Jump to content

Johnny Mac

Jimmy Howard

Recommended Posts

I dont know if some of you realize how good of a season he is having.

His .928 save percentage is currently 3rd in the NHL, behind Ryan Miller and Tukka Rask (who only has 16 starts)

His 2.14 GAA is currently 4th in the NHL behind Antti Niemi (only has 13 starts), Rask (16 starts) and Ryan Miller.

Both those stats are 2nd best amongst starting NHL goalies (Niemi and Rask are backups). And both are first amongst starting goalies in the Western Conference.

You can go back and read some of my older posts, I was not sold on him at all earlier this season. But he is proving me wrong.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

cough *Norm Miracle* cough..

:confused:

The most games Maracle ever played in a season with the Wings was 16. He never sniffed the starting job. And even in those 16 games his stats were not as good as Howards.

Howard IS this teams starting goalie and has played almost every game lately. Howard has already played 28 games.

The comparison is not applicable at all.

and btw im not saying he is some kind of elite nhl goalie because of this, just pointing out to some people who may not be paying attention that he is currently doing really well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

He's the story of the year for the Wings, IMO, apart from injuries. He might fall back, but ... he could turn out to be Franzen. Blooming overnight. I read that post by Jamie Samuelsson today about how Howard will be an unrestricted free agent after 2010-11. If he keeps this up for the next year and a half (I know, I know, it's only been a good couple of months), I wonder what his value will be and if the Wings would be able to keep him.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
cough *Manny legace* cough

Well, Manny was playing on one of the, if not the, best defensive teams in the league, as well as one of the best teams, period. Often he played against the weaker teams of the league, and IIRC did not play a lot of consecutive games.

Completely different from Howard's situation, IMHO.

I do agree with the notion it is way to early to conclude anything about Howard, except perhaps, that his prospects as a viable NHL goalie has gone up a fair amount from just 6 months ago.

Fun random fact: Legace was drafted by the Hartford Whalers. Sweet.

Edited by Mr. Bigglesworth

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
cough *Manny legace* cough

So in other words, throw away regular season performance, because Legace and Maracle failed (behind deeper defenses than the Wings have had this season). Might as well throw away any goalie who has performed in the playoffs anywhere but Detroit, because Curtis Joseph failed here. Also throw away any mid-career goalie who might be able to step in here, because Essens and Cheveldae failed. So who's left? Should the Wings just pull their goalie and play with 6 skaters for the next 5 years?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Early in the year I remember talking about how Detroit might struggle to win games because they dont have a guy like Conklin was last year, who stepped in and won a bunch of games when Osgood was struggling. Turns out Howard is this years Ty Conklin.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
He's the story of the year for the Wings, IMO, apart from injuries. He might fall back, but ... he could turn out to be Franzen. Blooming overnight.

Tim Thomas came from nowhere at age 32, and didn't have his first good season until 33. 33(!). Not that I am claiming Howard is Thomas - just that recent history demonstrates that is entirely possible for a career minor leaguer to be suddenly and unexpectedly successful at the NHL level.

Fun random fact: Tim Thomas was drafted by the Quebec Nordiques. Sweet.

Edited by Mr. Bigglesworth

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Tim Thomas came from nowhere at age 32, and didn't have his first good season until 33. 33(!). Not that I am claiming Howard is Thomas - just that recent history demonstrates that is entirely possible for a career minor leaguer to be suddenly and unexpectedly successful at the NHL level.

Yes, and Thomas isn't the only one. The summer after Hasek turned 27, he had a grand total of 25 NHL games under his belt. The following year he played 28 games with Buffalo with a 3.15 GAA and 0.896 Save % (was still within the tail end of the NHL's high-scoring era, but regardless, not great stats). Then he took off. And like you, I'm not claiming that Howard will be the next Thomas or Hasek. I had posted on another thread about some young goalies that had a hot streak very early but couldn't sustain it. Point being, career trajectories of NHL goalies are very hard to predict.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I dont know if some of you realize how good of a season he is having.

