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  1. #3121
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    Quote Originally Posted by VegasTiger View Post
    From your link:

    “This has nothing to do with the ACA. This is 100 percent about Xerox, who won the bid from the state of Nevada to create this exchange. And they’ve failed. They absolutely failed,” Callister told the Review-Journal.
    “I just want to get people covered who paid for coverage,” Callister said. “State law said that’s what’s supposed to happen.”
    One of the things I have found that people like to do is post a link that THEY -- themselves haven't read. Not saying Mr. ballmich did this, but often it is a story that disproves the exact point they are making...

    In this discussion I wonder.... those that think ACA is the worse thing ever.... Can you explain why the GOP --- when in control or not in control --- have not really tried much to fix the health care in our country? I kind of understand how politicians might not feel what it is like to not have health insurance

    I remember on time I was riding my mountain bike, when I worked for a radio station --- full time -- making minimum wage, without insurance --- I skidded out and went down scraping my arm. ALL I thought as I was going down: "I don't have insurance and I can't afford ANY injuries"

    Maybe government insurance is the worse idea ever... but if the Koch brothers would start to encourage American businesses to take the moral step forward and insure their emplees
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Bigglesworth View Post
    Please make the type with the scrubby tops to them. I love those sponges.
    +111

  3. #3123
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    Quote Originally Posted by Walt View Post
    Ha, you won't take any of my classes because I am almost done with my last one. Now I have to make 4 times as much developing better sponges. ;-)
    We definitely need better sponges than the one we elected for President in 2000.
    Distribution of wealth is not in any way democratic. It is, in fact, tyrannical, in that a very select few own almost all of it, while most have little to no access. To have a country that prioritizes wealth over individual rights is the antithesis of democracy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheCouga View Post
    We definitely need better sponges than the one we elected for President in 2000.
    I was rather angry that the Dems couldn't find a better candidate. Same in 2004.
    It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. -Carl Sagan http://th07.deviantart.net/fs70/PRE/...yx-d41sg12.png

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    Quote Originally Posted by Walt View Post
    Ha, you won't take any of my classes because I am almost done with my last one. Now I have to make 4 times as much developing better sponges. ;-)
    Walt, a Mr. Bill O'Reilly is calling you on line 1.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Titus Tiger View Post
    One of the things I have found that people like to do is post a link that THEY -- themselves haven't read. Not saying Mr. ballmich did this, but often it is a story that disproves the exact point they are making...
    I posted that link and quote, without comment. I wasn't making a point, and therefore nothing I said was disproved.

    It is related to Obamacare because it is a state healthcare exchange, and I deemed it worthy to post so others could see it... again, without my own commentary.
    Manus haec inimica tyrannis ense petit placidam sub libertate quietem.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ballmich View Post
    I posted that link and quote, without comment. I wasn't making a point, and therefore nothing I said was disproved.

    It is related to Obamacare because it is a state healthcare exchange, and I deemed it worthy to post so others could see it... again, without my own commentary.

    I was afraid of this

    One of the things I have found that people like to do is post a link that THEY -- themselves haven't read. Not saying Mr. ballmich did this, but often it is a story that disproves the exact point they are making...
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    Quote Originally Posted by ballmich View Post
    I posted that link and quote, without comment. I wasn't making a point, and therefore nothing I said was disproved.

    It is related to Obamacare because it is a state healthcare exchange, and I deemed it worthy to post so others could see it... again, without my own commentary.
    I do this a lot too - it's just throwing stuff out there b/c someone else might be interested - if you are, cool, if not, cool.

    If someone throws out a link in support of their argument, I try to at least skim it, but I have some exceptions because I'm an informed consumer. Alex Jones (sorry man), Forbes, and Daily Caller are near the top of the list. I used to at least appreciate Tucker Carlson but this outfit is something else.

