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The Penguins host the Red Wings in Stanley Cup Finals game 6! June 4th, NBC/CBC @8pm!

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But go ahead and debate it if you want. That's what happened.

OK, they showed a slow motion replay from above the net with the clock embedded that showed time run out before the puck started traveling across the crease. So no, the game was over when he got his stick down protecting the post.

Slanting every rebound to "Ozzie blows another save" is just not true. It was a bad rebound, but they happen all the time, to the best goalies, in big games. Get over it. He played amazingly well for 10-12 playoff games. He had a couple of rough games too, more near the end when everyone's stomach is tightening up, but he was not bad.

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Funny thing is just last year he was getting the Flip Saunders treatment because his star players weren't showing up in the playoffs. Funny how things can go a different direction depending on how the players perform. Well, that and one organization that cherishes stability vs. one that loves fan appeasing changes.

I just checked three pages of threads during and just after the Wings were eliminated last year, and I didn't see a single post giving Babcock the "Flip Saunders" treatment.

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Funny thing is just last year he was getting the Flip Saunders treatment because his star players weren't showing up in the playoffs. Funny how things can go a different direction depending on how the players perform. Well, that and one organization that cherishes stability vs. one that loves fan appeasing changes.

Sports at this level is a results oriented business, especially when you're coaching for a franchise that's been as successful as the Wings. The Wings organization judge a coach's success by how well his team performs in the playoffs.

That said, I think the "Flip treatment" mostly came three years ago when the Wings went out in the first round, and a couple players elected not to sign with the Wings in the off-season because they didn't like his style (e.g. Shanny/Gerber).

Had the Wings gone out early again last year, there's a good chance Babcock wouldn't be around right now.

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You guys are right, I think it was 06 he was getting the Flip Saunders treatment.

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Not wanting to belabor this, as its now irrelevant, but I have to respond since you brought it up again.

Slant it all you want Sagnam, but that's not what happened, as you say "Ozzie deflects the puck towards the corner with 2 seconds to go. Just didn't happen that way.

The reason I made the comment in the first place was just to point out how Freaking close the last second or two actually were. Ozzie didn't stop the backhand, instead dropped the puck and it rolled dangerously close to the corner of the net, allowing another desperate "whack" at it, By Hossa I think it was, probably the Pens most dangerous player; Then, after the that last tap, the puck traveling across the goal mouth BEHIND Ozzie with enough time left, that had it bounced ever so closely the other way, could easily have been in the net. That's the reality of it.

But go ahead and debate it if you want. That's what happened.

Erroneous! Erroneous! Erroneous on both counts!

#1 Osgood made a great stick save on Roberts in the 2nd period that saved a goal and, in essense, saved overtime. Osgood had a better game than Fleury, and is a solid goalie. The fact he didn't handle a puck cleanly that led to nothing is not that significant, IMO, even if it did freak people out.

#2 Even had Hossa directed the puck toward the net, CBC clearly showed the clock was at 0.0 before the puck even got to the goal mouth. The game was over right as the puck left Hossa's stick.

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OK, they showed a slow motion replay from above the net with the clock embedded that showed time run out before the puck started traveling across the crease. So no, the game was over when he got his stick down protecting the post.
#2 Even had Hossa directed the puck toward the net, CBC clearly showed the clock was at 0.0 before the puck even got to the goal mouth. The game was over right as the puck left Hossa's stick.

I hope a picture only is OK in the Red Wings forum. :pirate:

times_up.JPG

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Did you guys go out and get your newspapers this morning? I got the Macomb Daily and the Detroit News...need to procure Oakland and the Times.

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Soft goal. I really didn't want to see Malkin get going. ugh...
Ozzie has to stop that shot!

No offense, but you are both off your rockers.:wink:

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Well ...... that photo disputes (majorly) what was being said last night about the final 2 seconds of the game. Both CBC and WDFN post game commentary were claiming time, .8 seconds, remained on the clock as the puck was dibbling through the crease, perilously close to the goal line, BEHIND Ozzie, as it made its way to the corner. I even distinctly recall Woods stating that the last shot by the PENS, had it not dribbled across the crease like it did, but instead veered across the goal line would have been a GOAL, as time remained on the clock.

Further, Ozzie failed to cleanly make the initial stop on the backhand setting up a last ditch scoring attempt by Hossa with time remaining on the clock.

Lastly, I'll say it again. In my mind's eye, Ozzie failed to make the stop, a stop on the backhand in the closing seconds of the game, and in doing so put the game's outcome in jeopardy.

If you're arguing a case, based on "NEW" information released after the game, so be it. But, that was not was was being stated last night in post game reports.

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they showed that angle on both CBC and NBC right after. I gues the reporters weren't watching but were down near the ice getting ready to "report".

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Erroneous! Erroneous! Erroneous on both counts!