His .928 save percentage is currently 3rd in the NHL, behind Ryan Miller and Tukka Rask (who only has 16 starts)

His 2.14 GAA is currently 4th in the NHL behind Antti Niemi (only has 13 starts), Rask (16 starts) and Ryan Miller.

Both those stats are 2nd best amongst starting NHL goalies (Niemi and Rask are backups). And both are first amongst starting goalies in the Western Conference.

You can go back and read some of my older posts, I was not sold on him at all earlier this season. But he is proving me wrong.

Unreal stats! It's only a half of a season but who would have ever thought? When I speak of the Wings, I always talk about Howard to everyone and how great he is doing. And the funny part about it, is how bad I ripped him at the beginning of the season.

When you look back at it, that Columbus thumping where he still made around 24 saves in a 9-1 win, really settled Jimmy in. In the next game when he started against the Canucks, I had a few buddies over (non Wing fans) and I ripped Howard for most of the game. At the same time though, as he kept making save after save and actually looked like an NHL goalie, I started to think in my head about a possible shut-out. The Wings ended up winning 3-1 but ever since then Howard has taken off.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Without Howard playing the way he has over the past month or so .... we'd be F'd. So, toss out players names and joke ... but its fact. Howard picked up his game when we all doubted him, and he's helped us stay in the playoff hunt - even when his superstar players around him have disappeared.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Red Wings goalie Jimmy Howard playing himself into the Hart Trophy debate - ESPN

Howard is 'not an overnight sensation'

By Scott Burnside

ESPN.com

Archive

NASHVILLE, Tenn. -- With each passing day, it becomes crystal clear Detroit netminder Jimmy Howard isn't just the obvious candidate for rookie of the year, but he has also played himself into consideration for the Vezina Trophy as the NHL's top goaltender.

And while we're at it, if we're going to discuss Buffalo's Ryan Miller as a potential Hart Trophy nominee, then you have to throw Howard in the mix, as well. Quite simply, that's how good the 26-year-old Syracuse, N.Y., native has played and how crucial he has been in helping turn the Red Wings from meandering to menacing.

Pretty heady stuff for a guy who was so worried about his future as an NHL starter, he postponed his honeymoon last summer so he could concentrate on getting his game in shape.

Through Saturday's action, Red Wings goalie Jimmy Howard is fourth in the NHL in both save percentage (.926) and goals-against average (2.24).

"We didn't get married until August and that was a month before training camp, and I figured that probably wouldn't be the smartest time taking a week and a half or two weeks off to go to Maui or wherever we were going for it," Howard told ESPN.com after he turned aside 33 regulation and overtime shots and 10 of 11 shootout attempts in a 1-0 win over Nashville on Saturday night. "It just wasn't very logical from my standpoint trying to crack the NHL to take off for two weeks."

It's a decision that was well-accepted at home, especially now that Howard's name is consistently mentioned among the league's top first-year players.

"Yeah, I've definitely made up for it," he said with a laugh.

The Wings' win, which vaulted Detroit into a tie with Nashville in the middle of the Western Conference playoff bracket with 91 points, was Howard's 22nd straight start. The last time one Detroit netminder started that many consecutive games was 1991-92, when Tim Cheveldae started 29 in a row.

GM Ken Holland told ESPN.com the former college standout, who spent four years toiling for the Wings' AHL affiliate, has been the team's MVP thus far this season.

"He's not an overnight sensation," Holland said of Howard. "He's been training for this for seven years."

Saturday's tilt in Nashville was as good an indication of Howard's evolution as any. Or rather, another signpost on what has been a meteoric rise from giant question mark to potential hardware recipient.

The Predators were given credit for the first seven shots of the game and Howard calmly turned those aside. After a Detroit turnover late in the third period, Howard somehow managed to get in front of a wicked David Legwand shot that seemed destined to be the game winner.

"Yeah, it was just a pretty quick play," the amiable Howard said. "Actually, all three forwards touched the puck. It started off in the middle, got kicked out to the outside and I forgot who it was who made the pass to [Legwand], but I knew I didn't have enough time to get out to the top of my crease, so I knew he was going far side, so I just pushed across."

