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8/17 @8:10 Detroit Tigers at Chicago White Sox

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1 minute ago, Shelton said:

Lol, ok

That’s your rebuttal?

Man, and I used to look up to you.

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4 minutes ago, Gehringer_2 said:

e=1/2m*v^2

without working this up with set of consistent units, just by difference the short answer is that the mass contribution to E is up by 9.52% and the velocity component is down by 11.9%, so just about 2.5% less total energy.

So there’s a breakeven point In this scenario, I guess around 93-94 mph. Interesting.

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Anybody think that Funkhouser gets sent down when Skubal or Mize get promoted this week?  His ERA is near 11 now, and he is fooling nobody right now

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31 minutes ago, chasfh said:

So all other things held equal, a heavier ball might fly farther?

if two balls leave the bat with the same diameter and the same exit velo, the heavier one will go further. So the question is whether a heavier ball would result in exit velos lower enough to cancel or be greater than the drag reduction effect. I think it would be every hard to guess which effect is greater without doing some actual lab work on the 'new' ball. 

My own guess it that at least the stronger players would cancel any effect by going to slightly heavier bats to get the same exit velo (make the increase in the bat's energy equal to the increase in the ball mass). That would also have real effect on swings so it gets complicated in a hurry!

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The White Sox are good and only going to get better.  They should be the class of the division for at least the next 3 seasons.  We are way behind them.

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4 minutes ago, Gehringer_2 said:

if two balls leave the bat with the same diameter and the same exit velo, the heavier one will go further. So the question is whether a heavier ball would result in exit velos lower enough to cancel or be greater than the drag reduction effect. I think it would be every hard to guess which effect is greater without doing some actual lab work on the 'new' ball.

My assumption was that, again other things held equal, a heavier ball would elicit lower exit velocity. I can’t envision a scenario it would not, but then, I’m neither a physicist nor an engineer.

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5 minutes ago, chasfh said:

My assumption was that, again other things held equal, a heavier ball would elicit less velocity. I can’t envision a scenario it would not, but then, I’m neither a physicist nor an engineer.

The exit velocity could be less, but there are a lot variables at play there. But the ballistic properties of the denser object at equal exit velo will definitely be better. That's why they make bullets out of lead.

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5 minutes ago, Gehringer_2 said:

The exit velocity could be less, but there are a lot variables at play there. But the ballistic properties of the denser object at equal exit velo will definitely be better. That's why they make bullets out of lead.

If we’re holding all other things equal, with only the weight of the ball different, what are the remaining variables? Honest question.

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39 minutes ago, chasfh said:

The ball in Japan is only 5 ounces, and pitchers go back and forth between the US and Japan enough that I’d think we’d’ve heard whether the difference is an issue, if it were.

Maybe don’t change it tomorrow. Maybe ease a heavier ball in across a couple of seasons. 

There are too many other variables. Innings pitched, how much they throw between starts, etc. There really isn't any meaningful comparison to be made there. 

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25 minutes ago, Gehringer_2 said:

e=1/2m*v^2

without working this up with set of consistent units, just by difference the short answer is that the mass contribution to E is up by 9.52% and the velocity component is down by 11.9%, so just about 2.5% less total energy.

Thanks 3PO. 

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42 minutes ago, chasfh said:

That’s your rebuttal?

Man, and I used to look up to you.

He's been underperforming lately, but he'll work things out.  Just needs to make a little adjustment.  

  • Haha 1

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2 hours ago, chasfh said:

If we’re holding all other things equal, with only the weight of the ball different, what are the remaining variables? Honest question.

Well, start with the pitcher. What limits how hard he can throw the ball? Is it the ball's weight or limits of his own physiology? If the ball's weight it not the limiting factor in the mechanics, pitchers will pitch just as fast, but they will just put more strain on their arms because of the increase mass load (I think Biggs already hit this point). I don't claim to know which is true but I believe either could easily be.

