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Doctor Detroit

Miguel Cabrera was worth it and then some

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Miggy Cabrera: 2009 Triple Crown Winner.

Him and A-Rod are the only batters in the AL capable of doing such a thing. And with A-Rod out..

We can dream, right? :classic:

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Don't insult Cabrera by making that comparison.

By comparing him to one of the all time greats?

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Him and A-Rod are the only batters in the AL capable of doing such a thing. And with A-Rod out..

We can dream, right? :classic:

You don't think Josh Hamilton is capable of that?

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By comparing him to one of the all time greats?

Pete Rose wasn't one of the all time greats. He was a great player who was very durable but let's not get carried away.

All Time Greats are Cobb, Ruth, Mays, Williams, Aaron, etc. The top 10% of Hall of Famers. Rose wouldn't have been in that group.

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Uh.... Pete Rose comparisons? If Cabrera hangs around as long as Pete did he'll get 5,500 hits.

He needs to average about 210 hits/season for the next 15 years in order to break the record. There is a better chance that he eats himself out of the league in 8 years than that happening. Lets be real.

However, I do agree that he's a great player and looks great so far this year. Let's just take it easy on being homers and comparing him to the hit king.

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Pete Rose wasn't one of the all time greats. He was a great player who was very durable but let's not get carried away.

All Time Greats are Cobb, Ruth, Mays, Williams, Aaron, etc. The top 10% of Hall of Famers. Rose wouldn't have been in that group.

Yeah, but Miguel Cabrera will! (I hope so, anyway. He's off to a hellova start, that's for sure!)

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Pete Rose wasn't one of the all time greats. He was a great player who was very durable but let's not get carried away.

All Time Greats are Cobb, Ruth, Mays, Williams, Aaron, etc. The top 10% of Hall of Famers. Rose wouldn't have been in that group.

If you said top 1 or 2% of the hall of famers maybe I'd agree with you. But he is easily the top 10%. Just because you weren't around to see the guy play doesn't mean he wasn't one of the all time greats. Pete Rose had more hits in a season than Miguel Cabrera's best season so far 12 different times. The guy was an absolute hitting machine. Look at his career stats compared to somebody like Willie Mays (who I believe to probably be the best ever overall player). If you look at hits and average, Willie Mays looks like a chump in comparison. Of course there is more to it than just hitting singles, but he's so far above almost everyone else that you have to be joking to argue that he isn't one of the all time greats.

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He needs to average about 210 hits/season for the next 15 years in order to break the record. There is a better chance that he eats himself out of the league in 8 years than that happening. Lets be real.

However, I do agree that he's a great player and looks great so far this year. Let's just take it easy on being homers and comparing him to the hit king.

Like Edman said, he's well ahead of Rose's pace at this point. Factor in the slugging, which you HAVE to do, and Cabrera is far better. If he continues this he will likely be remember as one of the top 10 hitters of all-time. Rose? Not so much. Great singles hitter. I'd take a guy like Cabrera any day.

Maybe saying the comparison is an insult is a bit of a stretch, because he does need to keep this up for a while, and its hard to keep it up for as long as Pete did, but Miguel is a much better hitter.

And the fat, eats a lot jokes are really lame, IMO. When you resort to that then your argument loses a bit of credibility, you know? Presenting a well thought out argument without fat jokes is a much better idea.

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Yeah, but Miguel Cabrera will! (I hope so, anyway. He's off to a hellova start, that's for sure!)

Brandon Inge will break the single season homerun mark by the all star break too.

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And the fat, eats a lot jokes are really lame, IMO. When you resort to that then your argument loses a bit of credibility, you know? Presenting a well thought out argument without fat jokes is a much better idea.

And not just that, he's obviously looked a bit thinner since his Florida days. He seems to move easier at first. He's not really fat as much as he's just so darn large, in frame and height. And even if he got Cecil sized, there's always the designated hitter.

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Brandon Inge will break the single season homerun mark by the all star break too.

What do you have against Cabrera? You seem to be getting a bit irrational and I'm having trouble making sense of it.

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You don't think Josh Hamilton is capable of that?

He could. I honestly forgot about him while making the post. I'd actually like to see if he could post up another season with similar numbers, but he's up there regardless.

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And the fat, eats a lot jokes are really lame, IMO. When you resort to that then your argument loses a bit of credibility, you know? Presenting a well thought out argument without fat jokes is a much better idea.

You're arguing with a guy that once argued with me about what a cut fastball was, and when it was apparent that he was wrong, he just said that I "probably got cut as a freshman by Coach Devries."

EDIT - DGTigers happens to be a pretty good athlete, incidentally. It's just that being reasonable isn't really his forte.

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Like Edman said, he's well ahead of Rose's pace at this point. Factor in the slugging, which you HAVE to do, and Cabrera is far better. If he continues this he will likely be remember as one of the top 10 hitters of all-time. Rose? Not so much. Great singles hitter. I'd take a guy like Cabrera any day.

