Game 5: Pistons Vs Raptors - 11/4/09

**DTroppens** · 11-04-2009, 09:12 PM

Hey folks,
Suddenly we have a game.

89-86 with 8:32 left.

**DTroppens** · 11-04-2009, 09:13 PM

BYNUMMMMMM

TREEYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!

Pistons down by one

BYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUMM MMMMMMMMM

Drive layin

91-90 Pistons!

**ScrubBeaterUpper** · 11-04-2009, 09:14 PM

Now Bosh gets a star call.

Daye with an awesome block on Hedo. Impressed that we came all the way back from a 17 point deficit

**DrWho17** · 11-04-2009, 09:14 PM

They took the lead, amazing.

**mtk1210** · 11-04-2009, 09:16 PM

Will Bynum = Joy to watch right now.

**DTroppens** · 11-04-2009, 09:16 PM

I was driving home from Stockbridge during the first half. That second quarter was just awful to listen to. I got home right at the start of the third quarter.

I think I'm glad I misssed it.

Bynum is having a stud-like run right now. Makes a drive for another tie

93-93

Bosch gives Toronto the lead back.

**DTroppens** · 11-04-2009, 09:18 PM

Originally Posted by mtk1210

Will Bynum = Joy to watch right now.

When he's playing like this, he's a ton of fun to watch. Then again, who isn't fun to watch play like this when they are playing like this.

**Buddha** · 11-04-2009, 09:19 PM

Whatever the result, this is a great effort. The second half of a back-to-back without 2/5 of your starting lineup. Good game from the Stones.

**Johnny Mac** · 11-04-2009, 09:19 PM

Bynum has more pts and more assists than Stuckey in less minutes and less shot attempts.

**DTroppens** · 11-04-2009, 09:20 PM

When Rip comes back, they need to find a way to get Ben Gordon the minutes he's getting now then as well.

The guy is too talented to be stuck with super sub minutes.

**drownwithyou** · 11-04-2009, 09:20 PM

I think the stream stopped working for me when the Raptors were at the peak of their lead. I wasn't too bummed. But I've been watching the boxscore refresh... I wish I were watching!

**Hart** · 11-04-2009, 09:21 PM

Originally Posted by DTroppens

When Rip comes back, they need to find a way to get Ben Gordon the minutes he's getting now then as well.

The guy is too talented to be stuck with super sub minutes.

I agree. Gordon is actually our best player, along with Ben, from what i have seen. Hamilton might as well start getting used to playing the three.

Daye is really having a tough time on defense right now.

**Buddha** · 11-04-2009, 09:22 PM

Ok, well, the refs have decided who is going to win this game. nice try Pistons, but they're not talented enough to overcome those kind of hometown calls.

**DTroppens** · 11-04-2009, 09:22 PM

Originally Posted by Buddha

Whatever the result, this is a great effort. The second half of a back-to-back without 2/5 of your starting lineup. Good game from the Stones.

Good heart coming back. But I'd like to actually see what happened in that second quarter that allowed this to be a comeback attempt. When you play no defense for an entire quarter, it's hard to give them the ol' good game label in a loss. I'll have to watch the replay and see what the heck happened that second quarter.

**Buddha** · 11-04-2009, 09:23 PM

Did they just call that a jump ball? Ridiculous.

**Hart** · 11-04-2009, 09:23 PM

Our best lineup is going to include Bynum, Gordon, and Rip when he comes back. We need that extra jump shooter/scorer on the wing to take some pressure off.

**mtk1210** · 11-04-2009, 09:23 PM

Daye is really having a tough time on defense right now.

Watching the game, I was thinking "welcome to the nba rook"

But, I at least see some game there. Mine as well let him get his bumps this year.

**DTroppens** · 11-04-2009, 09:24 PM

Originally Posted by Hart

I agree. Gordon is actually our best player, along with Ben, from what i have seen.

It's not even close either. Gordon is clearly the most talented player on this team. You can't keep him to 25-30 minutes for no real good reason.

**drownwithyou** · 11-04-2009, 09:24 PM

Originally Posted by DTroppens

Good heart coming back. But I'd like to actually see what happened in that second quarter that allowed this to be a comeback attempt. When you play no defense for an entire quarter, it's hard to give them the ol' good game label in a loss. I'll have to watch the replay and see what the heck happened that second quarter.

Their bench really outplayed our bench in the second.

**ScrubBeaterUpper** · 11-04-2009, 09:26 PM

Originally Posted by DTroppens

Good heart coming back. But I'd like to actually see what happened in that second quarter that allowed this to be a comeback attempt. When you play no defense for an entire quarter, it's hard to give them the ol' good game label in a loss. I'll have to watch the replay and see what the heck happened that second quarter.

