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I think it's obvious that Dumars plans to swing for the fences, but I don't think he is going to find a willing dance partner. He will try and get Bosh, Stoudamire, Paul, Anthony but won't succeed. What I fear is that his Plan B involves him just going down the NBA depth chart until he finds a taker. I don't want a Carlos Boozer or Vince Carter making $14M per year on the Pistons.

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http://realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/59050/20090508/will_pistons_make_a_run_at_gordon/#

Will Pistons Make A Run At Gordon?

K.C. Johnson of the Chicago Tribune is adamant in his belief that the Pistons will make a run at Ben Gordon this summer.

With the contracts of Allen Iverson and Rasheed Wallace coming off the books, Detroit will have plenty of cap space to use on a free agent like Gordon.

Gotta move Rip if you want Gordon.

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I really don't understand how a man who built an incredibly successful franchise and brought 3 championships to Detroit, more than any of his counterparts in the 3 major sports here, is held up as an impediment or excuse for Dumars.

First, he cleared the air with Thomas so he did forgive. But what was that dispute allegedly about? Thomas' post-playing career in management. Given Isiah's track record, Davidson should be applauded for the split. I don't know about Carlisle, but Carlisle did have nice things to say about Davidson when he passed away so I'm not sure about any ongoing feud. Regardless, Carlisle has yet to accomplish what Detroit did after he left, I don't see a reason for regret. And if it was Davidson that had Carlisle fired, how much more unconventional do you want? Firing a winning coach that had taken the team from the ashes to the ECFs is pretty unconventional.

An unrestricted Dumars scares the heck out of me. When you take Davidson and Hammond away from him I'm not sure what's there. Time will tell but given the hand he had when he made his comments at the end of last season, I can't think of a single play he's gotten obvioulsy right.

I didn't mean to come off as a name caller. Just that Davidson was very involved, & Dumars may have even more rope than before. That will impact the team. I don't know whether it will be good or bad at this point, just that it will have an impact. I think a pretty substantial one.

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I do not think Gordon is an upgrade over Rip but he is 5 years younger and just entering his prime. He also would do well to play next to a bigger point guard like Stuckey. I would offer him 7-9 million per year but I would not brink the bank for him.

I do think this is the time for the Pistons to trade Rip. He has several good years left and a lot of value to a team just one step away from contending for a title. But his value to the Pistons is limited at this point because we are not even close to contending and going into rebuilding mode. We might as well trade him and get some young talent or draft picks in return.

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I think Gordon would fit better then Hamilton with Stuckey, and Gordon is the kind of player who can finish games too. Hamilton is a great guy with a PG who can set him up, and get him the ball where he needs it, but at the end of games you need guys who can do a better job of getting their shot off. Defensively Stuckey could guard the big 2's, and Gordon could match up with the points.

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I think Gordon would fit better then Hamilton with Stuckey, and Gordon is the kind of player who can finish games too. Hamilton is a great guy with a PG who can set him up, and get him the ball where he needs it, but at the end of games you need guys who can do a better job of getting their shot off. Defensively Stuckey could guard the big 2's, and Gordon could match up with the points.

I agree with you that Gordon is more of an asset at the end of close games. I don't know that Hamilton needs to play with a great point guard to set him up though. Most of time, he does all the work with the constant movement, coming off screens, and all the point guard has to do is get him the ball at the right time. It is not a difficult pass to make; you just have to time it right.

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I'm wondering if perhaps another homecoming would be in order. I imagine the Sixers would be awfully interested in a legit starting SG. If Pistons were willing to take back Brand or Dalembert they may even get more assets out of them.

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I'm wondering if perhaps another homecoming would be in order. I imagine the Sixers would be awfully interested in a legit starting SG. If Pistons were willing to take back Brand or Dalembert they may even get more assets out of them.

I wonder how available Brand really is. If he is available, I would think long and hard about going after him. I know the contract is scary with his injury issues but at this point, he might be the only way we can turn this thing around anytime soon. He is the only real difference maker I can see that can be had in a trade...maybe Stoudamire as well.

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Around the trade deadline I was on the Brand bandwagon. Then he went out and had yet another season ending injury. I think I would have to pass on a 30 year old injury prone guy with a massive contract. Dalembert doesn't do it for me either.

To me, adding a player like Brand would suggest that Joe thinks they are a player or two away from winning now. After what I saw this year from this team, I don't really think that is possible. I honestly think they need to totally rebuilding and aim to win in another 2-3 years.

