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What happened the the great "teach them to throw strikes guru" Knapp?

Zumaya - 25 IP 16 BB

Rodney - 31 IP 15 BB

Robertson - 21 IP 14 BB

Miner - 46 IP 21 BB

Perry - 27 IP 21 BB

j

Knapp has been working with these guys for all of about five months. Yet these guys have been playing organized baseball for about 15-20 years. You can't expect him to change these guys over night.

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What happened the the great "teach them to throw strikes guru" Knapp?

Zumaya - 25 IP 16 BB

Rodney - 31 IP 15 BB

Robertson - 21 IP 14 BB

Miner - 46 IP 21 BB

Perry - 27 IP 21 BB

That's more of an indictment of Chuck Hernandez than Knapp.

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That's more of an indictment of Chuck Hernandez than Knapp.

I think it is more of an organizational philosophy. We like big, strong pitchers who can really throw it. Verlander, Perry, Rodney, Zumaya, Satterwhite, Turner, Jackson, Figaro... the list goes on and on. A lot of our guys have lively arms and struggle with their control. I think we are willing to take a gamble on their natural talent and golden arms and hope that the control comes. B/c if/ when it does, a season like Edwin Jackson is having, happens. When it doesn't Zumaya's month of June happens. High risk, high reward.

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The Houston Astros didn't snap the Tigers' winning streak on Friday night. Joel Zumaya's triple digit miles per hour pitches out of the strike zone snapped the Tigers' winning streak on Friday night.

Maybe a stint in Toledo would do him some good.

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The Houston Astros didn't snap the Tigers' winning streak on Friday night. Joel Zumaya's triple digit miles per hour pitches out of the strike zone snapped the Tigers' winning streak on Friday night.

Maybe a stint in Toledo would do him some good.

Holy overeaction Batman..people/athletes have ups anddowns in their performance. Let me describe what a pitcher is trying to do..they are trying to throw a hard round sphere into a space that is about the size of a small cup in diameter (catchers mitt) from 60 feet 6 inches away..the sphere is moving in Zumaya's case at 100+ MPH..even the slightest variance in rhythm changes the mechanics or relase point which affects the accuracy..changing that release point by a mere inch may affect the accuracy by 2 or 3 inches..what we perceive as wildness is far more subtle to a pitcher. Lets add in that many times when you are throwing daily, your shoulder is screaming and elbow throbbing..

So dont be so quick to judge..it's far more difficult than it looks..and the mistakes that are miniscule, result in changes that are huge.

It seems like yesterday we all wanted to barebeque Brandon Lyon (myself included) and suddenly he is beloved..Zumaya will be fine..these are the type of growing experiences players go thorugh and need to go through to become better..sort of like what doesn't kill you theory..

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It seems like yesterday we all wanted to barbecue Brandon Lyon (myself included) and suddenly he is beloved. Zumaya will be fine.

+1

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It seems like yesterday we all wanted to barebeque Brandon Lyon (myself included) and suddenly he is beloved..Zumaya will be fine..these are the type of growing experiences players go thorugh and need to go through to become better..sort of like what doesn't kill you theory..

Yes.

If a guy has a track record of success, and that includes league-average pitching at the MLB level, you have to presume that he'll bounce back unless something drastic has changed. Zumaya never had pinpoint control, but it's worse than it usually was right now. Lyon did have pretty much pinpoint control, but never much stuff, and when he was bad, both were off.

Everyone in this bullpen except Nate Robertson is going to have to get important outs for this club to be a first place team come the end of September. Joel has done it and will do it later. Right now, he's in a rough patch. That's all it is.

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I was camping the last 3 nights and was pleased to listen to the Tigers take 2 of 3 while I was gone. I heard Zoom blow the game last night and was shouting at him while he blew it but really Verlander blew it as well because he was at 85 pitches in the 4th inning and could not go late in the game again. Without Zumaya the Tigers are going nowhere so they need to keep throwing him out there....if he can find the strikezone with the slow pitch he will be dominant.

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Demote him from a set up role. He should not pitch when the team has a lead. His location is horrible.

I honestly wonder if he wouldn't benefit from a trip to Toledo at this point.

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Yes.

If a guy has a track record of success, and that includes league-average pitching at the MLB level, you have to presume that he'll bounce back unless something drastic has changed. Zumaya never had pinpoint control, but it's worse than it usually was right now. Lyon did have pretty much pinpoint control, but never much stuff, and when he was bad, both were off.

Everyone in this bullpen except Nate Robertson is going to have to get important outs for this club to be a first place team come the end of September. Joel has done it and will do it later. Right now, he's in a rough patch. That's all it is.

The problem I have with what your saying is that Zumaya does not have much of a track record outside of 2006. And the 2006 success could just be a function of hitters seeing him for the first time.

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He's blown like 4 games in the last month. I was at a Cubs and Royals game where he gave up HR, the Houston game, and now tonight.

He needs to go. This team has so much dead weight now.

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They really need to send him to Toledo and hope he gets his head straight and starts throwing strikes. They simply cannot afford to give away any more games at this point in the season.

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Demote him from a set up role. He should not pitch when the team has a lead. His location is horrible.

I honestly wonder if he wouldn't benefit from a trip to Toledo at this point.

I think the Tigers need to really consider this. Let him think it over down there for a couple of weeks and try and get it together again.

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Zumaya has more experience than Hughes, but Zumaya could learn a thing or two about the difference between strikes and quality strikes by watching Hughes.

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Sending him to Toledo might be a good idea. I am actually encouraged that Zumaya has been able to pitch at all this year given his injury history. The fact that he not lost any speed is amazing. They can't keep putting him out there in key spots though. He needs to work things out and a trip to the minors might help.

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I'm so sick of this worthless piece of ****. Why does Leyland consider him... ever???? He's awful. You could throw a 200 MPH fastball, but it's no good if it's straight as an arrow. Go away, Zumaya. You suck and I hate you.

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Either a trip to the DL or Toledo. Regardless, his *** needs to go somewhere.

The gas can looks like Kyle Farnsworth 2.0

Hahaha, I've been calling him the Hispanic Farnsworthless on Twitter for quite some time now. Dead on. Cool straight fastball... really effective in the pros.

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I'm so sick of this worthless piece of ****. Why does Leyland consider him... ever???? He's awful. You could throw a 200 MPH fastball, but it's no good if it's straight as an arrow. Go away, Zumaya. You suck and I hate you.

Tone that rhetoric down a peg . He's struggling right now but this is over the top.

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I'm so sick of this worthless piece of ****. Why does Leyland consider him... ever???? He's awful. You could throw a 200 MPH fastball, but it's no good if it's straight as an arrow. Go away, Zumaya. You suck and I hate you.

In the words of Jim Price, Wow. Just Wow.

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Zumaya has now made 29 appearances this year including tonight, and if you back out the 5 straight scoreless appearances he had to start the season, you are left with:

24 G, 25.0 IP, 29 H, 18 R, 17 ER, 22 BB, 28 K, 5 HR, 6.12 ERA, 2.04 WHIP

That's beyond bad. That is a guy who has no business being on a major league roster right now.

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Jim Price would just blame that gopherball on the supposed jet streams before rambling incoherently

You want to hear something scary?

You might just be looking at your defacto closer for 2010

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I don't think Zumaya needs to be sent down to Toledo. I think he should get a real wake-up call by being sent to Erie first, and let him earn a promotion to Toledo.

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