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Mr.TaterSalad

Next GM/Coach chatter (formerly: Matt Patricia and Bob Quinn fired)

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2 minutes ago, Mr.TaterSalad said:

I don't know what Tua nor Herbert will end up being as NFL QBs. Tua has the talent level to be a top 10 NFL QB I think. Herbert could get there as well, but who knows. I also don't know what Okudah will end up being, even if he's off to a start that showcases him as one of the worst starting corners in the NFL. What I do know though, is that the Lions needed a QB then and still need one now. Tua and Herbert were staring them right in the face and they passed. QB also has a significantly higher positional value than QB, which only matters if you needed one, and I would argue we did.

They could have taken Tua and still kept Stafford around for another year even if they were in a win now edict from management. It isn't like Okudah is contributing to team success at this point anyways. Hindsight is 2020, but I think at this point what should have happened is Sheila should have stepped in and either fired them last off season or demanded they take one of Tua or Herbert.

given their roster needs, i'd rather see them take a wr or a lb if parsons is there this year.

but i could be talked into a qb if they're drafting in the top 5.

 

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41 minutes ago, Mr.TaterSalad said:

I don't know what Tua nor Herbert will end up being as NFL QBs. Tua has the talent level to be a top 10 NFL QB I think. Herbert could get there as well, but who knows. I also don't know what Okudah will end up being, even if he's off to a start that showcases him as one of the worst starting corners in the NFL. What I do know though, is that the Lions needed a QB then and still need one now. Tua and Herbert were staring them right in the face and they passed. QB also has a significantly higher positional value than QB, which only matters if you needed one, and I would argue we did.

They could have taken Tua and still kept Stafford around for another year even if they were in a win now edict from management. It isn't like Okudah is contributing to team success right now anyways. Hindsight is 2020, but I think at this point what should have happened is Sheila should have stepped in and either fired them last off season or demanded they take one of Tua or Herbert.

The Lions didn't need a QB, they did need multiple d-lineman, linebackers, a guard and a corner. If they had taken a QB at 3 they were basically punting on this year which was never going to happen, not with Quinn still there.

You can argue they should have but then they should have fired Quinn before the year.

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QB only if they can get Lawrence or Fields, or only if Stafford is done (with the Lions or overall). I'm not convinced I want the next Carson Wentz.

Yes, I would take the Alabama WR or the Penn State LB.

Okudah will be fine. He's a rookie CB playing for a junk coach in a junk defense.

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23 minutes ago, Jason_R said:

QB only if they can get Lawrence or Fields, or only if Stafford is done (with the Lions or overall). I'm not convinced I want the next Carson Wentz.

Yes, I would take the Alabama WR or the Penn State LB.

Okudah will be fine. He's a rookie CB playing for a junk coach in a junk defense.

I remember when Wentz was the darling of the NFL. It's funny how many QBs come and go and Stafford still chugs along playing at a high level (except for this season). 

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Matty boy has one more season here at most IMO.  I have always liked Stafford, but he is simply not as good as he used to be.  Having a couple kids, having a wife with medical problems...just hang it up and concentrate on your family.  Give the next administration one more year so they can draft your replacement and give him a little time to learn something before throwing him in the fire.

Add the pieces we need with the draft or trade, build on what we have and let's get back to mediocrity for 2022!  We will never be more than that.

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30 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

Speaking of the Eagles, Darius Slay got roasted. Not disappointed to see him gone. 

I did not disagree with Quinn when he traded Slay, but the way it all went down demonstrated that Patricia had utterly lost control.

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1 hour ago, Jason_R said:

QB only if they can get Lawrence or Fields, or only if Stafford is done (with the Lions or overall). I'm not convinced I want the next Carson Wentz.

Yes, I would take the Alabama WR or the Penn State LB.

Okudah will be fine. He's a rookie CB playing for a junk coach in a junk defense.

Trey Lance is better outside the pocket and has more mobility than Wentz, at least that seems to be the case from scouting reports I have read and limited youtube clips/game highlights I have watched. If we're in the top 10 I'd take a chance on drafting Lance. Daniel Jeremiah of NFL Network compared Lance to Andrew Luck FWIW, which isn't really worth anything at this point.

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1 hour ago, Stanley70 said:

The Lions didn't need a QB, they did need multiple d-lineman, linebackers, a guard and a corner. If they had taken a QB at 3 they were basically punting on this year which was never going to happen, not with Quinn still there.

You can argue they should have but then they should have fired Quinn before the year.

How would drafting Tua or Herbert punted the season? What contributions has Okudah made to this team thus far?