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    I like Forbes. It's one of the news sources I follow on Twitter, and they report on a variety of interesting subjects. They are definitely more reliable than CNN these days.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Melody View Post
    I like Forbes. It's one of the news sources I follow on Twitter, and they report on a variety of interesting subjects. They are definitely more reliable than CNN these days.
    They published a number of pieces that have been posted in this forum that I thought were genuinely factually wrong, and it wasn't opinion pieces. So I steer clear of them now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pfife View Post
    They published a number of pieces that have been posted in this forum that I thought were genuinely factually wrong, and it wasn't opinion pieces. So I steer clear of them now.
    So has the New York Times. But I still follow them as well. LOL

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    5 Things The Obamacare Enrollment Numbers Won't Tell You

    As I have maintained all along, I am willing to bet when we know the concrete numbers, a majority of enrolled people will be on Medicaid.
    Who knew after all these years Joe Dumars was really playing a dual role as both himself and his alter-ego Ken Holland.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.TaterSalad View Post
    5 Things The Obamacare Enrollment Numbers Won't Tell You

    As I have maintained all along, I am willing to bet when we know the concrete numbers, a majority of enrolled people will be on Medicaid.

    That is kind of like confidence... how about 10:1 odds... or 20:1 odds..?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Titus Tiger View Post
    I was afraid of this

    One of the things I have found that people like to do is post a link that THEY -- themselves haven't read. Not saying Mr. ballmich did this, but often it is a story that disproves the exact point they are making...
    But you insinuated that I did do that.

    I read the article. And while the lawsuit is not against Obamacare, it is against as state healthcare exchange which is related to Obamacare. And I thought it was worthwhile to post so that others could read it, if they chose to do so.
    Manus haec inimica tyrannis ense petit placidam sub libertate quietem.

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    I'm glad you posted it, its pertinent to the discussion and actually it's info about a competitor of mine....

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    Quote Originally Posted by ballmich View Post
    But you insinuated that I did do that.

    I read the article. And while the lawsuit is not against Obamacare, it is against as state healthcare exchange which is related to Obamacare. And I thought it was worthwhile to post so that others could read it, if they chose to do so.

    help me out here ... when does my "not saying Mr. ballmich" mean I am not saying you or even insinuating.

    Let me add this is a non-political mistake everyone does. I see it a lot from republicans... but I am sure it works the other way.

    NOT SAYING you are a republican or that you do this a lot... NOT SAYING you do this at all. The fact that you are saying you didn't mean this should be enough for both of us. no one needs to infer
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    Signed up on March 15th, payed first premium then (not due until April 15th), got my card today. Had no issues. Lucky I guess.
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    Quote Originally Posted by VegasTiger View Post
    Signed up on March 15th, payed first premium then (not due until April 15th), got my card today. Had no issues. Lucky I guess.
    First Vegas, then America!

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    You'd think that for being the centerpiece of their entire strategy, the conservatives here would be bumping this thread more with #s of carnage...

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    How come the guy who got beat in Detroit didn't have insurance? Or does he and I'm about to be scammed if I donate some cash?

  22. #3142
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    Quote Originally Posted by VegasTiger View Post
    Signed up on March 15th, payed first premium then (not due until April 15th), got my card today. Had no issues. Lucky I guess.
    Not lucky, this is how it has been going. Many of the smear campaigns don't align with what healthcare professionals are seeing with their own actions.

    This is a fun time to be in healthcare. Like any career, health administrators come from all sorts of different backgrounds. In my rural area you can imagine many are uber conservative. It has been refreshing to see some of these folks change their tune on ObamaCare. It has gone from extreme hate (before they even know what was going to happen, but it was Obama and he is a Democrat) to acceptance and support. When you actually sit down, walk a person without insurance through their options, and explain to them how it effects their life, it almost always turns into a very positive experience. I have been lucky enough to have a lot of these experiences lately.

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    Obamacare is, apparently, declining to implode | AEIdeas

    "declining to implode"


    Or, everything that was said about it imploding was.... well.... false.

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    The Republicans are going to win in 2014 on the platform of taking this away...remember?
    Distribution of wealth is not in any way democratic. It is, in fact, tyrannical, in that a very select few own almost all of it, while most have little to no access. To have a country that prioritizes wealth over individual rights is the antithesis of democracy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheCouga View Post
    The Republicans are going to win in 2014 on the platform of taking this away...remember?
    well, TBF, that 9.3 million number hasn't been... "unskewed" yet

  28. #3148
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    Quote Originally Posted by pfife View Post
    well, TBF, that 9.3 million number hasn't been... "unskewed" yet
    Thanks for reminding me. No doubt, this will be the next circus to come to town:

    Distribution of wealth is not in any way democratic. It is, in fact, tyrannical, in that a very select few own almost all of it, while most have little to no access. To have a country that prioritizes wealth over individual rights is the antithesis of democracy.

