05-06-12--DETROIT VS WHITE SOX-1:05 PM

**Antrat** · 05-06-2012, 04:19 PM

This is when you realize that the Whitesox can't hit either.
If the dummy had not swung, the bases would've been loaded.
Good win.
And BTW, unlike the Whitesox, the Tigers will start hitting again.

**ToledoTigerFan** · 05-06-2012, 04:19 PM

God, I hate closers. I hope Valverde misses the flight and has to spend the next few days at Metro.

**TheCouga** · 05-06-2012, 04:20 PM

**Lousluggage** · 05-06-2012, 04:22 PM

Originally Posted by DaYooperASBDT

Anybody need a kitten?

Does it have stripes?

**Corky** · 05-06-2012, 04:22 PM

**robgrave** · 05-06-2012, 04:24 PM

Let's say Papa lost Beckham to ball four, and Leyland decides to make a change. Our backup closer -- who is he? Today, I mean.

**The Truman Show** · 05-06-2012, 04:30 PM

Dirks now has a .910 OPS. I don't think that's even remotely sustainable, but until further notice he has to be starting every game. He's the only corner outfielder that has done anything that can be called production.

And we go through this every year; teams always go through spells of not hitting with RISP and it always regresses to the league average. Believe it or not, going into today's game the Tigers were actually hitting better with RISP (.720 OPS) than on the whole (.700).

During today's game, they hit at a clip of 294/384/588. That's very good hitting, and there's nothing about having RISP that the Tigers hitters do or the White Sox pitchers do to create that kind of sequencing. It's just something that regresses naturally.

**The Truman Show** · 05-06-2012, 04:33 PM

Originally Posted by robgrave

Let's say Papa lost Beckham to ball four, and Leyland decides to make a change. Our backup closer -- who is he? Today, I mean.

Well once you get past Dotel, Coke, and Benoit, I think Below is the next most reliable pitcher on the list. I know no one thinks about Duane Below and closer in the same sentence, but the guy gets outs. I certainly trust him more than Balester, Putkonen, or Villarreal.

**robgrave** · 05-06-2012, 04:37 PM

Originally Posted by The Truman Show

Well once you get past Dotel, Coke, and Benoit, I think Below is the next most reliable pitcher on the list. I know no one thinks about Duane Below and closer in the same sentence, but the guy gets outs. I certainly trust him more than Balester, Putkonen, or Villarreal.

I keep forgetting about Below, to be honest. Yes, I agree, he would be the best bet. Some time before the end of this season, I'd expect we'll see that move. Wouldn't criticize Leyland in the least for making it, either.

**ROMAD1** · 05-06-2012, 04:41 PM

Needed this one...and yesterday...should have been a sweep.

**IdahoBert** · 05-06-2012, 04:42 PM

**PuNk42AE** · 05-06-2012, 04:50 PM

Has there been any kind of update on Luis Marte? So far it's been just over a month for his Strained hammy, and last update i've seen said he was shutdown from some soreness.

**DaYooperASBDT** · 05-06-2012, 05:58 PM

Originally Posted by Lousluggage

Does it have stripes?

Let me check, after I birthed him in the 9th think I might have accidentally thrown him at the TV.

**catswithbats** · 05-06-2012, 06:47 PM

Originally Posted by robgrave

I keep forgetting about Below, to be honest. Yes, I agree, he would be the best bet. Some time before the end of this season, I'd expect we'll see that move. Wouldn't criticize Leyland in the least for making it, either.

I don't necessarily disagree, but I don't think Leyland would ever consider Below for closer. I could be wrong.

I know I don't really want to mess with the Dotel-Coke-Benoit three-headed monster, though.

**Gehringer_2** · 05-06-2012, 06:57 PM

Originally Posted by catswithbats

I don't necessarily disagree, but I don't think Leyland would ever consider Below for closer. I could be wrong.

I know I don't really want to mess with the Dotel-Coke-Benoit three-headed monster, though.

I think Coke and Benoit could both finish games.

**robgrave** · 05-06-2012, 07:42 PM

Originally Posted by Gehringer_2

I think Coke and Benoit could both finish games.

But in today's game, Coke, Benoit, and Dotel were all used before the ninth. Valverde falters, gets jammed up, a change seems to be in order...who gets the call? Below seems to be the best choice of those remaining. That's all we're saying here. In a Valverde emergency (and there will be many more of those), Below might well be the best choice to bail him out and finish the inning (or the game).

EDIT: Or maybe use Below where Coke was used, and save Coke for the emergency backup in the ninth. Really, how many times will we cross our fingers with Valverde in there, praying he can get the final out with the tying or go-ahead run in scoring position? And a left-handed hitter at the plate?