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9 minutes ago, Mr.TaterSalad said:

Trey Lance is better outside the pocket and has more mobility than Wentz, at least that seems to be the case from scouting reports I have read and limited youtube clips/game highlights I have watched. If we're in the top 10 I'd take a chance on drafting Lance. Daniel Jeremiah of NFL Network compared Lance to Andrew Luck FWIW, which isn't really worth anything at this point.

The new undrafted QB is always better than the last hyped QB. 

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Just now, Motown Bombers said:

The new undrafted QB is always better than the last hyped QB. 

Yeah, Lance may be a new and improved Wentz, but I never see these scouts say, "Prospect X really struggles with this." Also, I never hear them say, "Prospect Y reminds me a lot of Joey Harrington." Every year the prospects are greater than the last year. 

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I have zero idea if Lance will be better or worse than Wentz, so does everyone else, scouts, coaches, and insiders included. I do know that he is highly touted and scouts/insiders are projecting him to have a legit top 10 talent level and not just because it is a horrific draft class or something similar. I also know that Matt Stafford will be 34 going into next season and is trending downward in-terms of on field play. At some point we have to role the dice on a QB and move on from Stafford. Obviously, Fields and Lawrence would be the ideal choices, but I think Lance deserves to be in that conversation too.

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1 minute ago, Mr.TaterSalad said:

I have zero idea if Lance will be better than Wentz. I do know that he is highly touted and scouts/insiders are projecting him to have a legit top 10 talent level and not just because it is a horrific draft class or something similar. I also know that Matt Stafford will be 34 going into next season and is trending downward in-terms of on field play. At some point we have to role the dice on a QB and move on from Stafford. Obviously, Fields and Lawrence would be the ideal choices, but I think Lance deserves to be in that conversation too.

Stafford will be 33 and you've been wanting to roll the dice for some time. Every QB in each draft is the next thing. 

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2 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

FWIW, Matthew Stafford has a better QB rating, completion %, and INT rate than Luck. Maybe Lance is the new Matthew Stafford?

And Luck has more playoffs wins, winning seasons, and a better overall record against top 15 defenses.

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2 minutes ago, Mr.TaterSalad said:

And Luck has more playoffs wins, winning seasons, and a better overall record against top 15 defenses.

And you believe the sole reason is Andrew Luck? You're saying if Andrew Luck were on the 2011 Lions, they would have beaten the Saints in the playoffs? Despite giving up 45 points, 600 yards of offense, and forcing 0 punts?

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49 minutes ago, Mr.TaterSalad said:

How would drafting Tua or Herbert punted the season? What contributions has Okudah made to this team thus far?

They didn't plan on Okudah being basically sub-replacement level, I'm sure they thought he would be at least average by the end of the year. Whereas taking a QB with Stafford in place would not be helping the 2020 team at all.

 

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3 hours ago, Motor City Sonics said:

3 years.   You can't truly rate draft picks or draft classes for 3 years.  

Normally, but Tua's injuries are going to be too much to overcome, IMO. He also is a smaller guy, with a minus arm. I don't think he has the ability.

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37 minutes ago, Stanley70 said:

They didn't plan on Okudah being basically sub-replacement level, I'm sure they thought he would be at least average by the end of the year. Whereas taking a QB with Stafford in place would not be helping the 2020 team at all.

 

Every player on Patricia’s defense has underperformed. Give the kid a break. 

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4 hours ago, Buddha said:

given their roster needs, i'd rather see them take a wr or a lb if parsons is there this year.

but i could be talked into a qb if they're drafting in the top 5.

 

I'd lose it a little bit if they took a WR in the top 10, a 3rd straight year of drafting a non-premium position in the top 10. Depending on BPA of course, I'm taking either a QB or the top Front 7 player left on the board.

Parsons is my favorite player in the draft outside of Lawrence so I'm taking him without hesitation if he's there (I doubt he drops out of the top 5). If not, I'd address that D-Line or take one of Wilson, Lance or Trask/Jones. 

I'm really interested to see how the defense does now that Patricia is gone. I'm curious to see if it really was a complete lack of talent or if it was at least somewhat due to schematic issues. Guys like Okudah, AO, Walker and Harris have some talent, add in Hand if he ever remains healthy and I wonder if these guys will improve in a different scheme, Davis too. Guys like Tavai are hopeless, a worthless pick.

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10 minutes ago, NYLion said:

I'd lose it a little bit if they took a WR in the top 10, a 3rd straight year of drafting a non-premium position in the top 10. Depending on BPA of course, I'm taking either a QB or the top Front 7 player left on the board.

Parsons is my favorite player in the draft outside of Lawrence so I'm taking him without hesitation if he's there (I doubt he drops out of the top 5). If not, I'd address that D-Line or take one of Wilson, Lance or Trask/Jones. 

