Jump to content

thewave84

Why is this Lions' board so negative?

Recommended Posts

This board is really tough. You can't say anything positive about the Lions around here without 10 people piling on with negative comments.

"The Lions stink and always will, so don't suggest anything different".

I realize that the Lions do stink and have stunk for a long time, but why is it so horrible to suggest that they might get better?

Even in the darkest days for the Tigers (2002 and 2003), the motowntigers board did not have this sense of hopelessness (and ridicule for anyone who actually did have hope).

It's really sad.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A 4-12 average record over the last six years, with no indication that the person responsible for that garbage will be gone anytime soon. At least that's where my apathy is derived. If there was hope that he would get fired, I'm sure the tone would be different. After six years of getting hopes up only to get kicked in the jimmies, it's not worth getting hopes up anymore.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree Wave. Why even attempt to post anything if it's going to be shoved into your face the obvious fact that this team sucks right now. There's some pluses. Most people love to be negative instead.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the difference with the Lions is that their ownership shows no desire to improve the team and hold certain Matt Millen's responsible even when he's clearly been a failure.

In 2002-2003 Illitch & DD were in the middle of reshaping the front office and the rest of the team. I don't remember too many Tiger optimists from those days, but at least there were some indications that the owner cared.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree. I can understand not having a positive outlook on this season, but I didn't expect it to be this bad, especially given the supposedly spectacular offense we should have.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Since I was born

227-303

7 winning seasons

1 playoff win

Under Millen:

24-72

Let that sink in for a second.

I have gotten excited the almost every season since 1989. No more. Show me on the field and I will join in the celebration.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

letsgoblu - couldn't you say the same thing about the Tigers during their 10+ years of not having a winning season?

sparks - I think WCF wants to win as much as anybody. He spends his money, pays big bonuses & pays the front office and coaches very well. Much better than some owners. Just because he has made bad choices at GM doesn't mean that he doesn't want to win.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
letsgoblu - couldn't you say the same thing about the Tigers during their 10+ years of not having a winning season?

.

Yep. And that may have been why there were 11,000 people showing up to games. It's not like everyone was praising the genius of Randy Smith all those years.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We are negative because every year we hear "This is it! This is the year we turn it around! We have X player(s) and Y coach and Z system! This is it!"

Only then to turn around and live through another X-1X season.

Until the results happen on the field, I, and many others, just arent going to get emotionally invested anymore. The Lions and WCF have forced us to react this way.

I hope against hope that the Lions will go to the playoffs, nay GO .500. Its just not realistic to expect it, or be optimistic about it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
letsgoblu - couldn't you say the same thing about the Tigers during their 10+ years of not having a winning season?

sparks - I think WCF wants to win as much as anybody. He spends his money, pays big bonuses & pays the front office and coaches very well. Much better than some owners. Just because he has made bad choices at GM doesn't mean that he doesn't want to win.

The Tigers went through 3 GM's during that time frame though. You could at least hope the new direction would bring competent management and a fresh start. As long as Millen is employed by the Lions it is very difficult for me to see them improving. Hell, there isn't even any evidence that Millen's job is in jeopardy at this point.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why negative?

The Lions are tragically bad, the worst stretch in their history, and one of the worst stretches of any NFL team ever.

The Lions are run by an inept GM, who embarrasses the organization routinely when he speaks.

The Lions are a the laughing stock of the league, this isn't baseball/basketball/hockey, this is the NFL where parity is almost legislated by the league.

William Clay Ford one of the worst owners in professional sports, who either doesn't care about the team, doesn't care about the fans, or doesn't know that he's a terrible owner.

We are all jaded, you can only hear so many times how much the team will be improved, how finally the right staff is in place, etc. etc.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If there were things to be positive about - believe me I'd be positive. But at almost every turn the team has done what I didn't want it to do and then it backfired in their face.

Are we negative. Yes. But that negativity is due to what actually happens and their actual moves. Trying to find anything to be positive about really takes a lot of searching and when you do that it means you have hit the "cornbread" world. Just the fact the Lions have words like "Cornbread" and "Koolaid" connected to them for a term shows how putrid the organization has been.

