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11 hours ago, rhino said:

Update on the stolen 100 kilo coin. Arrests have been made.

 

100 kg coin is just a silly thing to do. Of course having how ever many tons of gold are still sitting at Ft Knox is silly too.

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6 hours ago, Gehringer_2 said:

100 kg coin is just a silly thing to do. Of course having how ever many tons of gold are still sitting at Ft Knox is silly too.

I think it was more a display of engineering and metallurgy skill then it was to fill a practical need. The production perfection of a coin that size had never been done before. The Canadian mint prides themselves on the superior production and refining of their Gold Maple Leaf coin. As impractical as the 100 kilo coin is, it was produced more as a bit of showing off by the Canadian Mint. Hence the quote at the end of the article by the Canadian Mint when asked why the coins were made, "Because we can."

I would have to look it up but I think those coins were made about 20 yrs ago and no other refiner or mint has produced one since. 

The dificulty comes in the pouring of the metal also called the casting process.

All the smaller 1 oz coins, wether American, Canadian, Australian etc.. are made from a stamping which is infinitely easier to do and control. 

 

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1 hour ago, rhino said:

I think it was more a display of engineering and metallurgy skill then it was to fill a practical need. 

could be, but it's still a 19th century kind of accomplishment. xD

Maybe more to the point as a display piece, the quality of it's geometry or composition is not discernible in any way to anyone interested in appreciating the technical feat. They aren't properties you can assess with your senses with the thing in a display case. They might have found a more interesting way to present their skills.

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This will vary by each establishment of course.  But if we did that, we would have about $20K-$25K in new processing fees each year.  

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16 minutes ago, Deleterious said:

This will vary by each establishment of course.  But if we did that, we would have about $20K-$25K in new processing fees each year.  

Not to mention all the lost revenue from your money laundering.  

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59 minutes ago, screwball said:

I just want to see how the lawsuits go when they reject cash payment. I suppose they can decline business from cash payers in some circumstance, but for an industry where you pay for a transaction after service is performed (like restaurants), there probably isn't a lot of recourse for the restaurant when the person tries to pay in cash and won't pay via card. If they are attempting to settle the bill in legal US tender, I think the restaurant would have no choice but to accept or let the customer go without paying (if they won't accept it).  

But this is all beta testing.  Soon enough there will be a strong lobbying  effort to get the government to digitize all of our currency.  And they will.  I think we are about 5 years away from that. Norway, Sweden and Denmark are already well on their way to being cashless.  Zimbabwe is as well and might turn out to be the first country there. 

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23 minutes ago, ballmich said:

Not to mention all the lost revenue from your money laundering.  

That is why I play poker.

Just kidding IRS intern that is reading this post.  

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8 minutes ago, ballmich said:

I just want to see how the lawsuits go when they reject cash payment. I suppose they can decline business from cash payers in some circumstance, but for an industry where you pay for a transaction after service is performed (like restaurants), there probably isn't a lot of recourse for the restaurant when the person tries to pay in cash and won't pay via card. If they are attempting to settle the bill in legal US tender, I think the restaurant would have no choice but to accept or let the customer go without paying (if they won't accept it).  

But this is all beta testing.  Soon enough there will be a strong lobbying  effort to get the government to digitize all of our currency.  And they will.  I think we are about 5 years away from that. Norway, Sweden and Denmark are already well on their way to being cashless.  Zimbabwe is as well and might turn out to be the first country there. 

And many will welcome cashless with open arms.

I wonder too what happens if they refuse cash.  After all, our fiat says (and I quote); THIS NOTE IS LEGAL TENDER FOR ALL DEBTS, PUBLIC AND PRIVATE.

Kind of funny in a way, as the note itself is a piece of debt.

And they can still bite me; I will refuse to go anywhere that won't accept cash.

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Just now, Deleterious said:

FWIW, there is no law requiring a business to accept cash.  

Understand, but that's what it says on a "Federal Reserve Note."  

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The banks will collect 3.5% on every transaction like they do with cc.

Dang, I hate banks.

(Banks, not bankers, ballmich)

 

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2 minutes ago, rhino said:

 

The banks will collect 3.5% on every transaction like they do with cc.

Dang, I hate banks.

(Banks, not bankers, ballmich)

 

I tried to cash a business check (my business) and they refused.  Never had that happen before.  They said I had to have a business account, which I don't want, and never needed before.  Of course to do so, it would cost 11 bucks a month unless I keep a 3500 dollar minimum in the account.  Screw that.  So what keeps me from opening a business account, transferring the check to my personal account, and then closing the business account.  Oh, you can do that, BUT, you must wait a month (fee) and then there is a charge to close the account.  How much?  50 bucks.

