"Joe The Plumber" Ties the Holocaust to Gun Control

[monkeynuts]

‘Joe the Plumber’ Ties the Holocaust to Gun Control - ABC News

Yikes. Can't this guy just get lost on some Pacific Island or something? I'm embarrassed I live within 100 miles of him.

[shauntacular]

I have no love for Kaptur after how she did Kucinich in the primary, but these are the effects of gerrymandering -- districts are going to be lost like that. Lynn Rivers got the same treatment by John Dingell here in Michigan. Kaptur did it by running a bit of a smear campaign against Kucinich and that wasn't cool at all.

Having said that, if this no-ideas dimwit assclown manages to steal the district from a 15-term incumbent I will eat my hat. Then I will promptly move my state so it is no longer next door to Ohio.

[qsilvr2531]

I like where he says that he isn't claiming that gun control caused the holocaust and then follows up with another claim linking the holocaust to gun control.

[monkeynuts]

I like where he says that he isn't claiming that gun control caused the holocaust and then follows up with another claim linking the holocaust to gun control.

I also like the assumption that if the Jews were armed they would've somehow been able to overcome and fight off the Nazi machine.

[screwball]

I live in Ohio but can't vote for either of these people. Close, but not quite.

It should be interesting, but I don't think Joe has a chance. I worked in Toledo for 10 years and my take was Marcy is pretty well liked. I thought she did a good job in the congressional hearings vs. the banksters.

This will come down to how dirty they get against Joe, who has a court record, including some domestic issues they can exploit vs. the Koch money. I'm sure the banksters will contribute big too, they can't be happy with Marcy.

It should make great theater though.

[shauntacular]

If the system worked the way it was designed, I'd have all the faith that Joe would be exposed as the talking point spouting no-nothing he is. Yet I know that the big money calls the shots now, and with the might of the Koch wallet behind him, it's going to be an uphill climb for Kaptur and it really shouldn't be. The man has zero qualifications.

[ROMAD1]

the military history of the Nazi's liquidation of the Warsaw Ghetto and the latter 1944 Warsaw Uprising provide plenty of argument that the Polish and the Jews of Poland should have had more common firearm ownership.

[shabba4detroit]

the military history of the Nazi's liquidation of the Warsaw Ghetto and the latter 1944 Warsaw Uprising provide plenty of argument that the Polish and the Jews of Poland should have had more common firearm ownership.

But we can't let facts get in the way of a Joe the Plumber beatdown.

[ROMAD1]

But we can't let facts get in the way of a Joe the Plumber beatdown.

How is Israel regarding gun control?

[monkeynuts]

But we can't let facts get in the way of a Joe the Plumber beatdown.

So you think arming the Jews with small arms would have been enough for them to overcome the tanks, high-end military machine guns, and other heavy artillery that millions of Nazi fighters would have had?

[monkeynuts]

the military history of the Nazi's liquidation of the Warsaw Ghetto and the latter 1944 Warsaw Uprising provide plenty of argument that the Polish and the Jews of Poland should have had more common firearm ownership.

It's plenty fair to say we all wish that the Jews had a fighting chance by giving them guns, but to claim the Holocaust would not have occurred is absurd.

[hueytaxi]

So you think arming the Jews with small arms would have been enough for them to overcome the tanks, high-end military machine guns, and other heavy artillery that millions of Nazi fighters would have had?

Did not the Afghani mujahideen do exactly that to the mighty Russians?

[ROMAD1]

So you think arming the Jews with small arms would have been enough for them to overcome the tanks, high-end military machine guns, and other heavy artillery that millions of Nazi fighters would have had?

The facts are the facts. The Jews of the Warsaw ghetto rose when it appeared the ghetto would be liquidated. They lacked any small arms but still stung the Nazis.

Latter the Polish Home Army which had been armed to some extend by British SOE weapons and with some coordination with the Polish London Government was able to turn the uprising into a 6 week siege, without the heavy weapons that the Nazis had.

Not sure how happy Joe Stalin was with the idea of a resilient Polish resistance movement so he let it get crushed.

[monkeynuts]

Did not the Afghani mujahideen do exactly that to the mighty Russians?

1.5 million Nazis invaded Poland.

115,000 Soviets were in Afghanistan.

[monkeynuts]

Back to the original post, it's also quite offensive to most Jewish folks to use the Holocaust to make a political point. There is absolutely zero evidence that some form of gun control in the US would lead to the US government to murder millions and millions of civilians like the Nazis did.

More so, is his opponent arguing to ban guns? If not, this whole thing is even more ridiculous.

[qsilvr2531]

The facts are the facts. The Jews of the Warsaw ghetto rose when it appeared the ghetto would be liquidated. They lacked any small arms but still stung the Nazis.