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Around the trade deadline I was on the Brand bandwagon. Then he went out and had yet another season ending injury. I think I would have to pass on a 30 year old injury prone guy with a massive contract. Dalembert doesn't do it for me either.

To me, adding a player like Brand would suggest that Joe thinks they are a player or two away from winning now. After what I saw this year from this team, I don't really think that is possible. I honestly think they need to totally rebuilding and aim to win in another 2-3 years.

I guess my feeling is Brand is the type of impact player who can turn things around for a team in one year. In his prime, he was a franchise player. I would agree with you that we are 2-3 years from winning the way things are right now but Brand would change that immediately.

To make trading for Brand worthwhile, he would need to be the same player he was for the Clippers 3 or 4 years ago, or at least close to it. That may be a stretch but maybe that is a chance worth taking. I can understand the point of view though that he is not worth the risk. In my mind though, it is worth the risk because I am skeptical we could contend three years from now even if we don't take that risk.

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I just don't think Brand is someone you hitch your wagon to for a championship run. When you are injured 2-3 seasons in a row, you are in TMac and Yao Ming territory. Good players, but you can never count on them being around in the playoffs so I cant see how you build around them.

Best case scenario is they trade Rip for Brand, and he stays healthy and returns to previous form. Sign Gordon to replace Rip for $8-$10 million per. They take the rest of their cap space and get a center. Not an impossible task, but still a tough one. I admit if anyone is going to keep Brand healthy, it would be the Pistons medical staff.

Worst case is you get Brand and he remains hurt most of his career. Then you owe him over $60 million over the next 4 years. That basically sinks you into years of low seed playoff blowouts and lottery picks. I'm all for taking a risk, but I think you can find something better then one that will sink your franchise for the next 4-6 years if it fails.

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I just don't think Brand is someone you hitch your wagon to for a championship run. When you are injured 2-3 seasons in a row, you are in TMac and Yao Ming territory. Good players, but you can never count on them being around in the playoffs so I cant see how you build around them.

Best case scenario is they trade Rip for Brand, and he stays healthy and returns to previous form. Sign Gordon to replace Rip for $8-$10 million per. They take the rest of their cap space and get a center. Not an impossible task, but still a tough one. I admit if anyone is going to keep Brand healthy, it would be the Pistons medical staff.

Worst case is you get Brand and he remains hurt most of his career. Then you owe him over $60 million over the next 4 years. That basically sinks you into years of low seed playoff blowouts and lottery picks. I'm all for taking a risk, but I think you can find something better then one that will sink your franchise for the next 4-6 years if it fails.

I understand what you are saying. My thinking is this franchise is probably not going to be a contender the next 4-6 years anyways so why not take the chance on Brand?

Realisitically, what are the chances the Pistons are able to build a team to beat Cleveland in the next five years? Very slim it seems with the way things are now. We are not going to get a franchise player in this draft and I highly doubt Dumars is going into next season with the intention of getting a top three pick in next year's draft either. I really believe Dumars is banking on Chris Bosh next year...who is not even really a franchise player but is at least an elite player. I am fine with that plan but I wouldn't put the fate of this franchise on signing Bosh next year because we might not even get him.

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I think Gordon would fit better then Hamilton with Stuckey, and Gordon is the kind of player who can finish games too. Hamilton is a great guy with a PG who can set him up, and get him the ball where he needs it, but at the end of games you need guys who can do a better job of getting their shot off. Defensively Stuckey could guard the big 2's, and Gordon could match up with the points.

I don't know if that's true about Gordon. I don't watch him every night but friends who are Bulls fans complain plenty about his shot selection, selfishness and turnovers. I don't know if that's true either but they don't want him back. They'd rather see the Bulls get a post scorer (sounds familiar).

What I do know is that he turned down a 5 year $50 million offer from the Bulls a while back and I don't think he's worth that much to the Pistons right now.

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I don't know if that's true about Gordon. I don't watch him every night but friends who are Bulls fans complain plenty about his shot selection, selfishness and turnovers. I don't know if that's true either but they don't want him back. They'd rather see the Bulls get a post scorer (sounds familiar).

What I do know is that he turned down a 5 year $50 million offer from the Bulls a while back and I don't think he's worth that much to the Pistons right now.

Well, no I don't think 5/50 is on the table anymore. I want him at a discount. The Pistons won't have much competition in the offseason, so they need to get some bargains this year.

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Well, no I don't think 5/50 is on the table anymore. I want him at a discount. The Pistons won't have much competition in the offseason, so they need to get some bargains this year.

