an extra dime on the bullpen, other than picking up Dotel's option. Who gives a you know what if we don't have a dedicated closer heading into season. Pretty much every team blows a few saves a year. The key is to have some decent arms and flexibility and the Tigers have that. For the record, I would not trade Porcello for a closer. Heck, I bet if they made Porcello the closer his save percentage would be the same as any guy they traded for.

And for the life of god upgrade the bench. All that requires is some cheap but judicious moves, nothing a guy getting paid millions shouldn't be able to do. This year's bench, especially during the postseason, was atrocious.

The upshot: all the tigers have to do is upgrade some at the margins and they should win 90 games and make the playoffs. That's all you can hope for.

Seattle Mike once again proves that quantity of posts is no match for quality. Agree 100%. I would not mind acquiring a bullpen arm but I would hate to see them spend big $$ on the bullpen...exercise Dotel's option and look for bargains. We have a pretty good corps of arms there.

I would also like to see them keep Porcello in the mix to provide an extra starting pitcher as insurance -- probabaly Smyly out of the pen.

I also don't think it should be that damn hard to find a decent corner OF for goodness' sake.

The last major item, the SS defense, would take some creativity, but it's far from prohibitively expensive to upgrade there. I still wonder if we should offload Max Scherzer's upside talent and downside age/risk onto someone else for a better SS right now.

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I should add that a not insignificant part of my objection on Delmon bit chasfh posted was the $7MM contract.

Tough I really don't care to watch him play, if (and this is a *big* if) the Tigers signed Delmon to something like a $3MM deal with the right incentives with the thought that he is a platoon player / bench piece with some upside potential, I probably wouldn't be apopletic. I'd probably be less than happy, though.

I think if DY is on the team they will have him semi-starting, probably in LF. I would kill myself.

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I don't think signing Melky would be a bad thing at all. He's one of the few guys out there that you could both a) get him to sign a 1-year deal, and 2) isn't an injury or age risk. His value is low right now, but I have a feeling that most of that value is the overreaction to the steroids issue. As much as I think steroids are cheating and warrant large suspensions, I don't think they give you that much of a performance boost in that the player's production should be totally ignored. He was a very good player last year, and could be a real steal.

I suspect there are a lot of clubs that would like up to sign Melky on a 1-year deal. That might be a very competitive process. And it may be one decided based upon a factor other than money or championship possibilities. Perhaps he looks to the best hitter friendly park, as long as it's a competitive offer. We'll see, but Melky is probably one of the more interesting FA stories out there this year.

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I could see the Tigers signing Delmon again. He won't be their first choice, but if they haven't signed anybody else by January and Young is still out there not getting good offers, the Tigers might bring him back for cheap to play left field. He's the same player he was last year and they brought him back then, so I wouldn't discount that happening again in 2013.

There is the issue of the incident in New York. The Tigers don't seem to be an organization that likes to take on players with questionable characters. So I doubt they opt to re-sign Young, the same as I doubt they inquire with Toronto about Escobar. I think the Tigers do a good job when incidents come up, but unless it's a star player, it's really not worth the negative exposure when there are generally other roster possibilities.

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I should add that a not insignificant part of my objection on Delmon bit chasfh posted was the $7MM contract.

Tough I really don't care to watch him play, if (and this is a *big* if) the Tigers signed Delmon to something like a $3MM deal with the right incentives with the thought that he is a platoon player / bench piece with some upside potential, I probably wouldn't be apopletic. I'd probably be less than happy, though.

if they go into the season with Delmon young as their starting leftfielder, it'll show they've learned nothing from watching the team get beat by a sound defensive team in the world series. .250-15-60 that plays good defense is more valuable than the .270-16-74 that Delmon provides

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it's not surprising that the teams that focus on their bench and their role players keep beating the tigers in the postseason. The Tigers seem to have taken the Yankee approach to fill the lineup and then who cares about the bench. Could the tigers have made the playoffs if one of their best offensive players got a 50 game suspension and they had to replace him off the bench? highly doubt it.

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I have to admit, there is slim pick'ens on the FA front, with regards to platoon OF's. We'll have to see what the non-tenders bring.

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If Young can get 1/$7 million, as suggested, what is Cody Ross worth? Alot more than Young, that is for sure.

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if they go into the season with Delmon young as their starting leftfielder, it'll show they've learned nothing from watching the team get beat by a sound defensive team in the world series. .250-15-60 that plays good defense is more valuable than the .270-16-74 that Delmon provides

Nobody hates Delmon more than me, but he has hit .307/.341/.483 against lefties lifetime, so if you largely limit him to OF duty on days a LHP is on the mound and a pinch hitter otherwise, I'd say that is better than playing a 0.250/15/60 LF with solid to good defense. But it requires you to find an OF with hits righties well to pair with him.

And there is some value to the possibility (however remote) that he repeats 2010, as well as the value that if an OF gets hurt, he could be a stop-gap.

Edited by Mr. Bigglesworth

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