**** you.  I had the people rewrite the check to me instead of my business.

**** the swine pricks.

I think it's time to start taking bags of change in again.  Anything to **** with them.

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You would be surprised how many people already think it's illegal to do buisness with cash. I must expalin at least 2 or 3 times a month. It is legal to do business in cash, no matter the amount of the transaction, as long as you record it in your accounting. It's only illegal if you try to hide it and not record it in your records.
THe government and banks are doing a very good job of scaring people into not using cash.

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30 minutes ago, screwball said:

I tried to cash a business check (my business) and they refused.  Never had that happen before.  They said I had to have a business account, which I don't want, and never needed before.  Of course to do so, it would cost 11 bucks a month unless I keep a 3500 dollar minimum in the account.  Screw that.  So what keeps me from opening a business account, transferring the check to my personal account, and then closing the business account.  Oh, you can do that, BUT, you must wait a month (fee) and then there is a charge to close the account.  How much?  50 bucks.

**** you.  I had the people rewrite the check to me instead of my business.

**** the swine pricks.

I think it's time to start taking bags of change in again.  Anything to **** with them.

I believe it.

I think we talked about it on here. When my son was in college he had a medical emergency and we tried to deposit cash in his Chase account because the doctor he was seeing wasn't coevered on our health care plan, but the bank wouldn't accept it. We, as his parents, couldn't deposit cash into our son's account for a medical emergency. Money laundering, you know.  I'm very glad I wasn't there when they told my wife that bit of info. ****in' bastards.

They told her for a small fee she could use an advance from her Chase credit card and deposit it that way, you know, just two small fees for the advance and to complete the transfer to his account.

Fortunately, i had him set up on an ACH transfer from my business account so I did it that way. Medical emergency be damned, the banks got to get their pound of flesh.

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14 minutes ago, rhino said:

I believe it.

I think we talked about it on here. When my son was in college he had a medical emergency and we tried to deposit cash in his Chase account because the doctor he was seeing wasn't coevered on our health care plan, but the bank wouldn't accept it. We, as his parents, couldn't deposit cash into our son's account for a medical emergency. Money laundering, you know.  I'm very glad I wasn't there when they told my wife that bit of info. ****in' bastards.

They told her for a small fee she could use an advance from her Chase credit card and deposit it that way, you know, just two small fees for the advance and to complete the transfer to his account.

Fortunately, i had him set up on an ACH transfer from my business account so I did it that way. Medical emergency be damned, the banks got to get their pound of flesh.

When my "personal banker" called me to tell me there was a problem and I should call them back, I knew what the deal was.

Fees.  They wanted their pound (or two) of flesh.

Swine pricks.

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2 hours ago, Deleterious said:

FWIW, there is no law requiring a business to accept cash.  

Technically, exchange of goods or services for electronic payment is bartering, because payment made is not legal tender. That said, no one treats it that way.  But it would have tax filing implications if done correctly.

Although there is no requirement to accept cash, if cash is offered as payment in a transaction and refused, I don't think the goods & service provider has much recourse if the goods & service have already been provided/performed. 

I would like to see that play out in court and see how it goes. Of course this could all probably be resolved upfront by asking them how they intend to pay prior to providing any goods & services.  But it's clearly a change in customary transaction flow, for some businesses at least. 

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Interesting little piece on predictions with a payoff from the highest paid ***** in Economics at the end:

 

Entrepreneurs Have Been Proving Experts Wrong Forever

There’s a long-standing tradition among scientists, engineers, and industrialists. Every new year, they make predictions about a future.

Is blockchain a major technology, or it’s just a buzzword?

Bots vs Apps: who will win in 2017?

Will this finally be the year that virtual reality stops giving people motion sickness?

Well, technology has proven to be extraordinarily slippery over the past century. Despite the vast information that industry insiders have had at their fingertips, they’ve made some pretty terrible forecasts over the years.

The predictions that history remembers most are those that demonstrate spectacular misjudgment, misunderstanding, overly optimistic hyperbole, self-delusion, or good old-fashion wishful thinking.

Below, I’ve listed the very worst predictions, which show how even the titans of industry don’t always know what they’re talking about. Whether they were predictions about technological progress, adoption rates, or market potential, we can all agree that these predictions were dead wrong.

1876: “This ‘telephone’ has too many shortcomings to be seriously considered as a means of communication.” — William Orton, President of Western Union.

1876: “The Americans have need of the telephone, but we do not. We have plenty of messenger boys.” — Sir William Preece, chief engineer, British Post Office.