Latter the Polish Home Army which had been armed to some extend by British SOE weapons and with some coordination with the Polish London Government was able to turn the uprising into a 6 week siege, without the heavy weapons that the Nazis had.

Not sure how happy Joe Stalin was with the idea of a resilient Polish resistance movement so he let it get crushed.

So to be clear, are you saying that gun control in Poland and Germany prior to World War II caused the holocaust? And absent gun control the holocaust would not have happened (or maybe World War II would have been noticeably shorter due to the successful rebellion Nazi actions would have provoked during the war).

[ROMAD1]

Reducto ad Hitlerum is always/usually intellectually weak. However, we could all benefit from better understanding of history and the dynamic of power when one side has firearms and the other does not.

[qsilvr2531]

Reducto ad Hitlerum is always/usually intellectually weak. However, we could all benefit from better understanding of history and the dynamic of power when one side has firearms and the other does not.

I don't disagree with your last sentence at all. I don't think that's what this guy was doing however and his comments are well deserving of a "beatdown" even in light of a strong understanding of the history of the holocaust.

[monkeynuts]

Reducto ad Hitlerum is always/usually intellectually weak. However, we could all benefit from better understanding of history and the dynamic of power when one side has firearms and the other does not.

Ok. That does not answer his question, but that's fine.

I think it's fair to say in order for the Jews to have a fighting chance they would have needed heavier weapons than hand guns. Does that mean that Joe the Plumber - and others here - think American civilians should be allowed to have tanks/RPGs/etc to defend against the government?

[shauntacular]

of course -- that's the mantra of the gun crowd. Uzis for babies. I'm dead serious -- people against gun control are literally brain dead in this country. Someone at work even tried the tired "If having guns is made to be criminal, only the criminals will have guns." Give me a break. Like all those violent gun deaths in european nations with strong gun control laws (germany, UK, etc.) right? LOL

[Joe Gahona]

There's a Jewish group that is staunchly pro-gun for this reason. I can't remember their name -- I haven't paid attention to these arguments since the mid-'90s, but one of their mantras was that in many/all cases of genocide, there was gun control.

[ROMAD1]

of course -- that's the mantra of the gun crowd. Uzis for babies. I'm dead serious -- people against gun control are literally brain dead in this country. Someone at work even tried the tired "If having guns is made to be criminal, only the criminals will have guns." Give me a break. Like all those violent gun deaths in european nations with strong gun control laws (germany, UK, etc.) right? LOL

people against gun control are literally brain dead in this country

If you are going to post insulting posts at least try to make them internally consistent.

[hueytaxi]

1.5 million Nazis invaded Poland.

115,000 Soviets were in Afghanistan.

History is filled with battles of the fewer overcoming superior numbers on the field. Not suggesting this could have happened, only that disarming the public is a step to gaining tyranny.

[monkeynuts]

History is filled with battles of the fewer overcoming superior numbers on the field. Not suggesting this could have happened, only that disarming the public is a step to gaining tyranny.

The Mujahideen had anti-aircraft missles, rocket launchers, machines guns, etc. Should American civilians be allowed to have these weapons to defend against possible government supression?

[hueytaxi]

Millions of gun owners now considered brain dead? Such a clever way to explain ones intellect. I'm sure such thoughts prevent venturing outside to smell fresh mown grass or the wonders of civilization.

[shauntacular]

If you are going to post insulting posts at least try to make them internally consistent.

It's plenty consistent. I think people who oppose gun control laws are morons. The United States has more gun deaths per year than all Europe combined, with other nations thrown in for good measure. The nations above the US in gun deaths? South Africa, Thailand, and the Philippines (a US colony.) South Africa might as well be the old west right now. There is no reason for a person to own a sidearm in the US. Rifles for hunting are one thing - but home defense or whatever other lame-brained excuse they come up with to justify handgun ownership are all ridiculous.

Uzis for babies.

Gun nutters are the worst. It's not 1880 and you're not Doc Holiday. More guns in this country in the hands of private citizens (and eventually the gangsters themselves) than anywhere else in the world. It's a mess and needs to change. Anyone who can't see that is blind.

[shauntacular]

Millions of gun owners now considered brain dead? Such a clever way to explain ones intellect. I'm sure such thoughts prevent venturing outside to smell fresh mown grass or the wonders of civilization.

Handgun owners - yep. No viable reason to own one. More personal handguns get used on their owners in home invasion scenarios than get used on the perpetrators themselves.

[hueytaxi]

Handgun owners - yep. No viable reason to own one. More personal handguns get used on their owners in home invasion scenarios than get used on the perpetrators themselves.

Oh, now you use a smaller brush. And you assumption of hand gun usage is only found in anti gun circles.
So using my handgun is more dangerous than firing my AK-47?

