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7-31-07: TRADE DEADLINE

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If we want to get Barmes as a possible backup middle infielder of the future thing, then thats fine...but I'm not convinced that we dont have ample options within our own organization right now. Henry Mateo probably isnt significantly worse than Barmes or Wilson.

Hollimon anyone?

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I'm more curious to see who will be the first poster to let off some huge rant because the Tigers didn't trade away a bunch of prospects for a middle reliever. You know it's gonna happen.

Mine is already typed out, I'll just need to come on here and paste it at 4. It's a good read -- once I'm done complaining about that, I go on to discuss how the Smoltz trade was a horrible move, and if Cameron Maybin is so good, why hasn't he been called up?

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Are we really in on Wilson in some part because Leyland covets him from his scouting days as the article suggests, and presumably his Pittsburgh connection as well? If so, ugh. Shades of the Neifi trade.

I don't pretend to know the inner workings of the Tigers front office, but any player that's been connected to Leyland (minus Sheffield who also has a history with Dom) has been less than enthralling. We know Leyland is a loyal guy, often to a fault (see Grilli, Jason and Monroe, Craig), but honoring his fondness for players outside the organization is just going too far.

Leyland is a good manager. On the other hand I do not want him having any input on how the team is constructed.

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Hollimon anyone?

I agree.

And wonder why his name doesn't even come up as a consideration. Even as a backup... to start out. Isn't he a pretty good fielder? Decent range? Or is he limited in the field? I know he's played some SS in the Org... but is he a much better 2nd baseman than a SS?

Just interested in why he's not even a backup consideration...

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Hollimon anyone?

That would work for me, but this whole thing reeks of that "we need a veteran player who has a proven track record of sucking and bouncing around from team" mindset that got us Neifi.

What's Ramon Martinez up to these days?

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A short-term backup solution, that would be Wilson. Barmes would be more of a long-term solution, IMHO.

Wilson is under contract for 2 1/3 seasons, and that's not short-term in my book. Short-term would be realizing that we're already paying Neifi $2.5M this season and simply welcoming him back on August 3rd.... And I never thought I'd say this, but if the option is between Wilson and Neifi, give me Neifi... gladly. Even if Pittsburgh pays half of Wilson's contract, we can probably get Neifi to re-sign for 2008 for around $1.5M to $2M, so we'd save $1M-$2M in 2008 alone over Wilson (assuming PIT pays half of the contract). And I think Neifi will sign a 1 year deal, so we can keep revisiting this option year after year.

Or even just keep Santiago, as presumably he'll be healthy next year, and he's likely a cheaper option than Neifi and Wilson... and just as good defensively.

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I agree.

And wonder why his name doesn't even come up as a consideration. Even as a backup... to start out. Isn't he a pretty good fielder? Decent range? Or is he limited in the field? I know he's played some SS in the Org... but is he a much better 2nd baseman than a SS?

Just interested in why he's not even a backup consideration...

Well, he ought to be at Toledo already, trying to make the next step towards just such a role, and yet he's still sequestered at Jerry Uht. It's hard to get a read on how the org views him, unfortunately.

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Just interested in why he's not even a backup consideration...

Just because the lazy media doesn't do it's homework and recognize that we have other infielders not named Tony G. does not mean that the organization doesn't consider him. They do like the guy, which is why he was pushed to Erie this year.

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http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/

Tigers Could Acquire Jack Wilson

UPDATE: An insider tells me Wilson has indeed just been traded, though he could not confirm the recipient or any details yet.

uhhh-ohhh. if true, i hope this wasn't us.

And if it was us, I find it hard to believe that the organization will shift Guillen to 1B when he just signed an extension at below market dollars to stay here... and his extension hasn't even started yet.

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Well, he ought to be at Toledo already, trying to make the next step towards just such a role, and yet he's still sequestered at Jerry Uht. It's hard to get a read on how the org views him, unfortunately.

I guess on that note...

That we could still look at Barmes or Jack Wilson as a temporary, 1 or 2 year short-term solution.

It does not exclude Hollimon from learning for another year, then becoming a backup, and then replacing either Polanco or the SS, whoever that may be, in '09/'10...

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Well this would be wonderful, I've always thought what we needed to do was sign Neifi Perez through the 2009 season, pay him millions of dollars, and make him a starter.

Wait, by "I've always thought" I meant "in my deepest nightmares"

If any of these rumors are pretty true it's infuriating, Infante is better than Wilson and Barmes and we don't have to give up anything (or take on a massive salary) to have him

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I remember during spring training when Jack Wilson told his teammate Jose Castillo to stay home in Venezuela. He was probably afraid of Castillo taking his spot in the lineup.

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Just in case anyone doesn't realize exactly how horrible Jack Wilson is, playing in the NL Central his last 3 years have looked like this

.257 .299 .363

273 .316 .370

.249 .301 .340

For Comparison, here's Neifi Perez

.255 .296 .336

.274 .298 .383

.243 .260 .316

And Omar Infante

.222 .254 .367

.277 .325 .415

.254 .285 .333

I actually didn't realize Infante had been that bad, but he's done that as a bench player while Wilson has been a regular starter, combine that with the fact Infante takes nothing to acquire and has a minuscule salary while we'd have to trade for Wilson and he has a huge salary through 2009, and this would be far, far worse than the Neifi Perez trade.

I actually feel sick just thinking about it.

Edit: And I guess for full discussion here's Clint Barmes two seasons with any number of at bats

.289 .330 .434

.220 .264 .335

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If the trade is Wilson and Torres for Monroe and Grilli/Miner/Durbin, I would do it. But only if the plan is keep Wilson as the backup next year. He should not be starting on a championship level club.

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I think Wilson is an upgrade over Infante. Infante just isn't very good. I'd rather have Santiago than Infante.

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The only pitcher on our roster I'd take Chacon over is Grilli....and its not by that much

Chacon would be our best pitcher in that bullpen not including Zumaya.

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I'd just like to point out that Neifi is eligible to be added back to the roster sometime within the next week. To me, that would simply make acquiring another back-up IF a moot point.

I guess the only reasons you'd do it is if they package a COUPLE good relievers with Wilson and PIT pickups up a good chunk of their salary. Even then, their relievers aren't good enough that I'd consider this, but really it's the only way that I can envision this happening. Although, Capps would be interesting, but can't imagine that they're willing to deal him.

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Chacon has been so inconsistent the past few years - I'm wary of him. Torres would be a good veteran middle guy, who can close in a pinch.

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Jack Wilson is terrible, Shawn Chacon is terrible, the fact we're even discussing them as options for a world series contending team horrifies me

Shawn Chacon is basically Jason Grilli, he was mind boggling horrible last year, and this year he has a 3.72 era and 1.45 WHIP as a relief pitcher, there is a reason noone in mlb has had any interest in trading for him with the Pirates offering him around

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