I don't go out to be negative. I just post what I think and what I see. Unfortunately for a very long time almost all of that has been negative garbage. That's the reason why I have stopped posting here. It's the reason why for years I slowed down on posting in the Tigers' forum. If you can't say something positive, at least limit the posts. And I've clearly done that. I used to be all over this folder.

The thing about the Lions is they've taken it to a new level. When I post that I can do better. I'm not trying to be witty or funny or even negative really. I'm saying what I honestly believe is true. That's pathetic and terrible - I know. But I know I could've done no worse and I am absolutely ill-prepared for that job. And that's another reason why it's hard to take talk about this organization seriously. I honestly don't believe they know what they are doing to a great extent thus they really are "below" legitimate conversation about their strategies and philosphies. As bad as that sounds I truly believe that. And that's why I really find it tough to make positive posts about them or my opinions are at such a pathetically low level - actually below comprehension. They are there because that's where I think they actually exist.

Sorry to answer your question with such a negative post, but this is truly the answer to your question and what I really believe to be true.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Dr. Who,

I won't even say we are jaded. I think talking about how pathetically inept they are has nothing to do with us being jaded. It truly is speaking what seemingly is the truth. I think most are beyond the jaded viewpoint and we have advanced in our step towards apathy or acceptance.

The Wave,

Again this isn't a joke post. This is supposed to be a serious comment. This is truly where this organization is.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The Tigers went through 3 GM's during that time frame though. You could at least hope the new direction would bring competent management and a fresh start. As long as Millen is employed by the Lions it is very difficult for me to see them improving. Hell, there isn't even any evidence that Millen's job is in jeopardy at this point.

I always had the feeling that Iillitch at least cared and was trying, he just made mistakes, plus he had a track record of success in Detroit rebuilding the Red Wings, and he is a self made man. I don't get that feeling with WCF, he's never really succeeded in anything, he's had the Lions for 40+ years, a perrenial champion until he purchased them, with his family money.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Even in the darkest days for the Tigers (2002 and 2003), the motowntigers board did not have this sense of hopelessness (and ridicule for anyone who actually did have hope).

It's really sad.

The Lions are really sad.

You've brought up the tigers comparison before and been given the same answer you got on this thread. There was no reason to expect hope for the Tigers as long as Randy Smith was still the GM. Mike Illitch, while starting off very poorly with the Tigers, had a history of winning and spending to win with the Red Wings. He had a track record of success. So when he hired Dombrowski who was regarded as one of the top GMs in the league who also had a track record of success, there was reason to be excited for the future, regardless of the depths of despair of 2002 and 2003.

As for the Lions, there is no track record for success for their ownership. In fact, there is only a track record of complete and utter failure lopped in with an occasional lucky bounce (Barry Sanders). The ownership has never shown the ability to put people in charge who will make it successful, as shown by the fact that 1) they don't win and 2) no Lions coach (under the Fords) has ever had an NFL head coaching job after being fired by the Lions. They don't choose their employees wisely and its the biggest reason the Lions are the worst organization in professional football.

And not only does the entire Lions organization have a history of futility, the current general manager has the BIGGEST history of futility of anyone in the history of modern professional football. And he gets rewarded for that failure with contract extensions. And yet, you want us to get excited about a team that's led by this man? Why?

The situations between the Tigers in 2002 and the Lions in 2007 are only similar on the surface. If you look a little deeper into WHY they are/were horrible organizations, you'll see the big difference between the two (ownership/leadership) and realize why the analogy is flawed and inapplicable.

I want the Lions to win. But I've been watching them for over 30 years, reading about them for over 30 years, and getting frustrated by them for over 30 years. They need to show me something on the field before I actually think they'll be any good.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ok, so Millen is an idiot and will never succeed, and WCF is loyal to a fault and must not care because he is willing to continue to let an idiot be a GM.

What about past NFL teams that took a long time to succeed? I'm not sure about my facts, but I think Tom Landry with the Cowboys had like 20 years of losing before turning things around and winning a super bowl. Also (Art Rooney/Chuck Noll?) the Steelers had many years of losing before turning the team into a dominant one.