Now at the contact between the ball and the bat you have the 1/2m*v^2 of the bat and 1/2m*v^2 of the ball. That is the total energy of the collision. The question them becomes how much of that energy ends up in the ball? That is a factor of the mechanical elasticity of the bat acting as a lever arm (mechanical properties of the whole object), and also the local elasticity of the wood fiber where the ball hits. If you exceed the elastic limit of either of those, some energy will turn into heat or permanent deformation of the bat and that energy won't go into the ball. On the ball side you have the same kinds of elastic factors. Basically there is an elastic limit on how much energy the ball can absorb from the impact and still re-release it before the rest is just dissipated as heat or deformation (the COR measurement done on the baseballs is meant to measure this).

So if you change the ball to make it heavier, how do you do it? No matter how you do it you probably won't get a ball with exactly the same mechanical properties. It's elasticity curve will probably be different in some unkown way. Plus the heavier ball will interact differently with the bat, plus we don't really know if the pitcher can throw it as fast or not. Also a heavier ball will break less with the same stitches and spin rate if thrown at the same velocity. In fact that might be the biggest difference. The difficulty of spinning the ball also goes up with its weight, plus the effect of spin goes down because the heavier ball resists the aerodynamics effects of spin more, so you could have a double whammy against breaking balls.

But to be clear, I'm not knocking the idea per se, just saying that you would have to do some testing because there are enough factors at play that it is hard to predict exactly what the result would be.

And to to be fair, a lot of us talk about 'deadening' the ball. But it's not obvious to me how we do that without possibly causing other changes as well. The league says they have never changed the specification for the ball, but the truth is that the spec is so wide that all that has to be happening is the manufacturer is producing balls slightly at the higher end of the COR range, or even that they are simply manufacturing to the same average as always but with less variance so fewer balls are struck hard that don't fly long. 

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18 minutes ago, Charles Liston said:

This losing streak is your fault.

I'll take the blame. 

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45 minutes ago, Charles Liston said:

This losing streak is your fault.

Lol I had the same darn thought

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1 hour ago, Tenacious D said:

The White Sox are good and only going to get better.  They should be the class of the division for at least the next 3 seasons.  We are way behind them.

I've been saying that for 2 years and things are finally clicking for them. If their pitching ever gets and remains healthy they should have a stretch of contending, as you said. They finally appear to have arrived 

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2 hours ago, kj2018 said:

Anybody think that Funkhouser gets sent down when Skubal or Mize get promoted this week?  His ERA is near 11 now, and he is fooling nobody right now

yeah - I don't know how many guys you can have that can only work mop up. Then again at the rate the Tigers are careening downhill there may be a lot more mop up to go around. But you have Funk, R. Garcia and C. Fulmer, none of whom are even remotely trustworthy, other than trusting they will give up runs. R. Garcia they are stuck with. I don't know if there is some contractual thing with C. Fulmer but he certainly doesn't look like he belongs in the MLB right now either.

Boyd actually wasn't nearly as terrible tonight. He did make a lot more good pitches than in his last start, but that FB needs some work. Maybe they need to call Jeff Jones out of retirement. Helping guys recover lost velo seemed to be one of his fortes.

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9 hours ago, chasfh said:

That’s your rebuttal?

Man, and I used to look up to you.

Why would you have done that? That sounds a you problem. 
 

I asked for an explanation from you and you gave it. I thought it was funny. Not sure what I am supposed to rebut. 

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9 hours ago, Tenacious D said:

The White Sox are good and only going to get better.  They should be the class of the division for at least the next 3 seasons.  We are way behind them.

They could have been the 2015 Cubs this year.

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10 hours ago, Tenacious D said:

The White Sox are good and only going to get better.  They should be the class of the division for at least the next 3 seasons.  We are way behind them.

ever since they kicked kenny williams upstairs, they have been annoyingly smart.

theyve spent money wisely and made great trades (except for the one glaring omission of tatis for shields, but that had kenny williams' fingerprints all over it).

sox/twins/indians are so far ahead of us that its going to be a while before were winning anything in this division again.

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