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2020-21 Off season

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59 minutes ago, Casimir said:

Cleveland plans to officially drop “Indians” as nickname after 2021.  No word on the replacement nickname yet.

Cleveland Baseball Team.

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58 minutes ago, Casimir said:

Cleveland plans to officially drop “Indians” as nickname after 2021.  No word on the replacement nickname yet.

1901 Blues

1902 Bronchos

1903-1914 Naps

1915-2021 Indians

What's next?  

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Yeah, Daz was only 23 this year. To say time is running out is a bit of an exaggeration. 

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1 hour ago, Casimir said:

Cleveland plans to officially drop “Indians” as nickname after 2021.  No word on the replacement nickname yet.

I have a friend name Bill who is really upset that Buffalo's football team hasn't changed its name yet.

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If you follow the Cubs/Astros timeline of rebuilding, this should be the year you start to see some improvement in record from the Tigers.  However, I really can't see them improving that much this year.  Maybe another tiny incremental step forward but they're still a top 5-10 draft pick next year for sure.

Which says a lot about the state of the farm system when Avila took over.  That said, the Tigers' farm system appears very top heavy.  They've had top 5 picks for 4 years now and those guys are all ranked highly by scouting services, but what else do they have?  Do we see anyone else besides Paredes breaking through, and he is projected as a good role player?  

That seems to me to be the least Avila could have done.  

In fairness to Al, we'll have to wait until Illitch opens the pocketbooks again to see if he can actually build a winning team.  If he's around at that point.

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2016 was Avila's first draft in charge (even though he was involved in the DD drafts too).  From that draft only 3 players have reached the majors: Funkhouser, Garcia, and Schreiber.  Three relievers, none of whom profile to be anything special.  Manning is still on course to make it as a starting pitcher and his future looks bright if he can stay healthy.  Not having second and third round picks hurts, but there isn't anything in this class that looks like much of anything except the guy you took 9th overall.  Terrible draft.

2017:  Even worse than 2016 so far.  Faedo dropped off the map as a prospect only to look halfway decent at the end of last year.  Rey Rivera in the second round has been a disaster.  $1m bonus to take Sam McMillon in the fifth has been a disaster.  Gio Arriera?  Joey Morgan?  This entire draft looks like it might net the Tigers ONE major league player who profiles as a 4th or 5th starter at best (Faedo).

2018: Mize at #1 better turn out to be a #1 or #2 starter.  He was the first pick in the dang draft!  Still way too early to tell on any of these guys.  Skubal looks like a find so far.

The overall state of the farm system is certainly better now that it's stocked with 4 top 5 picks.  But is there any depth to it?  Doesn't seem like it yet.  We'll see how the 2018-2020 guys progress.  Hopefully better than the 2016-2017 guys.

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39 minutes ago, Buddha said:

 

The overall state of the farm system is certainly better now that it's stocked with 4 top 5 picks.  But is there any depth to it?  Doesn't seem like it yet.  We'll see how the 2018-2020 guys progress.  Hopefully better than the 2016-2017 guys.

If you go buy MLB pipleine-and I know a lot of people don't like it, but its easy and free-our 15th rated guy (beau burrows) is the first 45 overall guy. Everyone above him is 50 overall and up. 

To compare: Dodgers hit the mark at 14th, Indians at 16, Padres at 9, Yankees at 14, Marlins at 15. 

Just a quick glance shows we have about as much depth as anyone else. Now will those guys in that 6-15 rank on every team be good? nope. Will some become way better than their current ranking, yep. But, our depth looks to be in line with everyone else. We've got more top 100 guys than anyone and out next tier group is just as good as everyone else's on paper

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2 hours ago, leflore said:

C'mon, Al or no Al the Tigers will return to contention. Glass half full. 

The farm looks strong. Parades is raking this winter. Greene, Tork + likely strong 2020 draft and hopefully a strong 2021 draft. Only 1 terrible contract on the books. Al tore it down and the Tigers are now poised. If you don't see a glass half full you are a pessimist 

optimistic for the future? sure

for 2021? they look bad; hard to see them passing KC

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1 hour ago, tiger337 said:

1901 Blues

1902 Bronchos

1903-1914 Naps

1915-2021 Indians

What's next?  

They should go back to the naps. 

Cleveland Fire?

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On 12/11/2020 at 9:52 PM, tiger337 said:

Yeah, I figured that.  It was terrible phasing.  He never learned Dombrowski speak.   

