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KleShreen

I hate Lynn Henning

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My guess is Peter Gammons (when he was a good writer 20 years ago) got similar info as Lynn gets now - its just that Peter connected the dots (a lot) better, and he was regarded a better writer for it.Having written that, Peter was known to follow-up well and get info first, so I am probably under-selling Gammons reporting acumen.

Any reference to 1983-2000 Peter Gammons, his writing, baseball knowledge and capacity to verify leads and stories bears no relationship to Lynn Henning.One is a HOF wirter the other is ..Lynn Henning.

Even today, a diminshed Gammons fact checks the caliber of propsects he touts and the trades he specualtes about, Lynn's grasp of the Tiger system is inferior to this board, it's why he is so continuously mocked.

Henning as I mentioned earlier in this thread has become Jay Mariotti, he writes to agitate you, if you know enough to be agitated. It's sensationalistic. To bad nobody really pays for newspapers anymore.

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What if it's something you don't like?

I guarantee no one will like the first blockbuster trade that is made .. if one is even made. But if one is done, no one around here is going to like it.

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I guarantee no one will like the first blockbuster trade that is made .. if one is even made. But if one is done, no one around here is going to like it.

People will like it if it's a good one that helps the team. Most people liked the Cabrera trade and that was the biggest blockbuster the Tigers have made in years. If it looks like a salary dump or the Tigers don't get enough, then people won't like it.

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People will like it if it's a good one that helps the team.

Yeah, if DD just gets a steal. If it's close, people are going to be pissed. Granderson and Jackson are too popular.

An example of this would be the Matt Joyce for Edwin Jackson trade ... how long was that thread? How many people liked that trade? And was it a good trade?

Most people liked the Cabrera trade and that was the biggest blockbuster the Tigers have made in years.

Yeah, but we didn't trade popular players for prospects. We traded away young, popular prospects for Miguel Cabrera. That's different.

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How many people liked that trade?

I didn't like the trade at the time but I think more people liked it than didn't like it. Also, most of the thread was not about the trade but more about statistics.

Some were saying that Jackson had a good year in 2008 because he won 14 games. I was arguing against the W/L statistic because it's a team stat. Interestingly, he had a better year in 2009 but won just 13 games which is an example of why the wins stat is not a individual good stat.

Yeah, but we didn't trade popular players for prospects. We traded away young, popular prospects for Miguel Cabrera. That's different.

If they traded away young popular prospects for a player that wasn't so good, then people would not have liked it.

Granderson is a special case because he is really really popular so maybe some people will automatically hate the trade but MTS is not the most sentimental group! I certainly don't think people will automatically get upset if Jackson is traded. It depends on who they get

Edited by tiger337

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Yeah, we'll see... I seriously doubt Cabrera goes anywhere, but I have a feeling both Granderson and Jackson are traded, and I just hope DD does his best with them.

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Yeah, we'll see... I seriously doubt Cabrera goes anywhere, but I have a feeling both Granderson and Jackson are traded, and I just hope DD does his best with them.

I think Granderson is staying. It makes no sense to trade him unless they get elite ready MLB prospects in return and I don't think that will happen. I believe there is a better chance that Jackson will be traded if they think last year was his peak year. I don't think Cabrera will be traded. If he is, it would be a bad sign because it would mean they are in financial trouble.

Edited by tiger337

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I'm not. If it would clear 126 million, I'm sure they'd do it.

I am sorry, but if all it really took was Clay Buchholz to get Cabrera, I am 100% certain the deal would have already been done. As in the minute trades could be announced.

It would be a horribly unbalanced trade, and Boston would jump all over it.

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I am sorry, but if all it really took was Clay Buchholz to get Cabrera, I am 100% certain the deal would have already been done. As in the minute trades could be announced.

It would be a horribly unbalanced trade, and Boston would jump all over it.

I disagree they would, with that much money and their best young pitcher involved.

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I'm beginning to wonder if Henning is a mouthpiece for the Tigers organization, and they are using him to get fans behind their plans to dump their best young players for prospects. I don't think Henning's articles are total wild speculation. I think he has sources in the organization feeding him information.

Because the way Henning buys into the hype about any and every minor league prospect and breathlessly hypes them is beyond ridiculous. Casper Wells, Ryan Strieby, etc. - these guys will be lucky to have careers as major league bench players, and Henning is hyping them as if they are future All-Stars.

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I disagree they would, with that much money and their best young pitcher involved.

They need a 1B, moving Youk back to 3B, cause Lowell is getting too old. Tell me, if Miguel Cabrera was a free agent, what would Boston offer?

