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Edman85

Magglio Incentive Counter

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If the Tigers have a bad contract, don't blame Magglio. If the Tigers wish to avoid bad contractural language, they should quit putting it in contracts instead of putting themselves in the uncomfortable situation they find themselves in now. Yes, Magglio isn't hitting well. It still looks like horsebleep when they don't play him.

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... It still looks like horsebleep when they don't play him.

No. It looks like horsebleep when they DO play him.

MAGGLIO looks like horsebleep.

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If the Tigers have a bad contract, don't blame Magglio. If the Tigers wish to avoid bad contractural language, they should quit putting it in contracts instead of putting themselves in the uncomfortable situation they find themselves in now. Yes, Magglio isn't hitting well. It still looks like horsebleep when they don't play him.

Why are the Tigers compelled to play awful players? It looks like crap when they play lesser players over better players. That includes Magglio over Clete Thomas.

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It must suck for Maggs knowing he is being magnified on every at bat from alot of people......

Just doesn't make any sense that he has gone from one of the best offensive players in the game to one of the worst in one season. I just can't figure it out....no power, has a hard time getting the bat around, his concentration looks confused. We really could use his bat in the 2nd half, but you can't keep putting him in there for a single in 4 at bats a game.....

Why not? We did it with Shef for 1 1/2 years and then paid him 14 Million to go away. :classic:

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An OPS well over 1.000 with 10-15 home runs and a batting average over .400.

Even then, I would say "cut him." His contract is awful and we cannot have that anchor of a contract on our team the next two years.

I agree, unless he gets really, really hot and leads us to a WS victory.

Then, he could suck the next 2 years, not play, and I wouldn't care what the Tigers paid him, as long as we had contributions from RF at little cost.

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If the Tigers have a bad contract, don't blame Magglio. If the Tigers wish to avoid bad contractural language, they should quit putting it in contracts instead of putting themselves in the uncomfortable situation they find themselves in now. Yes, Magglio isn't hitting well. It still looks like horsebleep when they don't play him.

Because playing him is working out so well? Why give playing time to an aging player who has rapidly lost his skills. He doesn't do anything well - hit, run or play defense. Leyland continuing to use him as an everyday player is the definition of insanity. Playing him doesn't help the Tigers win now or benefit them in the future (once they are on the hook for his option years); not playing him benefits the team now and in the future. I enjoyed watching him play for the Tigers for the past few years, but I am eagarly awaiting the day he is released.

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If the Tigers have a bad contract, don't blame Magglio. If the Tigers wish to avoid bad contractural language, they should quit putting it in contracts instead of putting themselves in the uncomfortable situation they find themselves in now. Yes, Magglio isn't hitting well. It still looks like horsebleep when they don't play him.

You should be telling Boras this and not the Tigers. If Boras didn't include this then Magglio would still be around. There's nothing wrong with the Tigers not playing him, he's been awful this year and Magglio should be thankful others on the team have helped the team to be in 1st place because Magglio hasn't helped out in the least. Just because Magglio hit a HR 3 years ago doesn't mean he should be given a free pass by fans and the team. In fact you could make the case he shouldn't even be on the team right now and even be given the opportunity to reach his incentives. He's been awful this year.

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I just don't know where this "don't blame Maggs/don't hate Maggs/feel bad for Maggs" sentiment is going. No one hates Maggs. I don't know anyone who thinks that this is Maggs fault. No one in their right mind would suggest that Magglio wants to suck. So how is a statement like:

"If the Tigers have a bad contract, don't blame Magglio. If the Tigers wish to avoid bad contractural language, they should quit putting it in contracts instead of putting themselves in the uncomfortable situation they find themselves in now. Yes, Magglio isn't hitting well. It still looks like horsebleep when they don't play him."

relevant at all? The only uncomfortable situation I see is that a subpar player has gotten far more playing time this year than he deserves.

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If the Tigers have a bad contract, don't blame Magglio. If the Tigers wish to avoid bad contractural language, they should quit putting it in contracts instead of putting themselves in the uncomfortable situation they find themselves in now. Yes, Magglio isn't hitting well. It still looks like horsebleep when they don't play him.

Nice post..I have noticed so many have found it to be insightful and factual..many have agreed with the sound premise..or not.

Let me get this straight, only the team has to suffer the consequences of contractual language..hahahahahaha that is too damn funny..Maggs is done..with Thomas recalled and Guillen about to go out on rehab...drive up from Toledo and pay your respects...it's over...play taps..

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Did you see him bobble that ball in right tonight? DROP HIM NOW!

And I didn't use sarcasm or fancy colors to dictate it as such. He's done.

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You should be telling Boras this and not the Tigers. If Boras didn't include this then Magglio would still be around. There's nothing wrong with the Tigers not playing him, he's been awful this year and Magglio should be thankful others on the team have helped the team to be in 1st place because Magglio hasn't helped out in the least. Just because Magglio hit a HR 3 years ago doesn't mean he should be given a free pass by fans and the team. In fact you could make the case he shouldn't even be on the team right now and even be given the opportunity to reach his incentives. He's been awful this year.