#1 Osgood made a great stick save on Roberts in the 2nd period that saved a goal and, in essense, saved overtime. Osgood had a better game than Fleury, and is a solid goalie. The fact he didn't handle a puck cleanly that led to nothing is not that significant, IMO, even if it did freak people out.

#2 Even had Hossa directed the puck toward the net, CBC clearly showed the clock was at 0.0 before the puck even got to the goal mouth. The game was over right as the puck left Hossa's stick.

Not erroneous unless you're making your case in the proverbial "Monday morning quarterback or back seat driver" sense.

Not erroneous because, in my mind's eye, I clearly see Ozzie bobbling the Hossa backhand with time remaining, setting up yet another scoring chance, perilously close to the goal line, with time remaining.

And lastly, I hope I never hear anymore said about Ozgood being HOF material. He still has a long way to go in my opinion.

As for your comments that Osgood clearly outplayed Fluery and was the "better" goalie, I'll dispute that too. He wasn't. Its that simple. Osgood started the series with a couple of shut-outs, but after that it was even Steven, IMO.

Osgood is an average goalie with a really great team in front of him. If he was playing for St. Louis or the Islanders, He wouldn't get a second, third or fourth notice in any Goalie Greatness argument.

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If you're arguing a case, based on "NEW" information released after the game, so be it. But, that was not was was being stated last night in post game reports.

This video was broadcast last night, just moments after the game ended.

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Osgood clearly outplayed Fleury in games 1, 2, 4 and 6. Fleury clearly outplayed Osgood in game 5. Game 3 was even. Fleury should have stopped the winning goal in game 4 and the 2nd and 3rd goals in Game 6. Osgood should have stopped the tying goal in Game 5. Osgood was playing Fleury even in Game 5 until the final minute of regulation, he made numerous stops like the one on Crosby to keep the Wings in it at 2-0 when the Pens threatened to run them out of the rink. I can think of a few shots off the top of my head this series that I think Hasek v.2008 would have let in. Osgood outplayed every goalie he faced this post-season with the possible exception of Dan Ellis.

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Time had clearly expired by the time Hossa had his whack at it. I thought it was clear from the video replays almost immediately, I remember seeing it broken down before the Conn Smythe presentation. The bigger danger was not Hossa but if Osgood had knocked it in with his own stick after the puck fell to the ice - the puck could have had a chance of getting in that way before the buzzer by a split, split-second.

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Does anyone have video from the on ice celebrations?

In

, the end of the game and replays of the final seconds starts just before the 5:30 mark, the Cup comes out around the 9:30 mark.

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Time had clearly expired by the time Hossa had his whack at it. I thought it was clear from the video replays almost immediately, I remember seeing it broken down before the Conn Smythe presentation. The bigger danger was not Hossa but if Osgood had knocked it in with his own stick after the puck fell to the ice - the puck could have had a chance of getting in that way before the buzzer by a split, split-second.

Didn't see the video replays immediately following the game with time remaining stills. So I didn't have the benefit of that, when SAGNAM decided this morning, well after my comment last night, to highlight my comment about Ozgood bobbling the final shot by Hossa in the closing 1 or 2 seconds. I had basically gotten over my initial reaction since the DRW were victorious, until Sagnam dredged it up, implying that Ozzie had somehow "Cleared" the puck into the corner, preventing a goal, or that the game outcome was never in question, etc. etc. What I take offense to are the ones who will take a comment made in the heat of the moment and seemingly want to make "hay" out of it. There's no need to to that. Post game reports I was following, immediately following the game, were that Ozzies mishandling the puck on the last shot, perilously left the outcome in question ...... And maybe that's what hockey is all about, but as a spectator ---- and a hard core Red Wing fan --- I call them as I see them. Sorry, if you and a few others on this site, don't see it that same way, or refuse to see it that way. But, with that said, I'll give the DRW immense Kudos and respect for a great year, ending in the ultimate triumph, even give Osgood the credit for his part in it. However, as to my beliefs and perceptions about how he stacks up as a Goalie, or his performance in this series, not being up to the level, you assert, I'm going to have say ----- Lets agree to disagree. Now lets enjoy the celebration!

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Sorry, if you and a few others on this site, don't see it that same way, or refuse to see it that way. But, with that said, I'll give the DRW immense Kudos and respect for a great year, ending in the ultimate triumph, even give Osgood the credit for his part in it. However, as to my beliefs and perceptions about how he stacks up as a Goalie, or his performance in this series, not being up to the level, you assert, I'm going to have say ----- Lets agree to disagree. Now lets enjoy the celebration!

No need to be sorry. Like you said, we can respectfully disagree, nothing wrong with that. Bottom line ... Wings Win!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Video of celebrations from

last night. The fans watching JoeVision start counting down the final 10 seconds around the 0:25 mark of this clip.

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Not erroneous unless you're making your case in the proverbial "Monday morning quarterback or back seat driver" sense.

Not erroneous because, in my mind's eye, I clearly see Ozzie bobbling the Hossa backhand with time remaining, setting up yet another scoring chance, perilously close to the goal line, with time remaining.