I guess I refuse to believe that no Lions' team has a chance to succeed as long as Millen is GM. Or that any draft pick could possibly pan out, or any current player that the Lions have could be good, all because of Millen's GM influence.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Landry and Noll/Rooney NEVER had a stretch of pathetic seasons like Millen has had. And Millen has managed to do so in an era where winning in the NFL is easier than in the 60's and 70's. And I'm sure if there was a Dallas Cowboys message board around in those bad seasons, their fans would have thought the same way we do.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would put mine in the apathy category as well. I like Rod and some of the players on the team, I just haven't seen anything on the field yet that makes me a believer.

The Lions are the only one of my teams that when I sit down on the couch, winning is a hope and not an expectation. Many times I'm not even mad when they lose because I'm already looking forward to the draft.

I really want that to change. I live in Packer country and am sick of being ridiculed, but I love the Lions too much to turn my back on them now.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What about past NFL teams that took a long time to succeed? I'm not sure about my facts, but I think Tom Landry with the Cowboys had like 20 years of losing before turning things around and winning a super bowl. Also (Art Rooney/Chuck Noll?) the Steelers had many years of losing before turning the team into a dominant one.

It might help if you looked up those facts.

Landry became the first Cowboys coach in 1960. 6 years after inception they were in the playoffs.

Chuck Knoll became the Steelers coach in 1969 and they were in the playoffs in 72.

Now what were you saying?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Landry and Noll/Rooney NEVER had a stretch of pathetic seasons like Millen has had. And Millen has managed to do so in an era where winning in the NFL is easier than in the 60's and 70's.

Quoted for truth.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
It might help if you looked up those facts.

Landry became the first Cowboys coach in 1960. 6 years after inception they were in the playoffs.

Chuck Knoll became the Steelers coach in 1969 and they were in the playoffs in 72.

Now what were you saying?

Ok, and Millen has had 6 years with the Lions. Why is it impossible that the team might be good this year?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
This board is really tough. You can't say anything positive about the Lions around here without 10 people piling on with negative comments.

"The Lions stink and always will, so don't suggest anything different".

I realize that the Lions do stink and have stunk for a long time, but why is it so horrible to suggest that they might get better?

Even in the darkest days for the Tigers (2002 and 2003), the motowntigers board did not have this sense of hopelessness (and ridicule for anyone who actually did have hope).

It's really sad.

There are guys who like cornbread, guys who don't, and guys who want to pour salt on the whole batch so nobody can eat it. I don't see many of that last category of guys on this board.

I know there are some posters who maybe roll their eyes a little bit when they see other Lions fans showing optimism, and I there are probably a few who are so frustrated with the dismal history of the franchise that they don't even want to spend the time speculating. Both understandable.

But you've started a few threads that have prompted a good amount of intelligent discussion, which is saying something given that the Lions are in their off-season and most of our attention on this board has been on Detroit's quest to become championship city in 2007. :cool:

But even though mini-camp has been going on, there's no way to tell what anything that's happened there means. If the offense looks good, is it because the defense is bad? Can't say. I do like that Marinelli keeps saying how fast and "explosive" the team looks, because I don't get the impression he's the kind of guy who would say something he doesn't think is true. But lots of teams are fast, so we'll have to wait and see. And I do like the new talent and depth on the OL, but it will take time for them to mesh.

So for a team that has been historically awful, I'd say the board is probably right where it ought to be. And if the Lions go 4-1 before their Week 6 bye, you can bump the Lions Breakout Year thread you started and I'm sure all the skeptics who posted there will gladly eat their crow with huge helpings of cornbread and Kool-Aid.:happy:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

TheWave,

No it is possible. However, you need to see concrete proof (or even imaginary proof) that this is possible. Some see it in the draft. So far this season they haven't done much to wow me.

Let's hope I have reason to praise Millen sometime in late October. That would be very nice for a change.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Forum Statistics

    • Total Topics
      96,729
    • Total Posts
      2,932,966
  • Who's Online (See full list)

  • Upcoming Events

    No upcoming events found
×
×
  • Create New...