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dreg2003

"In Detroit, it was horrible for me. A nightmare." - Darko Millicic

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Besides, the draft pick is going to be #30, not #20. They have Darko there, which means the string of championships is about to begin.

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Besides, the draft pick is going to be #30, not #20. They have Darko there, which means the string of championships is about to begin.

That one actually made me laugh out loud.

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I have been watching Magic games regularly since Darko was shipped to the Magic kingdom, so here is my $.02

+His passing instincts are above average, but sometimes when feeding the low post he does not put enough zip on the ball. Last night he was trying to feed Dwight Howard -- and David Harrison easily intercepted the pass because Darko was lazy with it.

+Darko sometimes sets picks for teammates in odd situations. In these situations he is just dragging an extra defender toward a teammate who is looking for a shot or thinking about penetrating. His pick-and-roll execution needs a lot of refinement. I agree with Chad Ford that Darko would benefit immensely from the summer league.

+His shooting touch is awesome. 20 foot jumpers seem to be no problem.

+Has good hands when rebounding.

+Leaves his feet too often when the shooter gives a pump fake. He will become an even better shot blocker (and stay out of foul trouble) once he learns to keep his feet until he is sure a shot is going up.

+Darko runs the court gracefully and has much better speed than Nowitzki. With Nelson, Howard and Milicic this will be a fun team to watch next year.

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Besides, the draft pick is going to be #30, not #20. They have Darko there, which means the string of championships is about to begin.

ahhhh, one of the best statements I have read in this thread!! Definitely LOL.

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We're getting the 20th pick in 2008? When did I miss the 2006 Finals, 2006 Draft Lottery, 2007 Regular Season, and 2007 Finals, and 2007 Draft Lottery?

Darko was traded for probably something similar to the 20th pick in 2008. I'm not sure where you are coming up with the 2006 finals/draft, 2007 Regular Season/Finals. Darko was traded for a possible 2007 draft pick if it's out of the top 5, or an unprotected 08 pick.

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Darko was traded for probably something similar to the 20th pick in 2008. I'm not sure where you are coming up with the 2006 finals/draft, 2007 Regular Season/Finals. Darko was traded for a possible 2007 draft pick if it's out of the top 5, or an unprotected 08 pick.

Because I'm hardly inclined to argue with anyone using their obviously bias prognostications regarding the Orlando Magic as the starting point. Perhaps you are, but I see all of those events listed as impacting which pick Detroit gets, not to mention the fact that all of them are pretty much unpredictable, unless you are DaBishopstradamus, of course.

The only thing that is a known entity is that it won't be Top 5 in 2006.

In other words, why don't we argue wether the #6 pick in the 2006 draft will contribute 8 pts and 5 blocks in 24 minutes. How about the #7 pick? Wait, I bet the #9 pick... no way, #2 in 2008.... no, I mean, #16 in 2008... you get the point.

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...The only thing that is a known entity is that it won't be Top 5 in 2006...In other words, why don't we argue wether the #6 pick in the 2006 draft will contribute 8 pts and 5 blocks in 24 minutes. How about the #7 pick? Wait, I bet the #9 pick... no way, #2 in 2008.... no, I mean, #16 in 2008... you get the point.

You're off a bit there. If you don't mind... the corrections:

The known entity is that it won't be ANY pick in 2006. Repeat: we do NOT get their 2006 pick under ANY circumstances, it was NOT part of the deal.

The other known entity is that it won't be Top 5 in 2007. This is our best chance at a good pick, if we believe the Magic will improve each year, as long as it is not in the top 5. If they end up in the lottery, with pick #6 or lower, great. If not...

We get their 2008 1st rounder, no matter what.

But... I highly doubt the 2008 pick is better than the 2007 pick, and I do firmly believe that it may not be in the lottery, and if so, barely. Trying to play Nostradamus here... I'm guessing between 10 and 20.

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You're off a bit there. If you don't mind... the corrections:

The known entity is that it won't be ANY pick in 2006. Repeat: we do NOT get their 2006 pick under ANY circumstances, it was NOT part of the deal.

The other known entity is that it won't be Top 5 in 2007. This is our best chance at a good pick, if we believe the Magic will improve each year, as long as it is not in the top 5. If they end up in the lottery, with pick #6 or lower, great. If not...

We get their 2008 1st rounder, no matter what.

But... I highly doubt the 2008 pick is better than the 2007 pick, and I do firmly believe that it may not be in the lottery, and if so, barely. Trying to play Nostradamus here... I'm guessing between 10 and 20.

sorry, my mistake! thanks for correcting. Principle still holds though... its still all based on unknowns, and I don't see a point in debating it, really. Maybe others do, but I don't.

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Because I'm hardly inclined to argue with anyone using their obviously bias prognostications regarding the Orlando Magic as the starting point. Perhaps you are, but I see all of those events listed as impacting which pick Detroit gets, not to mention the fact that all of them are pretty much unpredictable, unless you are DaBishopstradamus, of course.

The only thing that is a known entity is that it won't be Top 5 in 2006.