And lastly, I hope I never hear anymore said about Ozgood being HOF material. He still has a long way to go in my opinion.

As for your comments that Osgood clearly outplayed Fluery and was the "better" goalie, I'll dispute that too. He wasn't. Its that simple. Osgood started the series with a couple of shut-outs, but after that it was even Steven, IMO.

Osgood is an average goalie with a really great team in front of him. If he was playing for St. Louis or the Islanders, He wouldn't get a second, third or fourth notice in any Goalie Greatness argument.

Who shot who in the what now????

A. Ozzie bobbled the chance and it squirted to the side of the net. Time expired as Hossa was striking the puck. It was shown on CBC immediately after the fact, and the clock clearly read 0.0 before the puck even reached the mouth of the net - regardless of what any reporter claimed. That isn't being a Monday morning quarterback - that is just stating facts.

B. I agree with Ozzie not being a HOF goalie. Please check that thread - I think you will see I argued against his candidacy as strongly as anyone.

C. I never claimed Osgood was or is better than Fleury. I claimed Osgood had a better game 6 than Fluery - that is all. I don't think this is a debatable point, really. Fluery allowed 2 unbelievably soft goals. They were absolute gifts. If Fluery were a Wings goalie I suspect people on this board would be advocating nothing short of firing him immediately, based on last night's performance.

D. Osgood is a good goalie on a great team, IMO. He makes solid plays and is rarely spectacular. The Wings could do (and have done) far worse than he. The Wings won this cup, in part, because Osgood provided solid goaltending throughout the play-offs. Let us not throw the baby out with the bathwater.

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The thrill of victory, the agony of defeat. Here is an 8-minute video of the Wings losing the Cup in the 6th and final game of the 1961 finals

to Chicago. And here is a shorter video of the Wings winning the Cup in game 7 of the 1950 finals at the Olympia in 2OT vs the Rangers.

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Didn't see the video replays immediately following the game with time remaining stills. So I didn't have the benefit of that, when SAGNAM decided this morning, well after my comment last night, to highlight my comment about Ozgood bobbling the final shot by Hossa in the closing 1 or 2 seconds. I had basically gotten over my initial reaction since the DRW were victorious, until Sagnam dredged it up, implying that Ozzie had somehow "Cleared" the puck into the corner, preventing a goal, or that the game outcome was never in question, etc. etc. What I take offense to are the ones who will take a comment made in the heat of the moment and seemingly want to make "hay" out of it. There's no need to to that. Post game reports I was following, immediately following the game, were that Ozzies mishandling the puck on the last shot, perilously left the outcome in question ...... And maybe that's what hockey is all about, but as a spectator ---- and a hard core Red Wing fan --- I call them as I see them. Sorry, if you and a few others on this site, don't see it that same way, or refuse to see it that way. But, with that said, I'll give the DRW immense Kudos and respect for a great year, ending in the ultimate triumph, even give Osgood the credit for his part in it. However, as to my beliefs and perceptions about how he stacks up as a Goalie, or his performance in this series, not being up to the level, you assert, I'm going to have say ----- Lets agree to disagree. Now lets enjoy the celebration!

Sagnam wasn't honestly claiming that Osgood cleared the puck to the corner, he was simply trying to illustrate that one's perspective on how the final seconds played out can drastically influence how one describes it.

Sagnam did that, I suspect, because he thought you were being overly critical of Osgood and had you oversold the significance that play in your 'Why Osgood is not very good' argument (please correct me if I read that wrong, Sagnam).

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Osgood clearly outplayed Fleury in games 1, 2, 4 and 6. Fleury clearly outplayed Osgood in game 5. Game 3 was even. Fleury should have stopped the winning goal in game 4 and the 2nd and 3rd goals in Game 6. Osgood should have stopped the tying goal in Game 5. Osgood was playing Fleury even in Game 5 until the final minute of regulation, he made numerous stops like the one on Crosby to keep the Wings in it at 2-0 when the Pens threatened to run them out of the rink. I can think of a few shots off the top of my head this series that I think Hasek v.2008 would have let in. Osgood outplayed every goalie he faced this post-season with the possible exception of Dan Ellis.

I agree with this assessment.

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Surprised to see this arguing the day after the Wings won the cup. I'll throw in my 2 cents....I don't think the Wings win it without Osgood (i.e. with Hasek). I think Osgood was slightly better than Dom 2007 and put on the best performance by a Wings goalie since Dom in 2002. And he's a lot better goalie than he was his first time around with the Wings.

As for the final play, the initial save was not exactly easy, Crosby got a quick hard shot off, and the rebound was definitely late, I could see that much live, since my eyes were basically fixed on the clock while i threw mind daggers at it to make it tick faster.

(Although I don't know what the debate is with that....if it was a bad rebound the clock saving him doesn't make it a good rebound, and the fact the puck did not go in at all means he did enough to make the save, independent of the clock.)

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