Howard, admittedly not so fond of the shootout, having won just three of 10 before Saturday, was needless to say terrific in Saturday's edition, including a remarkable diving save on J.P. Dumont.

The emergence of Howard as a top-flight netminder once again reaffirms the Red Wings just get it.

The Wings simply never rush players. But in Howard's case, it was more a case of whether the fruit would spoil on the vine. After Howard spent four years in the American Hockey League, the Wings had to decide if they were going to give him a chance, and Holland opted to cut loose netminder Ty Conklin, who had been so good working with Chris Osgood last season, and give Howard a chance to prove he had the goods to be an NHL netminder.

"We're in a cap world. We've got to move some 25-year-old players into our lineup," Holland said.

Early on, it looked like the pressures of stepping into a dynastic franchise like Detroit might be too much for Howard. He got lit up in his first start in Sweden and then didn't play much early in the season. When he did, there were some bumps. But when Osgood got the flu in November and missed a number of starts, Howard stepped in and began the process of not just taking over the starting job, but also resurrecting the injury-ravaged Wings' playoff chances.

At the time of this writing, Howard was fourth in the NHL in both save percentage (.926) and goals-against average (2.24). The shutout against the Predators marked Howard's 11th victory since the Olympic break.

When the Wings returned to action in March, the storyline was whether they would get healthy enough to sneak into the playoffs. Thanks to a nearly healthy roster and the continued nightly excellence by Howard, the Wings are 11-2-1 since the break, and coupled with another Calgary Flames implosion (a 5-0 loss in Boston on Saturday), sit eight points clear of ninth place, a virtual lock to reach the postseason for a 19th straight season.

"Like I was saying the other day, it's a lot easier when you're playing every single night because you get in a rhythm and everything," Howard said. "Even when things are a little off on a nightly basis, you think you can win the game, so I'm just in a nice little rhythm here and it's fun being here."

Now the storyline surrounding the Wings is whether Howard can become the first Red Wings netminder to capture rookie of the year honors since Roger Crozier in 1964-65, and how he will react to the pressures of being a playoff goalie in Detroit.

"He's a guy that's done a good job for us. He's gotten us to the point we're at. The test of time is what he's got to survive," Red Wings coach Mike Babcock said. "There's been lots of goalies that have come into the league and some even won the rookie of the year and then you don't keep it going. That's up to him.

"So how mentally tough are you? How hard are you willing to train? How hard do you want to battle? How do you let water run off the duck's back kind of thing when it doesn't go good? To me, he's shown real good signs. I like the way he's played. He's given our team confidence. He looks like a real goalie to me, so I'm real comfortable. I think this is as good as [we've been in net] since I've been here."

Scott Burnside covers the NHL for ESPN.com.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
He's quietly having one of the best seasons in Red Wings history for a goalie.

Tainted.

SO wins ruins it.

Haseks' 40+ would have been 50ish if he had the benefit of the same system.

He is having a good year, yes. However it is far from one of the best seasons in Wings history.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just posted that article in last nights game thread as well for people who may not look in this thread. Taking wins aside (since its tainted, lol)

Howards .926 save percentage is a lot better than anything Ozzie ever posted, his best .917 and that was in 19 games, his best as a part time starter .914 (still only started 40 games that year). His best when starting at least half the games was .913.

Howards 2.24 GAA has been bettered by Ozzie 3 times, Once when starting 40 games in 07-08, once while starting 64 in 97-98 and once in 47 starts in 95-96. Needless to say those teams around Ozzie were way better than this team, one set NHL record and the other two won stanley cups. He wasnt facing many shots those nights.

Now Shinma post about 01-02 Hasek having a better season, well that is certainly the biggest competition to the year Howard is having

01-02 Hasek 41 wins 2.17 GAA .915 save percentage 5 SO

09-10 Howard 32 wins 2.24 GAA .926 save percentage 2 SO

Hasek was surrounded by hall of famers and once again wasnt facing nearly the amount of shots Howard is. Howard has already made more saves this season than Hasek did and he has played in 8 less games and has had 9 less starts than Hasek did that season. I think those two seasons are almost a push. Howard has a better save percentage, Hasek SO, Wins and GAA. But his wins and SO were easier to come by with the team around him and GAA as well with the reduced shots he was facing a game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Tainted.

