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RedRamage

Were the White Sox cheating or incompetent?

Was the batter box error intentional or a mistake?  

44 members have voted

  1. 1. Was the batter box error intentional or a mistake?

    • Intentional
      24
    • Mistake
      20


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What I find funny about AJ's attempt to downplay it he acts like it happens everywhere. If that is so then I guess all other catchers are not like him in thatthey keeptheir mouth shut when the hotter is over the line. Bitters know exactly where they stand.

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I dont see how anyone could argue this wasnt intentional. They use a template. Templates are created so that mistakes like this dont happen. So unless the template was created wrong itself, there is no possibility of mistakes. And obviosuly the template was correct since they used it again to mark the boxes in the correct position.

In the grand scheme of things this "mistake" means little or nothing. I find it hilarious that they tried to do this. Baseball has a long history of trying to get an edge through any means, short of blatant cheating, from Eddie Gaedal to the eephus pitch to stealing signs. This is just another example. A humorous footnote in history.

You hit it on the money.

Of course it was intentional. You cannot mess up the template.

Cabrera noticed it by just standing there it was so blatant. His foot was a foot out of the batters box.

That and the back angle of the plate should line up with the back line (or whatever Cabrera was pointing too).

The Sox would have just erased the back line when they came up to bat.

They probably were amazed that Jackson and Boesch did not notice it.

One thing this does prove is the Sox believe the Tigers are the much superior team and the only way they can beat them is by playing on an unlevel playing field.

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The biggest irony is that the Sox head groundskeeper, Roger Bossard, is widely considered the best groundskeeper in baseball, aka, "The Sodfather." He's the guy who designed the drainage system used in Detroit and many other parks. I've even seen him on the field at the super bowl.

I would bet he's furious, humiliated and sorry it happened, given his stellar reputation.

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If anyone can provide rationale on how this would possibly give an advantage to the sox, I'm open to hearing it.

Because the Tigers had 2 batters batting who had to stand a closer distance to the pitcher.

Those 2 batters struckout.

The White Sox had all their hitters hitting from the correct distance.

If you are claiming that if this went on for the entire game there would be no advantage you may be correct. But the Sox probably knew a Tiger batter would realize the mistake. They probably knew Cabrera stood at the back line of the batters box and would notice the error.

They really should have started the inning over after noticing the problem. Then Peavy would be up to what a dozen pitches and have to start all over with no outs but Leyland did not protest that I guess.

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If anyone can provide rationale on how this would possibly give an advantage to the sox, I'm open to hearing it.

I'll give it a try.

The Tigers have first AB's which means the batters box lines are crisp and clear and the Tigers hitters will be out of their normal positions (realtive to where a "normal" batter box would be drawn) inside the box and furiously trying to erase the batters box lines for later hitters. With Cabrera being the third hitter due to hit in the game and Fielder batting 4th, this means the first couple Tigers to hit would be at a disadvantage relative to the position of the lines while the White Sox's lead off hitter would come to bat AFTER at least three Tiger hitters already were working over erasing the batting box line in the top half of the first inning.

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Because the Tigers had 2 batters batting who had to stand a closer distance to the pitcher.

Those 2 batters struckout.

The White Sox had all their hitters hitting from the correct distance.

If you are claiming that if this went on for the entire game there would be no advantage you may be correct. But the Sox probably knew a Tiger batter would realize the mistake. They probably knew Cabrera stood at the back line of the batters box and would notice the error.

They really should have started the inning over after noticing the problem. Then Peavy would be up to what a dozen pitches and have to start all over with no outs but Leyland did not protest that I guess.

I'll give it a try.

The Tigers have first AB's which means the batters box lines are crisp and clear and the Tigers hitters will be out of their normal positions (realtive to where a "normal" batter box would be drawn) inside the box and furiously trying to erase the batters box lines for later hitters. With Cabrera being the third hitter due to hit in the game and Fielder batting 4th, this means the first couple Tigers to hit would be at a disadvantage relative to the position of the lines while the White Sox's lead off hitter would come to bat AFTER at least three Tiger hitters already were working over erasing the batting box line in the top half of the first inning.

Not everyone stands at the back of the batters box. Even if Jackson and Boesch do, the 4-6 inches had little to no impact on their at bat. What if Jackson wanted to bunt? He could have moved up in the box, and it would have increased his chances of keeping the ball fair. Moreover, there were plenty of strike outs and swings and misses throughout the game, even when they changed the batters box.