  29. #3149
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    The competing claims are kind of amazing.....

    If you move the goalposts far enough, you’re sure to score.

    Gallup has a fairly honest headline: “In U.S., Uninsured Rate Lowest Since 2008″. But, hm, what happened in 2008? Let’s keep looking at the chart. The low was 14.4 percent, just before the financial crisis. Makes some sense, I’m sure a lot of people lost health insurance then. At the start of the Obama Administration, the rate was 15.6 percent; the peak was 18 percent — in roughly the third quarter of last year. Remember that, when people were objecting because they’d had their insurance canceled? Harry Reid said all those people were lying, but Gallup says different. In fact, 1 percentage point on this chart is, roughly, 3 million people. The change from Q1 to Q3 was about 2 percent — or roughly 6 million people who became uninsured.

    Where have I heard that number before?

    And now for the punchline: Since Obama was inaugurated in 20082009, the net change is from 15.4 percent uninsured to 15.6 percent. So the net effect has been that by the Gallup Survey the number of uninsured has improved in the last year, but gotten worse since Obama was inaugurated, and is 1.2 percent worse than under Bush.






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    The investment bank’s April survey of 148 brokers found that this quarter, the average premium increase for customers renewing an insurance plan is 12 percent in the small group market and 11 percent in the individual market, according to Forbes’ Scott Gottlieb.

    The hikes — the largest in the past three years, according to Morgan Stanley’s quarterly reports — are “largely due to changes under the [Affordable Care Act],” analysts concluded. Rates have been growing increasingly fast throughout all of 2013, after a period of drops in 2012.

    While insurers were hiking premiums since 2012 by smaller amounts, the lead-up to the Obamacare’s launch has seen the average rate at which premiums are growing fourfold

    US sees sharpest health insurance premium increases | The Daily Caller
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    Quote Originally Posted by TigersSlappy View Post
    The competing claims are kind of amazing.....









    The PJ Tatler » Gallup: Uninsured Rate Up Since Obama Elected
    so in 2008, it was really bad, so these numbers are fudged.


    So - we shoudl go back to those who gave us 2008.

    Two very compelling arguments.


    And, this was a Rand survey, not Gallup

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    Quote Originally Posted by pfife View Post
    And, this was a Rand survey, not Gallup
    Which one is skewed?
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    Quote Originally Posted by TigersSlappy View Post
    Which one is skewed?
    I don't know.

    They measure somewhat different things though.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TigersSlappy View Post
    Which one is skewed?
    Gallup is not the org they used to be. Between them and Rand my money is on Rand.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pfife View Post
    I don't know.

    They measure somewhat different things though.
    Yes they do and one or the other is very misleading. They both could be accurate, 9.3 million more could have health insurance while the percentage uninsured remained at '09 levels. I didn't do that math but I don't think we've had enough population growth for that to be true though.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gehringer_2 View Post
    Gallup is not the org they used to be. Between them and Rand my money is on Rand.
    Another tidbit from the same Rand study....

    RAND study: By our estimate, 3.9 million people signed up for ObamaCare, not 7.1 million like the White House says
    This also shows the breakdown of the 9.3 million figure, Couga's statement above must have assumed all 9.3 million were on Obamacare/Medicaid since he talked about Republicans running on taking it away, that's incorrect.

    RAND study: By our estimate, 3.9 million people signed up for ObamaCare, not 7.1 million like the White House says « Hot Air
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    You should read the report, because it doesn't say what you and Hotair say. It says 3.9m were marketplace enrolled

    By our estimate, 3.9*million people are now covered through
    the state and federal marketplaces. This number is lower than current estimates of marketplace enrollment through
    the end of March from the Department of Health and
    Human Services (DHHS), perhaps because some of the
    HROS data were collected in early March. All HROS data
    collection reported here ended on March 28, and therefore
    missed the last three days of the open enrollment period,
    during which time there was a surge in enrollment.


    I guess that's what I get for looking at the original report and not some RW hack at it from HotAir. When I do so, I get.... WHAT THE REPORT ACTUALLY SAYS. The quote HotAir attributes to RAND shows up nowhere in RAND's report. Shocking.
    Last edited by pfife; 04-09-2014 at 08:07 AM.

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    These are the numbers that I saw. (On SNL)

    It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. -Carl Sagan http://th07.deviantart.net/fs70/PRE/...yx-d41sg12.png

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