**Gehringer_2** · 05-06-2012, 07:46 PM

Originally Posted by robgrave

But in today's game, Coke, Benoit, and Dotel were all used before the ninth. Valverde falters, gets jammed up, a change seems to be in order...who gets the call? Below seems to be the best choice of those remaining. That's all we're saying here. In a Valverde emergency (and there will be many more of those), Below might well be the best choice to bail him out and finish the inning (or the game).

True, but its been noted already that JL is probably going to be biased toward an 'experienced' pitcher to close. Makes little sense given Papelbon's or Feliz's results - just to grab names that comes to mind.

**robgrave** · 05-06-2012, 07:51 PM

Originally Posted by Gehringer_2

True, but its been noted already that JL is probably going to be biased toward an 'experienced' pitcher to close. Makes little sense given Papelbon's or Feliz's results - just to grab names that comes to mind.

Lord save us from the Valverde "experience"!

**The Truman Show** · 05-06-2012, 08:02 PM

Originally Posted by catswithbats

I don't necessarily disagree, but I don't think Leyland would ever consider Below for closer. I could be wrong.

I know I don't really want to mess with the Dotel-Coke-Benoit three-headed monster, though.

Well sure, but it's not a question of making Below the closer, but rather being willing to use him when it gets sticky in the 9th and lefties are due up. You can't just save Coke for that spot because then you're just making the 7th and 8th more difficult, but the point is that Leyland needs to be flexible when Valverde is in the game. I think at the very least, Valverde has kinda lost the privilege to have the 9th all to himself.

**robgrave** · 05-06-2012, 08:07 PM

Originally Posted by The Truman Show

... but the point is that Leyland needs to be flexible when Valverde is in the game. I think at the very least, Valverde has kinda lost the privilege to have the 9th all to himself.

Exactly.

**Tramlou** · 05-06-2012, 08:57 PM

**thefunk** · 05-06-2012, 09:16 PM

let's stop being thick.

we all know it's going to take something like 5 blown saves out of his next 6 attempts to get Valverde semi-out of the 9th inning. Every save like today solidifies it for JL that his boy is Jose and he'll eventually settle down.

**catswithbats** · 05-06-2012, 10:44 PM

Originally Posted by Gehringer_2

I think Coke and Benoit could both finish games.

I agree, but I like Benoit in the eighth. I'd think about using Dotel or Coke. And I don't mind the Below idea.

**pyrotigers** · 05-06-2012, 11:30 PM

Does anyone else remember that game against Cleveland where Todd Jones was left in FOREVER and gave up 4 or 5 runs in the 9th to lose the game?

I really can't imagine Leyland pulling a proven closer in the 9th outside of really extreme circumstances

edit: June 1, 2007 Detroit Tigers at Cleveland Indians Box Score and Play by Play - Baseball-Reference.com

**robgrave** · 05-06-2012, 11:44 PM

Originally Posted by thefunk

let's stop being thick.

we all know it's going to take something like 5 blown saves out of his next 6 attempts to get Valverde semi-out of the 9th inning. Every save like today solidifies it for JL that his boy is Jose and he'll eventually settle down.

Five of six? I'd like to think more like two of three, but in any case, you make your point. The old man's ways aren't etched in stone, but he is more or less locked in to roles, conventional ideas about how they should be filled, etc. For the time being, anyway, live or die with Papa Grande.

**The Truman Show** · 05-06-2012, 11:48 PM

Originally Posted by pyrotigers

Does anyone else remember that game against Cleveland where Todd Jones was left in FOREVER and gave up 4 or 5 runs in the 9th to lose the game?

I really can't imagine Leyland pulling a proven closer in the 9th outside of really extreme circumstances

edit: June 1, 2007 Detroit Tigers at Cleveland Indians Box Score and Play by Play - Baseball-Reference.com

I'm really glad that I have learned to put regular season games in the proper perspective and reached a more zen place in my life, because I remember this game and going completely ballistic the entire time. That was one of the single worst managed games I've ever seen.

**catswithbats** · 05-07-2012, 01:39 AM

Originally Posted by pyrotigers

Does anyone else remember that game against Cleveland where Todd Jones was left in FOREVER and gave up 4 or 5 runs in the 9th to lose the game?

I really can't imagine Leyland pulling a proven closer in the 9th outside of really extreme circumstances

edit: June 1, 2007 Detroit Tigers at Cleveland Indians Box Score and Play by Play - Baseball-Reference.com

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Leyland get someone up during the ninth inning of a game this year when Valverde was struggling? I seem to remember that.