I'd like to see Dumars do what he did when he lost Hill. . .go out and find some bargain-type, character guys who fit whatever identity they determine they are trying to build. They began the run with an identity to build around, more than a player (though Ben came to personify it pretty quickly) and that seems like an easier path.

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I'd like to see Dumars do what he did when he lost Hill. . .go out and find some bargain-type, character guys who fit whatever identity they determine they are trying to build. They began the run with an identity to build around, more than a player (though Ben came to personify it pretty quickly) and that seems like an easier path.

Easier said than done. I don't really see any Ben Wallace types available and that was really the guy who set the tone for the old Pistons.

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Easier said than done. I don't really see any Ben Wallace types available and that was really the guy who set the tone for the old Pistons.

I'm not sure anybody saw Ben becoming what he became back then either. Then there was Billups who came pretty cheaply by NBA standards, a trade for Rip, a gem in the draft in Prince, and finally a bunch of pieces that helped establish the team were traded for Rasheed.

You're right, it's easier said than done but it seems preferable to the alternative FA route with guys like Boozer or Gordon.

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How much money do we have available this summer and how much money do we have available next summer? Is it different next summer? Do we not spend and save it for '10?

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Here's a good chart showing which teams will have money, how much, and which players they'll need to make decisions on over the next few years. Its a little old (before the trading deadline) and has a few things that have changed. For one, the Heat took on a bunch of salary with O'Neal. The Pistons could have even more cap space in 2010 than this year, but so will about 2/3 of the league.

salarycap.gif

http://www.scoresreport.com/2009/02/05/which-nba-teams-project-to-have-the-most-cap-space-over-the-next-two-years/

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http://motownsports.com/forums/showthread.php?t=71225

Kwame Brown won't rush decision on option

Decision time is coming for Pistons center Kwame Brown, but his camp is in no rush to decide if he will return next season.

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Brown's agent, Mark Bartelstein, said Thursday that Brown will take his time to decide whether to exercise his $4.1-million player option or hit the open market when free agency begins July 1.

"We'll do it sometime in the next month and a half," Bartelstein said. "When the season's over I think it's good to get away for a while and clear your head before making a decision.

"The season was kind of a roller coaster for him, but we'll make a decision in the coming weeks."

Brown, 27, has until 24 hours before the June 25 NBA draft to inform the Pistons of his decision.

Brown, a former No. 1 overall pick whose star-crossed career had seen him wearing three different uniforms before arriving in the Detroit, is coming off an up-and-down season.

His playing time was uneven, but he did show promise as a post defender and the team performed better on the boards when he was a consistent part of the lineup.

He averaged 4.2 points and 5.0 rebounds per game in an average of 17.2 minutes per game. He appeared in 58 games with 30 starts.

As far as factors in his decision, Bartelstein admitted the dour economy could play a role -- why risk making less than $4.1 million as a free agent?

"The economy affects everything and you have to be cognizant of what goes on in the world," Bartelstein said. "We'll evaluate everything, but the most important thing is for Kwame to grow as a player.

"We'll weigh it all and come to a decision."

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Kwame Brown won't rush decision on option

Pretty funny. We can't even be sure to get a scrub like Kwame to sign with us, yet Joe thought it was a good idea to free up a bunch of cap space in the hopes of landing a star free agent instead of trading expiring contracts for players that are currently still under contract.

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Pretty funny. We can't even be sure to get a scrub like Kwame to sign with us, yet Joe thought it was a good idea to free up a bunch of cap space in the hopes of landing a star free agent instead of trading expiring contracts for players that are currently still under contract.

Truthfully.. root for Kwame to be delerious and not sign..the more cap space to make deals the better.

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Pretty funny. We can't even be sure to get a scrub like Kwame to sign with us, yet Joe thought it was a good idea to free up a bunch of cap space in the hopes of landing a star free agent instead of trading expiring contracts for players that are currently still under contract.

Two totally different situations. Kwame has 1 year left at a set price. He wouldn't be leaving because he doesn't like it here. He would be leaving because he could get more money or a longer term contract. Do you really want Detroit to start toying with the idea of giving him a long term deat at $6-$7 million per? I know I don't, and I like the kid.

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Truthfully.. root for Kwame to be delerious and not sign..the more cap space to make deals the better.

Or...

He's the "key" player in a trade for Tyson Chandler...

:grin:

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Or...

He's the "key" player in a trade for Tyson Chandler...

:grin:

I like Tyson, I like it better, when he plays..which from season to season is always a moving target.

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