[ROMAD1]

Allow me to invite the Democrats to run on the platform of strong gun control this Autumn. You will have a fun drubbing at the polls.

[hueytaxi]

Allow me to invite the Democrats to run on the platform of strong gun control this Autumn. You will have a fun drubbing at the polls.

That alone would make Ameriica safer.

[shauntacular]

Huey, I said in my earlier post that rifles for hunting were another thing entirely. No, I did not mean that to include automatic rifles like the AK-47 (lol). Yes I should have been more clear, but let there be no mistake on my position now: there is no reason for any civilian in the United States to own a handgun or assault weapon. Not one.

ROMAD1: The problem is the persistent mentality of handgun ownership as a good thing in the country as a whole. Of course you can't run on gun control and expect to win an election, because the electorate are morons by and large. Public attitude needs to change before we get anywhere closer to sanity in that regard. Let's be honest here, Joe the Plumber isn't going for the intelligentsia vote in Cuyahooga Falls. He's pandering to the lowest common denominator -- the people who want to hear someone just spout the Limbaugh-approved talking points. The guy has zero experience and (if you've ever heard an interview of his besides this one) zero clue.

We're talking about a guy who thinks Herman Cain's 9/9/9 plan would actually work. This is not a great mind at work here.

[John_Brian_K]

Huey, I said in my earlier post that rifles for hunting were another thing entirely. No, I did not mean that to include automatic rifles like the AK-47 (lol). Yes I should have been more clear, but let there be no mistake on my position now: there is no reason for any civilian in the United States to own a handgun or assault weapon. Not one.ROMAD1: The problem is the persistent mentality of handgun ownership as a good thing in the country as a whole. Of course you can't run on gun control and expect to win an election, because the electorate are morons by and large. Public attitude needs to change before we get anywhere closer to sanity in that regard. Let's be honest here, Joe the Plumber isn't going for the intelligentsia vote in Cuyahooga Falls. He's pandering to the lowest common denominator -- the people who want to hear someone just spout the Limbaugh-approved talking points. The guy has zero experience and (if you've ever heard an interview of his besides this one) zero clue.

We're talking about a guy who thinks Herman Cain's 9/9/9 plan would actually work. This is not a great mind at work here.

I am speechless....

I want to put an 'lol' in there, but those inflame things sooo bad.

[shauntacular]

no you can lol me bro my jimmies won't get rustled I promise. Check the avatar if you're unsure...

[hueytaxi]

Just for the record, you may not purchase or own an AK-47 assault weapon without proper licensing and registration at a Federal level. The AK-47 is a "selective fire" weapon (selective meaning "safe- semi-automatic fire or fully automatic fire). The AK-47 one may purchase at a gunshop or gun show is a replica which is not an automatic rifle. These are normally a Norinco or Saiga. Mine is actually a Norinco SAR-1 and fires a fine round for deer and small game. I have no intent to do so and enjoy its use at the range. The ammunition is much more affordable than my Marlin 30-30. The draw back is it will not fit in my glove compartment, thus my Taurus Judge.

[pfife]

But we can't let facts get in the way of a Joe the Plumber beatdown.

LOL at you quoting "provide plenty of argument" and characterize that as fact. Did you even read what you quoted? LOL

[screwball]

I can't vote for her, but given the choice, pretty easy.

[ROMAD1]

Bill Clinton realized that he couldn't push gun control any further after the strong negative reaction he got from the Dennis Burke/Rahm Emmanuel written assault weapons ban.

I wonder if the Valerie Jarrets of the world realize that?

[hueytaxi]

The Mujahideen had anti-aircraft missles, rocket launchers, machines guns, etc. Should American civilians be allowed to have these weapons to defend against possible government supression?

Why ask me such an inane question about American civilians? Now if you asked the same question about W
WII Jews and Armenians, then the answer would easily be a yes.

[hueytaxi]

Bill Clinton realized that he couldn't push gun control any further after the strong negative reaction he got from the Dennis Burke/Rahm Emmanuel written assault weapons ban.

I wonder if the Valerie Jarrets of the world realize that?

And the ban only increased prices for imported parts and did little to nothing on stopping legal ownership. Change 11 parts to American made and suddenly it was no longer a dreaded "assault weapon"
. You could not legally purchase a Russian or Chinese SKS rifle with a bayonet, but you could purchase a Romanian or bulgarian SKS with a bayonet. 95% of the parts are interchangeable.

[pfife]

Bill Clinton realized that he couldn't push gun control any further after the strong negative reaction he got from the Dennis Burke/Rahm Emmanuel written assault weapons ban.

I wonder if the Valerie Jarrets of the world realize that?

Probably, hence absolutely no action whatsoever from the Obama administration on gun control.