I'm really interested to see how the defense does now that Patricia is gone. I'm curious to see if it really was a complete lack of talent or if it was at least somewhat due to schematic issues. Guys like Okudah, AO, Walker and Harris have some talent, add in Hand if he ever remains healthy and I wonder if these guys will improve in a different scheme, Davis too. Guys like Tavai are hopeless, a worthless pick.

Who says they'll be drafting in the top ten? They would be the ninth pick now, but it's not out of the question they'll be bypassed by one or more of Atlanta, Miami, Denver, Chicago, or Minnesota.

I have a feeling everybody will be better without Patricia. Especially the offense, with Bevell seeing the next five weeks as an audition for the role of head coach (even if he has no legitimate chance).

I also suspect Undlin will dramatically simplify things on defense. They will still be bad, but they will not look as generally clueless as they have so far.

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5 minutes ago, Jason_R said:

Who says they'll be drafting in the top ten? They would be the ninth pick now, but it's not out of the question they'll be bypassed by one or more of Atlanta, Miami, Denver, Chicago, or Minnesota.

I have a feeling everybody will be better without Patricia. Especially the offense, with Bevell seeing the next five weeks as an audition for the role of head coach (even if he has no legitimate chance).

I also suspect Undlin will dramatically simplify things on defense. They will still be bad, but they will not look as generally clueless as they have so far.

That's one way of looking at it. They're also one game out of 4th so there's very little separating 4-16 remarkably.

I just don't think they will magically start winning games regularly with Patricia gone. I'm just hoping for them to at least show a pulse, I don't expect them to win more than 1 or 2 games the rest of the season. 5-11 or 6-10 should put them in that 8-12 range. Even with an improved team, they still play the likes of Tampa, Tennessee and Green Bay. They never beat Minnesota either.

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20 minutes ago, NYLion said:

I'd lose it a little bit if they took a WR in the top 10, a 3rd straight year of drafting a non-premium position in the top 10. Depending on BPA of course, I'm taking either a QB or the top Front 7 player left on the board.

Parsons is my favorite player in the draft outside of Lawrence so I'm taking him without hesitation if he's there (I doubt he drops out of the top 5). If not, I'd address that D-Line or take one of Wilson, Lance or Trask/Jones. 

I'm really interested to see how the defense does now that Patricia is gone. I'm curious to see if it really was a complete lack of talent or if it was at least somewhat due to schematic issues. Guys like Okudah, AO, Walker and Harris have some talent, add in Hand if he ever remains healthy and I wonder if these guys will improve in a different scheme, Davis too. Guys like Tavai are hopeless, a worthless pick.

i regard wr as a premium position in today's nfl.  And the lions have nothing on the roster next year at receiver except cephus and he doesnt appear to be any good.

i havent done my research (ha!) on the draft yet but if there is a julio jones type receiver out there, that would be worth a top 5 pick.

as cruzer always like to say, the lions are SLOW.  we need speed, baby!  

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5 minutes ago, Jason_R said:

Who says they'll be drafting in the top ten? They would be the ninth pick now, but it's not out of the question they'll be bypassed by one or more of Atlanta, Miami, Denver, Chicago, or Minnesota.

I have a feeling everybody will be better without Patricia. Especially the offense, with Bevell seeing the next five weeks as an audition for the role of head coach (even if he has no legitimate chance).

I also suspect Undlin will dramatically simplify things on defense. They will still be bad, but they will not look as generally clueless as they have so far.

the lions have a real chance to beat the bears now that patricia is gone.

trubisky is playing.  play a freaking zone defense and he wont know what to do.  drop into man and he'll start lobbing up bombs to allen robinson and we'll be screwed again.

and on offense, i know everyone is going to hate this, but they need to take deandre swift and pound it right up the middle if hicks is out.  the bears coach is walking on his last legs.  he just said the team needs to wake up and start playing hard.  that's a recipe for the team to quit on you.

the lions can beat the bears on sunday and begin their annual drive to ruin their draft position.

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13 minutes ago, NYLion said:

That's one way of looking at it. They're also one game out of 4th so there's very little separating 4-16 remarkably.

I just don't think they will magically start winning games regularly with Patricia gone. I'm just hoping for them to at least show a pulse, I don't expect them to win more than 1 or 2 games the rest of the season. 5-11 or 6-10 should put them in that 8-12 range. Even with an improved team, they still play the likes of Tampa, Tennessee and Green Bay. They never beat Minnesota either.

I agree, the most likely scenario is that they win one of the two games against Chicago/Minnesota, and drop the rest. Even this, though, would likely have them drafting between 6 and 8.

OTOH, we are about to see how much of a drag Patricia was on this team. I'm betting it was quite a lot.

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