Maybe saying the comparison is an insult is a bit of a stretch, because he does need to keep this up for a while, and its hard to keep it up for as long as Pete did, but Miguel is a much better hitter.

And the fat, eats a lot jokes are really lame, IMO. When you resort to that then your argument loses a bit of credibility, you know? Presenting a well thought out argument without fat jokes is a much better idea.

I don't disagree that I shouldn't default to a fat comment in an argument. This is where I'm coming from though:

Everyone is comparing Cabrera to the record that takes the most longevity in the game to achieve. Most players don't stay in the league for 25 years because their body breaks down. What is the average career in the big leagues? I don't know off the top of my head but I'll roughly guess...13 seasons? Keeping yourself in great shape will most definitely give you the best chance to stay sharp and healthy in ensuring a longer career.

If you are arguing that Cabrera might break the single season RBI record, or win a bunch of MVPs in a row or silver sluggers, or even a triple crown, i most definitely can see that. But comparing him to the one record that takes the most LONGEVITY is the biggest stretch there is. He does not have the body for it. Less than 1% of guys do. It's not an insult it's just the wrong record to look at. Maybe when he's at 3500 hits and still getting 180/season you will have a point.

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What do you have against Cabrera? You seem to be getting a bit irrational and I'm having trouble making sense of it.

It has nothing to do with Cabrera. He's a great player. It's just irrational to compare him and his 1029 hits to a guy with 4256 hits right now and even crazier to say "don't insult Cabrera by comparing him to Pete Rose."

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Of course there is more to it than just hitting singles, but he's so far above almost everyone else that you have to be joking to argue that he isn't one of the all time greats.

I'd say Rose is an all-time great, but he's in the second tier of all time greats. As Oblong said, there are the Ruths, Cobbs, Mays, Musials; then there's another level below that: the Roses, Kalines, Clementes, Gehringers.

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You're arguing with a guy that once argued with me about what a cut fastball was, and when it was apparent that he was wrong, he just said that I "probably got cut as a freshman by Coach Devries."

EDIT - DGTigers happens to be a pretty good athlete, incidentally. It's just that being reasonable isn't really his forte.

Ha, well thanks for the half compliment and sorry we've never spoken in real life (that I recall) so your impression can be based on something other than a message board.

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Pardon me for saying this, but how in the HELL did the Rose to Cabrera comparison get made in the first place? It just isn't an apt comparison.

Seriously, why compare a slap hitter who played multiple positions versus a power hitter who is a 1B? It makes no sense.

Why not compare Cabrera to other power hitting 1B, such as McGwire or Thomas or McCovey or Murray or something?

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Pardon me for saying this, but how in the HELL did the Rose to Cabrera comparison get made in the first place? It just isn't an apt comparison.

Seriously, why compare a slap hitter who played multiple positions versus a power hitter who is a 1B? It makes no sense.

Why not compare Cabrera to other power hitting 1B, such as McGwire or Thomas or McCovey or Murray or something?

Yeah I don't get that either. Pete Rose<>Miggy for so many reasons.

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Pardon me for saying this, but how in the HELL did the Rose to Cabrera comparison get made in the first place? It just isn't an apt comparison.

Seriously, why compare a slap hitter who played multiple positions versus a power hitter who is a 1B? It makes no sense.

Why not compare Cabrera to other power hitting 1B, such as McGwire or Thomas or McCovey or Murray or something?

That's what I was thinking. It's like comparing Walter Johnson to Cool Papa Bell! :classic:

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Pardon me for saying this, but how in the HELL did the Rose to Cabrera comparison get made in the first place? It just isn't an apt comparison.

Seriously, why compare a slap hitter who played multiple positions versus a power hitter who is a 1B? It makes no sense.

Why not compare Cabrera to other power hitting 1B, such as McGwire or Thomas or McCovey or Murray or something?

exactly. No power hitter is going to challenge the hit record. As soon as the bat speed slows the numbers will decline much faster than a singles hitter.

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It has nothing to do with Cabrera. He's a great player. It's just irrational to compare him and his 1029 hits to a guy with 4256 hits right now and even crazier to say "don't insult Cabrera by comparing him to Pete Rose."

I don't think Cabrera has to last that long. I tip my had to Pete for being that durable and being able to be a productive player that long.

But the argument is that year in and year out, Cabrera is a much, much better hitter. Rose racked up his numbers by being durable, which is great, but I think it's unrealistic to ask anyone to do that, and I also think it's unfair to say a player isn't as good as him simply because he might not be as durable. Look at year-by-year production and it isn't close. That's all I'm saying. I think the constant bashing of Cabrera based on a guess that he won't be as durable as Pete is a bit ridiculous.

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