SO wins ruins it.

Haseks' 40+ would have been 50ish if he had the benefit of the same system.

He is having a good year, yes. However it is far from one of the best seasons in Wings history.

Oh shove it for once Shin :P I'm not talking about wins and losses, I'm talking about that sparkling save percentage he has.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Im trying to go back to see the last time anyone had a save percentage as good as Howards this year (as a full time starter, or at least started 41 games)

Hasek best as a Wing .915

Osgood best as a Wing .913

Joseph best was .912

Legace best was .915

Vernon best was .903 and he never started enough games to qualify anyway

Conklin was .909 last year but didnt have enough starts either.

And past that you get into the Tim Cheveldae, Glen Hanlon and Greg Stefan era and the high scoring NHL where most goalies were under .900 save percentage. Hard to compare.

Edited by Johnny Mac

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wins? WTF? Who measures a netminder's success just using wins? Well...maybe someone who relies on NBC for their hockey coverage. Those of us who grew up watching Foster Hewitt form the gondola above Maple Leaf Gardens and Bruce Martyn on channels 20 and 50 know thgat GAA and save % are far better indicators of a goalies value....:rambo:

Howard is having a tremendous, historically significant season playing the toughest positon in sports...#1 goalie for the Detroit Red Wings

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

01-02 Hasek 41 wins 2.17 GAA .915 save percentage 5 SO

09-10 Howard 32 wins 2.24 GAA .926 save percentage 2 SO

Shootout stats adjusted:

01-02 Hasek 41-15-8

09-10 Howie 28-15-13

Howie definitely has benefited from Ozzie sucking and the Wings moving away from the "goaltender 1A/1B" thing as well. My point was that this is not "one of the best years in history", atleast until it was clarified that the subject is now about save percentage.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Shootout stats adjusted:

01-02 Hasek 41-15-8

09-10 Howie 28-15-13

Howie definitely has benefited from Ozzie sucking and the Wings moving away from the "goaltender 1A/1B" thing as well. My point was that this is not "one of the best years in history", atleast until it was clarified that the subject is now about save percentage.

I cant believe you are really resorting to Wins. You are smarter than that.

The 12 forwards Hasek had consisted of Hull, Yzerman, Robitaille, Fedorov, Shanahan, Larionov, Datsyuk, A younger Draper, and Holmstrom. That team was stacked, they could have started any NHL starting goalie that year and he would have won 30-40 games. Howard had guys like Bertuzzi, Cleary and even at times had guys like Leino, Eaves, Miller and Williams getting time on the top 2 lines when players were injured.

And people arent saying best in history, but one of best in Wings history. Go show me a year that is clearly better, and dont come with a weak argument like wins. SV % and GAA wise, stats that are more reliant on the goalie than the team, Howards numbers stack with any other season by a Wings goalie in recent history

Edited by Johnny Mac

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I cant believe you are really resorting to Wins.

The 12 forwards Hasek had consisted of Hull, Yzerman, Robitaille, Fedorov, Shanahan, Larionov, Datsyuk, A younger Draper, and Holmstrom. That team was stacked, they could have started any NHL starting goalie that year and he would have won 30-40 games. Howard had guys like Bertuzzi, Clearly and even at times had guys like Leino, Eaves, Miller and Williams getting time on the top 2 lines when players were injured.

And people arent saying best in history, but one of best in Wings history. Go show me a year that is clearly better, and dont come with a weak argument like wins. SV % and GAA wise, stats that are more reliant on the goalie than the team, Howards numbers stack with any other season by a Wings goalie in recent history

My point was that this is not "one of the best years in history"

Don't pull that "recent" history stuff now.

They've only been keeping the save percentage stat since '83. So if you only want to use save percentage, fine.

Also, you can't fault the goalie for the team that plays in front of him.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Forum Statistics

    • Total Topics
      96,485
    • Total Posts
      2,883,003
  • Who's Online (See full list)

  • Upcoming Events

    No upcoming events found
×
×
  • Create New...