In other words, why don't we argue wether the #6 pick in the 2006 draft will contribute 8 pts and 5 blocks in 24 minutes. How about the #7 pick? Wait, I bet the #9 pick... no way, #2 in 2008.... no, I mean, #16 in 2008... you get the point.

I was trying to kindly point out, you are in error about the deal. If you are not aware what the deal was, please refrain from correcting others on the details of the deal. Again to clear things up for *you*

The Pistons won't get any draft pick in 2006 from the Orlando Magic, none, no picks in 2006 from Orlando.

The Pistons may get a pick in 2007 from Orlando provided it's not one of the top 5 picks in the draft.

The Pistons will get a pick in 2008 if they did not receive it in 2007 from the Orlando Magic, no matter what position the pick ends up being.

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I was trying to kindly point out, you are in error about the deal. If you are not aware what the deal was, please refrain from correcting others on the details of the deal. Again to clear things up for *you*

Woah tuff guy, ease up a bit... I never corrected anyone about the details of the deal. I made the point that you have no clue what the pick, or who that pick will be. If *you* aren't aware of what I was even saying, then please refrain from correcting me.

And, you're a little too late - someone else already pointed it out to me.

Again, I made a mistake. I already know this. Apparently that wasn't clear to *you*. Here's a link to it: http://www.motownsports.com/forums/showpost.php?p=674762&postcount=258; But hey, dont' let that get in the way of *you* bashing me a bit more. Would *you* like me to clear it up for *you* again? I MADE A MISTAKE. Do *you* now understand? this is not that I was not aware of the deal - I'm very aware of it. I merely made a mistake.

Further, perhaps if *you* read earlier in the thread, *you'd* notice that I'm MORE than aware of what this trade is.

Further, what *you* are saying doesn't even challenge my point, which is that *YOU* HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THE PICK WILL BE, NOR WHO IT WILL BE. THUS, ARGUING WHETHER THIS PHATOM PICK WILL BE AS GOOD AS DARKO IS POINTLESS, IMO. So, basically, *you* can sit here and harp on me about making a mistake, and continue to miss the point if *you* chose. At least *you'll* be able to bash me some more about a mistake I already admitted.

However, until *you* and/or DaBishop prove who the pick will be at least 1.5 years in advance, arguing with *you* about it is pointless. Since *you* can't meet that condition, the result is that arguing with *you* is pointless.

Toodles, thread police.

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um...Phife...take a deep breath. relax...now exhale. I was using what some might call sarcasm when I was talking about the 20th pick. Regardless, Orlando has two 20 year old 7 footers who both are or will be above average to great. They have lottery pick point guard with a solid back-up PG. they have a lottery pick coming up this year. They also will most likely get Grant Hill's money off their books through retirement or the Alan Houston rule and have already moved Francis' money off the books. They are going to have so much money to throw around during FA it's gonna be silly. I actually don't believe we're gonna get their 20th pick in 2008 because I think we're gonna get their pick in 2007 when they make the playoffs and are guaranteed to have no chance to have their pick protected. Now, tell me again, how I'm just making unwarranted predictions that the draft choice we get from Orlando isn't going to be a very high pick.

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Woah tuff guy, ease up a bit... I never corrected anyone about the details of the deal. I made the point that you have no clue what the pick, or who that pick will be. If *you* aren't aware of what I was even saying, then please refrain from correcting me.

And, you're a little too late - someone else already pointed it out to me.

Again, I made a mistake. I already know this. Apparently that wasn't clear to *you*. Here's a link to it: http://www.motownsports.com/forums/showpost.php?p=674762&postcount=258; But hey, dont' let that get in the way of *you* bashing me a bit more. Would *you* like me to clear it up for *you* again? I MADE A MISTAKE. Do *you* now understand? this is not that I was not aware of the deal - I'm very aware of it. I merely made a mistake.

Further, perhaps if *you* read earlier in the thread, *you'd* notice that I'm MORE than aware of what this trade is.

Further, what *you* are saying doesn't even challenge my point, which is that *YOU* HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THE PICK WILL BE, NOR WHO IT WILL BE. THUS, ARGUING WHETHER THIS PHATOM PICK WILL BE AS GOOD AS DARKO IS POINTLESS, IMO. So, basically, *you* can sit here and harp on me about making a mistake, and continue to miss the point if *you* chose. At least *you'll* be able to bash me some more about a mistake I already admitted.

However, until *you* and/or DaBishop prove who the pick will be at least 1.5 years in advance, arguing with *you* about it is pointless. Since *you* can't meet that condition, the result is that arguing with *you* is pointless.

Toodles, thread police.

LLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL!!!!!!!!!

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and I don't see a point in debating it, really. Maybe others do, but I don't.

Then stop.

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Now, tell me again, how I'm just making unwarranted predictions that the draft choice we get from Orlando isn't going to be a very high pick.

Bishop, I like debating with you... I just can't stand it when someone piles on over a stupid admitted mistake, especially when its obvious from day 1 of the trade that I understood what was going on. That's why I'm a little uppity about it.