I’m glad Avila came right out and said it. It’s refreshing to have a guy who comes right out and says it instead of burying it in corporatespeak. We don’t have to parse what he says.

So now we know: Tigers are not going to try to win this year. 

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I actually do like the Rockers. The HoF is about the only cool thing you can say about that city. F***ing Rush played there. 

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And that 2016 draft referenced? Nobody outside of the Dodgers, and maybe the Blue Jays, got one major leaguer out of it so far. If Manning turns into a #3 that's a heck of a good draft compared to everyone else. 

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Just now, Yoda said:

I actually do like the Rockers. The HoF is about the only cool thing you can say about that city. F***ing Rush played there. 

too close to Rockies

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Just now, Yoda said:

I actually do like the Rockers. The HoF is about the only cool thing you can say about that city. F***ing Rush played there. 

I guess they had a WNBA team called the Cleveland Rockers, so that's probably out.  

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On 12/12/2020 at 11:02 AM, Keepleyland2 said:

I know its crazy but at some point the money becomes too much...or maybe they got word he doesn't want to play here. Neither is a bad thing. It's just reality. 

When top free agents say they don’t want to play on your team, it’s bad.

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1 minute ago, chasfh said:

When top free agents say they don’t want to play on your team, it’s bad.

is it?

Maybe they don't like the town, maybe their family doens't want to move. A million reason why some of them bad. Some of them are good. Have you never turned down a job because you didn't like the fit?

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On 12/12/2020 at 4:06 PM, Longgone said:

There is also really no reason to assume we are not in on Kim from what Avila said, just have see how it plays out. No idea what his market is. 

If Kim has any decent market, it’s certain the Tigers won’t be near the top of it.

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Just now, Keepleyland2 said:

is it?

Maybe they don't like the town, maybe their family doens't want to move. A million reason why some of them bad. Some of them are good. Have you never turned down a job because you didn't like the fit?

When a top talent who’s actively on the market summarily turns down your team without even wanting to talk to you, that’s bad.

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Just now, chasfh said:

When a top talent who’s actively on the market summarily turns down your team without even wanting to talk to you, that’s bad.

Again

do we know they didn't talk? And I can tell you I have no desire to take a job in Arizona. Even a good one. Just not a fit. Does that mean the place is bad or I just don't like it. You're trying to make a woe-is-us situation when possibly non exists. That is all I'm saying. Lots of factors play into this and just to look and be like "why haven't we signed player X yet ...we are cheap...we are trying to lose!" seems a bit silly

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1 minute ago, Keepleyland2 said:

Again

do we know they didn't talk? And I can tell you I have no desire to take a job in Arizona. Even a good one. Just not a fit. Does that mean the place is bad or I just don't like it. You're trying to make a woe-is-us situation when possibly non exists. That is all I'm saying. Lots of factors play into this and just to look and be like "why haven't we signed player X yet ...we are cheap...we are trying to lose!" seems a bit silly

I don’t care about your thing with Arizona. It doesn’t matter here.

When top talent doesn’t want to even consider playing for your team, that’s a bad thing. Get enough of those, and that’s a bad sign for your franchise’s prospects. I don’t see how you can’t see that.

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the funny thing is, as much as we sit around and despair about the hitting lineup, the improvement between 2019 and 2020 their AL offensive category ranks was substantial. They were at the bottom of almost every AL offensive category in 2019. In the short season they were still below average but fairly middling. The only negative category they still led last yr was BB. When your team is behind all the time because you are not pitching, your hitting will seem worse than it is. So it is a little ironic that we are optimistic about the pitching because there is so much in the pipeline, but as recently as last season the pitching was still the weaker link than the hitting.

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2 hours ago, Keepleyland2 said:

And that 2016 draft referenced? Nobody outside of the Dodgers, and maybe the Blue Jays, got one major leaguer out of it so far. If Manning turns into a #3 that's a heck of a good draft compared to everyone else. 

There's quite a few more than that, Dakota Hudson STL, Dane Dunning CHW, Matt Thais LAA, Kyle Lewis SEA, Nick Senzel CIN, Ian Anderson ATL to name a few. 

Point taken though, nobody has more than a couple players actively contributing from that draft. If Manning makes the team next year, the Tigers will have gotten as much from that draft as most any other team thus far, except the dodgers. They never seem to run out of new, superstar prospects...

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