1889: “Fooling around with alternating current (AC) is just a waste of time. Nobody will use it, ever.” — Thomas Edison.

1903: “The horse is here to stay but the automobile is only a novelty — a fad.” President of the Michigan Savings Bank advising Henry Ford’s lawyer, Horace Rackham, not to invest in the Ford Motor Company.

1921: “The wireless music box has no imaginable commercial value. Who would pay for a message sent to no one in particular?” — Associates of David Sarnoff responding to the latter’s call for investment in the radio.

1926: “While theoretically and technically television may be feasible, commercially and financially it is an impossibility.” — Lee DeForest, “Father of Radio” and a pioneer in the development of sound-on-film recording used for motion pictures. He had over 180 patents.

1932: “There is not the slightest indication that nuclear energy will ever be obtainable. It would mean that the atom would have to be shattered at will.” — Albert Einstein.

1936: “A rocket will never be able to leave the Earth’s atmosphere.” New York Times.

1946: “Television won’t be able to hold on to any market it captures after the first six months. People will soon get tired of staring at a plywood box every night.” — Darryl Zanuck, film producer, co-founder of 20th Century Fox.

1949: “Where a calculator on the ENIAC is equipped with 18,000 vacuum tubes and weighs 30 tons, computers of the future may have only 1,000 vacuum tubes and perhaps weigh one and a half tons.” Popular Mechanics.

1957: “I have traveled the length and breadth of this country and talked with the best people, and I can assure you that data processing is a fad that won’t last out the year.” — Editor of Prentice Hall business books.

1959: “The world potential market for copying machines is 5,000 at most.” IBM told the eventual founders of Xerox.

1961: “There is practically no chance communications space satellites will be used to provide better telephone, telegraph, television or radio service inside the United States.” T.A.M. Craven, Federal Communications Commission (FCC) commissioner.

1977: “There is no reason for any individual to have a computer in his home.” — Ken Olsen, founder of Digital Equipment Corp.

1981: “No one will need more than 637KB of memory for a personal computer. 640KB ought to be enough for anybody.” — Bill Gates, co-founder and chairman of Microsoft.

1981: “Cellular phones will absolutely not replace local wire systems.” — Marty Cooper, inventor.

1989: “We will never make a 32-bit operating system.” — Bill Gates, co-founder and chairman of Microsoft.

1992: “The idea of a personal communicator in every pocket is a “pipe dream driven by greed.” — Andy Grove, then CEO of Intel.

1995: “I predict the Internet will soon go spectacularly supernova and in 1996 catastrophically collapse.” — Robert Metcalfe, founder of 3Com, inventor of Ethernet.

2003: “The subscription model of buying music is bankrupt. I think you could make available the Second Coming in a subscription model, and it might not be successful.” — Steve Jobs, in Rolling Stone

2007: “There’s no chance that the iPhone is going to get any significant market share.” — Steve Ballmer, Microsoft CEO.

1899: "Everything that can be invented has been invented." – attributed to Charles H. Duell, Commissioner, U.S. Office of Patents

Lesson learned: don’t confuse trends with facts

As Paul Krugman pointed out in his 1998 piece blissfully titled "Why most economists’ predictions are wrong,"

"The growth of the Internet will slow drastically, as the flaw in “Metcalfe’s law”  —  which states that the number of potential connections in a network is proportional to the square of the number of participants  —  becomes apparent: most people have nothing to say to each other! By 2005 or so, it will become clear that the Internet’s impact on the economy has been no greater than the fax machine’s."

It’s my favorite prediction because as result he contradicts himself.

Predictions are a risky business. Even more so if they’re about the immediate future. Once shown to be wrong, the words return to their origin like a boomerang, and the quotes go on to forever haunt the speaker.

https://fee.org/articles/entrepreneurs-have-been-proving-experts-wrong-forever/?utm_source=FEE+Email+Subscriber+List&utm_campaign=3d54a9a631-MC_FEE_DAILY_2017_07_21&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_84cc8d089b-3d54a9a631-108150729

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Wow!  Those are some big swing and misses.

I expect that from the Krug.  Why does anyone even read him anymore?  He was past his expiration date long ago.

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Most of those swings and misses were from people who had a HUGE stake in what would be replaced if it came to be. No real surprises there IMO.

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You're not surprised that the commissioner of the FCC didn't see the commercial potential in satellite communication?

That even Bill Gates didn't realize just how popular and powerful computers were going to get?

That IBM didn't see the commercial potential in copy machines?

That even the founder of Intel didn't forsee how small and powerful a chip could get so it could be carried around?

 

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