To your question: Those predictions aren't reality. They are definately well educated predictions, but until it goes down, none of us really know. Thus, its pointless to debate about it, becuase its all a bunch of unknowns. All that has to happen is that Howard gets injured, and the whole thing becomes pointless. There are a plethora of other things that could happen - what I see in your prediction is a perfect scenario with Orlando, which is obviously possible, but highly unlikely. This is, after all, the organization that couldn't win with players much more dominant than either Darko or Howard, who are both really, really young.

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Then stop.

stop what?

I have no problem with debating the trade; I have a problem with debating whether draft pick x, who is player Y, which is dependent on Orlando's record in 2007 (unknown) or 2008 (unknown) is better than Darko. That debate I have avoided.

Surely you know that though. :wink:

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Wow, it's like being at a bar, watching while three girls fight from afar.

No, watching three chicks wrestle around on the floor is hot, this isn't.

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No, watching three chicks wrestle around on the floor is hot, this isn't.

Well - lol - I meant more or less, watching as girls argue, though at least we all know what kind of bars that D'Train likes to patronize.

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stop what?

I have no problem with debating the trade; I have a problem with debating whether draft pick x, who is player Y, which is dependent on Orlando's record in 2007 (unknown) or 2008 (unknown) is better than Darko. That debate I have avoided.

Surely you know that though. :wink:

But you really can't talk the trade unless you talk about what the Pistons supposedly got in return for their #2 pick in the draft. Right?

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Wow, it's like being at a bar, watching while three girls fight from afar.

You're just mad because the hot chicks aren't paying any attention to you...

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To your question: Those predictions aren't reality. They are definately well educated predictions, but until it goes down, none of us really know. Thus, its pointless to debate about it, becuase its all a bunch of unknowns. All that has to happen is that Howard gets injured, and the whole thing becomes pointless. There are a plethora of other things that could happen - what I see in your prediction is a perfect scenario with Orlando, which is obviously possible, but highly unlikely. This is, after all, the organization that couldn't win with players much more dominant than either Darko or Howard, who are both really, really young.

Nothing about those predictions are unlikely. If I'm going to trade you something for a draft pick, I have to evaluate what I believe your draft pick is going to be worth. I can't assume someone's going to get injured or that anything highly speculative either positive or negative will happen. I can and should assume that your good young players will improve with age, I can figure into the equation your cap flexibility to make moves(which in this case wasn't quite as good at the time of the trade but was being discussed already in the press), and I have to use these to figure out what the future draft pick will be worth. Obviously, we either under-valued Darko or were in a situation where he HAD to be moved and Orland had the upper hand. I assume Howard and Darko will continue to improve. I assume Nelson will be a servicable PG, and if not Arroyo, another player I think we under-valued as he's showing to be quite capable in Orlando, can step in. There is no speculation that Orlando will have tons of money to spend and Florida is a very desireable location to play. There is no speculation that Orlando will have a lottery pick this year, most likely in the top 5 but almost certainly in the top 10. They will make additions during free agency, how good, I don't know but I'll assume that they'll improve their teams talent level at the least. All this leads me to believe, that quite likely, Orlando will be an improved team next year, and with the east being weak, should put them in a very good position to make the playoffs. I'm not predicting anything. I'm using logic to deduce that we got the raw end of the deal in this trade.

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Well - lol - I meant more or less, watching as girls argue, though at least we all know what kind of bars that D'Train likes to patronize.

Benke's just mad cuz everyone ignored him throughout this thread.

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Well - lol - I meant more or less, watching as girls argue, though at least we all know what kind of bars that D'Train likes to patronize.

No comment :speech:

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and with the east being weak, should put them in a very good position to make the playoffs.

Which would give the Pistons a mid round pick in a deep draft. What's the problem with that? Darko wasn't helping.

I'm not predicting anything. I'm using logic to deduce that we got the raw end of the deal in this trade.

Yet again, I ask.... you don't know who that person will be, so how do you know he's not better than Darko? Presumbably, you MUST know that this person is going to be worse than Darko in order to believe that we got the raw end of the deal, right? How do you know that that person is worse than Darko, when you don't know who it is, and how good they will be, and how good Darko will be? You don't.

I know I didn't respond to much of your message, because I realize you were telling me why you feel they'll make the playoffs. But, in the end, all of tthat doesn't mean that you know that person is going to be worse than Darko. Yet you know the trade hosed the Pistons. I don't know how you have enough information to know that.

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But you really can't talk the trade unless you talk about what the Pistons supposedly got in return for their #2 pick in the draft. Right?

which was a draft pick and Cato. It wasn't a draft pick that's automatically worse than Darko could ever be, which is what it would have to be for us to know that we got hosed. And, we don't know that. So you can't evaluate it, becuase you dont' know what they really got in return. (not to mention that you don't know how good Darko will be either.)

When you factor that in with the obvious reality that he was devalued in detroit, anything is better than what they had. They don't need him now, so try again with another player when you're in a better position to groom them. What's wrong with that?

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