Edited by alwaysthrowheat

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Not everyone stands at the back of the batters box. Even if Jackson and Boesch do, the 4-6 inches had little to no impact on their at bat. What if Jackson wanted to bunt? He could have moved up in the box, and it would have increased his chances of keeping the ball fair. Moreover, there were plenty of strike outs and swings and misses throughout the game, even when they changed the batters box.

More than likely Jackson and Boesch do not stand at the back of the batters box or they would have noticed the lines were incorrect.

But you have to admit if the Tigers had an incorrect distance to the pitcher for 2 batters that you could easily see the umpire deciding to replay the outcome of those 2 hitters. The umpire must have decided it was not a big enough discrepancy or else Leyland did not push the issue. Kind of like when LaRussa knew Kenny Rogers was throwing with a substance on his hand in the world series but did not really push the issue where he could have had Rogers tossed for illegal substance but La Russa waited between innings to point it out to the umps.

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More than likely Jackson and Boesch do not stand at the back of the batters box or they would have noticed the lines were incorrect.

But you have to admit if the Tigers had an incorrect distance to the pitcher for 2 batters that you could easily see the umpire deciding to replay the outcome of those 2 hitters. The umpire must have decided it was not a big enough discrepancy or else Leyland did not push the issue. Kind of like when LaRussa knew Kenny Rogers was throwing with a substance on his hand in the world series but did not really push the issue where he could have had Rogers tossed for illegal substance but La Russa waited between innings to point it out to the umps.

Exactly. It was so insignificant, that it was unlikely the mistake was done deliberately, and therefore, made no difference on Jackson and Boesch's AB's. Why would the umpire decide to replay the two AB's because it was the Tigers? You just said it; it wasn't a big enough discrepancy, regardless of the team. Has there ever been a "replay" like that, anyway? I'd be surprised.

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They said today that a reason for all the strikeouts yesterday was that the balls were "dark". They rubbed too much mud on them or something. This is apparently why there were so many swinging strikeouts on both sides.

I also doubt that was an intentional conspiracy.

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It wasn't to either teams' advantage. I don't see how this could possibly benefit anyone. It was blatantly wrong, and someone was going to notice it sooner rather than later.

Pretty obvious, if I'm facing the Tigers, I'm hoping for a low-scoring game. It's their best chance to win and this series has shown that so far.

Not to mention the even more obvious fact that this has probably never happened in 50+ years, if ever... it's impossible to screw this up. It had to have been done for a reason.

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I've heard the boxes were only off-center by 1.5 inches - doesn't seem like enough to effect much so I voted "mistake"

Except that this is inaccurate. You can look and see it was much more than that.

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Exactly. It was so insignificant, that it was unlikely the mistake was done deliberately, and therefore, made no difference on Jackson and Boesch's AB's. Why would the umpire decide to replay the two AB's because it was the Tigers? You just said it; it wasn't a big enough discrepancy, regardless of the team. Has there ever been a "replay" like that, anyway? I'd be surprised.

When Luis Pujos was the Tigers manager the year Phil Garner got fires the Tigers batted a player out of order. The opposing team waited for this Tiger to bat then notified the ump who promptly called the batter out.

If you are not following the rules the plate appearance should not count.

Of course you probably remember the George Brett homerun that was called an out after the Yankees manager said Brett had too much pine tar on his bat. The umpires looked at the rule book and could not disagree with the rules. I think Leyland had a beef in this case. This is not a small thing when you move the batters box 6-12 inches depending on whom you believe.

Let Verlander pitch an entire game with the opposing team having to bat 60 feet away in stead of 60 feet 6 inches. I bet it is that much harder to see the ball.

I still think it didn't matter that much in this situation because Sherzer struck out 11 as someone mentioned the ball was just hard to see but rules are rules. A girl running with earings taped over was disqualfied from a track meet recently because it is the rule you cannot run with earings on.

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Pretty obvious, if I'm facing the Tigers, I'm hoping for a low-scoring game. It's their best chance to win and this series has shown that so far.

Not to mention the even more obvious fact that this has probably never happened in 50+ years, if ever... it's impossible to screw this up. It had to have been done for a reason.

I'm surprised that Jackson and Boesch didn't notice it. A lot of batters stand at the back of the box. It was so blatantly obvious, that it's hard to believe it took three hitters to figure it out.

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