The answer; more than he's getting now .. especially since other teams would be bidding, so the price goes up - for trade, cause the price is down.

Buchholz would be a start, not the end all.

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Any reference to 1983-2000 Peter Gammons, his writing, baseball knowledge and capacity to verify leads and stories bears no relationship to Lynn Henning.One is a HOF wirter the other is ..Lynn Henning.

100% agreed.

Even today, a diminshed Gammons fact checks the caliber of propsects he touts and the trades he specualtes about, Lynn's grasp of the Tiger system is inferior to this board, it's why he is so continuously mocked.

Agreed, though I am not sure how well Gammons fact checks now.

All my point was, and I didn't do a good job of articulating it, is that I believe / suspect the reason Gammons fact checks prospects is that he is convincing himself a trade or story makes sense before he runs with it. Or, in other words, he makes an attempt to connect the dots before making assertions that later don't stand up under close scrutiny.

On some level, all reporters get part of the story from various sources and they need to have the ability to take all these pieces of information (from varying sources and agendas behind them) and put forth the most logical explaination of the situation. The seeming inability or unwillingness of Lynn to ask himself, "does this make sense", before offering his opinion (as fact) is why I am critical of Henning.

Henning as I mentioned earlier in this thread has become Jay Mariotti, he writes to agitate you, if you know enough to be agitated. It's sensationalistic. To bad nobody really pays for newspapers anymore.

I don't think Lynn is mean-spirited nor do I think Lynn believes himself more intelligent than his readership or the people he writes about.

Jay, on the other hand, ...

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First Granderson and then Jackson. Now the Tigers are saying Cabrera???? Let's just trade everyone DD. I can see Jackson being traded, but sending Granderson and Cabrera away would be stupid. Any thoughts? What's going to happen?

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Nothing. Cabrera isn't going anywhere and neither is Granderson IMO. Its all just talk from the ESPN types that think every good player should be a Yankee or Red Sox. Jackson may be traded, since he's at peak value right now.

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There is NO way I'd trade Cabrera or Granderson straight up for Buchholz, he's not THAT good..

..I still can't believe the Red Sox didn't trade Clay for Salty, but, with them getting Victor Martinez very cheaply, the non-move looks like it paid off. They gave up far less and acquired far more......THAT was a great move on their part.

They sure hyped the supposed trade value of Buchholz by not going to Salty straight up and getting Martinez for in essence nothing net cost to them......

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I disagree they would, with that much money and their best young pitcher involved.

Boston almost certainly can add Cabrera's contract.

The disputable fact that Buchholz is their best young pitcher (Lester?) isn't all that relevant - the only thing that matters is if Cabrera is worth enough to Boston to part with Buchholz. I can't imagine Boston turning that deal down.

Also, what the flip happened in 2 years for the Tigers to go from offering Miguel $20MM a year to needing to dump him, especially in face of the fact some $55 MM (!!) comes off the book in a year.

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no one here has expressed any thoughts on the matter. none at all. glad you started this thread to bring it to our attention.

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If Cabrera would be traded I would be upset with any return package that wasn't close to

Lester, Buchholz, and then Ellsbury or a top prospect.

or

Lester, Bard, Ellsbury, and another prospect.

If we could get that type of return, I wouldn't mind trading Cabrera at all. I would then hope that DD traded Jackson for offensive talents and have Strieby play 1B...I understand the production would drop significantly from the 1B spot but we would definitely have some payroll flexibility and a great young core for the next decade.

Verlander

Lester

Porcello

Crosby

Would be a dominant (and relatively cheap) starting rotation for years to come.

Edited by EchO

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no one here has expressed any thoughts on the matter. none at all. glad you started this thread to bring it to our attention.

In his defense, the main Cabrera trade thread is titled "I'm going to puke"...so it would be easy to overlook.

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How can you decide that trading someone is stupid if you don't even know what the return would be? That's seems stupid to me.

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Is the Red Sox farm system deep in talent?

I think more so than having a deep farm system, they have many young, cheap MLB ready talents: Lester, Buchholz, Bard, Tazawa, Reddick, Doubront, Bowden. Their best prospect is probably Lars Anderson who is a power 1B who struggled last year in AA.

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I think more so than having a deep farm system, they have many young, cheap MLB ready talents: Lester, Buchholz, Bard, Tazawa, Reddick, Doubront, Bowden. Their best prospect is probably Lars Anderson who is a power 1B who struggled last year in AA.

OK, thanks for the info.

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