Sweet goodness, I actually agree with you on something.

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..Maggs is done..with Thomas recalled and Guillen about to go out on rehab...drive up from Toledo and pay your respects...it's over...play taps..

Then why don't they release him instead of getting rid of Kelly?

I don't see any evidence that the Tigers think the grievance is a non-issue.

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This is as good a place as any to ask this. Does the vesting option include only the regular season or would any potential playoff at-bats count?

I can see a scenario where the Tigers continue to contend, using a strict platoon of Clete/Magglio in RF. Since there are fewer LHP than RHP, Clete gets the majority of ABs. If Magglio somehow gets hot in the playoffs (hypothetically, of course) I don't want this whole vesting option thing to factor in.

Edited by djhutch

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This is as good a place as any to ask this. Does the vesting option include only the regular season or would any potential playoff at-bats count?

I can see a scenario where the Tigers continue to contend, using a strict platoon of Clete/Magglio in RF. Since there are fewer LHP than RHP, Clete gets the majority of ABs. If Magglio somehow gets hot in the playoffs (hypothetically, of course) I don't want this whole vesting option thing to factor in.

At bats in the playoffs don't count.

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Then why don't they release him instead of getting rid of Kelly?

I don't see any evidence that the Tigers think the grievance is a non-issue.

You've obviously forgotten that everyone at MTS is an expert, particularly with the MLBPA and contract related issues. And certainly everyone here is much more acutely aware of the ramnifications, or lack thereof, of releasing Maggs now than the Tiger's organization.

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I am still confused on if we can even release him, and not pay him .. no matter if a new team signs him or not. I hate this topic :tired:

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I am still confused on if we can even release him, and not pay him .. no matter if a new team signs him or not. I hate this topic :tired:

If they release him, the Tigers pay him what's left of this years salary plus a 3 million dollar buyout.

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Perhaps there's another way to go about this. I think Maggs has an option left (but can't access Edman's blog to confirm it). So what if you option him to Toledo. Tell him that you want him to get 100-125 PA's there to improve his swing and "get right".

First thing that does is minimize his ability to reach his PA target for vesting, even if you bring him back up later in the season. I'm pretty sure minor league PAs won't count toward the vesting option...

Second thing is that maybe, just maybe, he can actually work through his problems in an environment with less pressure. I doubt it but not out of the realm of possibility.

Third, if he doesn't come out of his funk, you can then release him with very good "cause"... hey, if you can't perform in AAA, hard to win a grievance filing.

But even more, as a player with 5+ years service time, Maggs can decline the option and become a FA. And I think this is a strong possibility he'd choose to become a FA. I'm not 100% sure what happens then from a contractual standpoint. But it's hard to file a grievance if the player is the one that elected to become a FA (i.e. we didn't designate him, he elected it). Probably we are simply on the hook for 2009 and maybe the $3M buyout. But maybe not even that much.

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Vazquez has too much value for Braves to move - FOX Sports on MSN

One Tigers official says of right fielder Magglio Ordonez: "If he hits at all in the second half, we win this thing." Bold words perhaps, but the Tigers have played more road games (47) than any club. They're 21-26 on the road, 23-11 at Comerica Park . . .

This tells me that the team is not considering the option of cutting him. I guess they are holding out hope that he might actually have some good baseball in him. I'm either glad that they see something and that perhaps he could be the addition to the offense that the team needs, or outraged that they could be so foolish.

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Vazquez has too much value for Braves to move - FOX Sports on MSN

This tells me that the team is not considering the option of cutting him. I guess they are holding out hope that he might actually have some good baseball in him. I'm either glad that they see something and that perhaps he could be the addition to the offense that the team needs, or outraged that they could be so foolish.

I know where I stand. And it's not the former.

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Vazquez has too much value for Braves to move - FOX Sports on MSN

This tells me that the team is not considering the option of cutting him. I guess they are holding out hope that he might actually have some good baseball in him. I'm either glad that they see something and that perhaps he could be the addition to the offense that the team needs, or outraged that they could be so foolish.

Yeah, that tells me that they are not good scouts. I hope they don't end up on the hook for 15 mil because of some hope.

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If he hits at all, we win. Presumably the same would be true of his replacement who the team wouldn't be on the hook for $30+ million to over the next two seasons.

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This tells me that the team is not considering the option of cutting him. I guess they are holding out hope that he might actually have some good baseball in him. I'm either glad that they see something and that perhaps he could be the addition to the offense that the team needs, or outraged that they could be so foolish.

Normally I'd say that official's comment is just trade posturing... but who in the heck would trade for Maggs? No one I think.

And while I do think the organization has to be considering all options, including releasing him, I think that many here at MTS have oversimplified the equation. It's not an easy decision to make, and depending upon the organization's view of the trade market, a turnaround by Magglio could represent their opinion for the best chance to improve our offense. Right or wrong, I don't know, but none of us know what they are thinking at this point.

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