Penetration led to open outside shots, and they did not miss hardly any.

**ScrubBeaterUpper** · 11-04-2009, 09:27 PM

Bargnani = breakout year

**ScrubBeaterUpper** · 11-04-2009, 09:29 PM

There is no way that Toronto should have twice as many FT attempts as us. We have been attacking all game.

**DTroppens** · 11-04-2009, 09:29 PM

104-95 and toronto with the ball. A few nails are in the coffin right now.

Need something big the next two possessions.

**Johnny Mac** · 11-04-2009, 09:30 PM

It would be nice if Stuckey could cut down on his bad shots

5-18 (27%) tonight with 5 of his shots blocked
7-20 (35%) last night
6-19 (31.6%) against Milwaukee
4-15 (26%) against Oklahoma City

**DTroppens** · 11-04-2009, 09:30 PM

If that last possession didn't show how little Stuckey is a PG, I don't know what will do it.

**DTroppens** · 11-04-2009, 09:34 PM

Billups was Mr. BigShot for his shooting in clutch situations.

Stuckey can be Mr. StuffedShot.

**Buddha** · 11-04-2009, 09:47 PM

What did we really expect from tonight? Given the circumstances I thought they did well. certainly better than I expected.

that being said, Charlie V is going to have to get tougher on defense. And I like the fact that Kuester is pulling him when he's being lazy on d.

**Hart** · 11-04-2009, 10:12 PM

Originally Posted by Johnny Mac

It would be nice if Stuckey could cut down on his bad shots

5-18 (27%) tonight with 5 of his shots blocked
7-20 (35%) last night
6-19 (31.6%) against Milwaukee
4-15 (26%) against Oklahoma City

I said after the Oklahoma City game that I will continue to defend Stuckey and give him more time. It is not that I think he is our point guard of the future but I have always thought he gets a raw deal on this board and way too much of the blame, given the Pistons personnel. What I am really watching every game is the shooting percentages and now the second halfs as well. He is really struggling on both accounts.

The shooting percentages have not improved and the last two games Bynum has played very well. I think it is time to make a change in the starting lineup. While Stuckey has improved his jump shot, he still has some of the worst misses you will ever see from a guard. And he struggles with his decision making when other team revs up it's defense. On a positive note, he has really stepped up his rebounding lately and that is something the Pistons need being undersized down low.

**Deleterious** · 11-04-2009, 10:22 PM

Hart doesn't want to admit I am right

All kidding aside, nobody is harder on Stuckey than me, and even I know you have to give him more time. Talk to me after Christmas or around the all star game and lets see where he is then. If he isn't improving, I would move him by the trade deadline so he doesn't lose all of his trade value like Amir did.

**Hart** · 11-04-2009, 10:29 PM

Originally Posted by Deleterious

Hart doesn't want to admit I am right

All kidding aside, nobody is harder on Stuckey than me, and even I know you have to give him more time. Talk to me after Christmas or around the all star game and lets see where he is then. If he isn't improving, I would move him by the trade deadline so he doesn't lose all of his trade value like Amir did.

For the record, I do believe you are right about him. But I do have this uneasy feeling inside that something is going to click for him in year 4 or 5 right after we give up on him.

**Deleterious** · 11-04-2009, 10:30 PM

I was just giving you a hard time. Didn't mean anything by it.

**Deleterious** · 11-04-2009, 10:34 PM

Stuckey Vs Billups in their first 2 years. Stuckey has better numbers.

Player Comparison Finder | Basketball-Reference.com

**Hart** · 11-04-2009, 10:44 PM

Originally Posted by Deleterious

Stuckey Vs Billups in their first 2 years. Stuckey has better numbers.

Player Comparison Finder | Basketball-Reference.com

Good link. The biggest difference is that Billups was always somebody who could shoot the three. Stuckey's worked a lot on his jump shot but it is almost all upper body and very little legs. Not a good formula. Unless he totally overhauls his jumper, I just don't ever see him being much of a shooter.

**Johnny Mac** · 11-04-2009, 10:55 PM

Originally Posted by Deleterious

Stuckey Vs Billups in their first 2 years. Stuckey has better numbers.

Player Comparison Finder | Basketball-Reference.com

Well because of injuries, the stats are more wieghted towards Stuckeys second season v. Billups rookie season. But man, I didnt realize Billups struggled so much with his shooting. Actually tho, almost half of billups shots his first two years were 3 pointers, Stuckey drives the hole and has a ton of layup attempts, so comparing their shooting percentage is kind of apples to oranges.

**Hart** · 11-04-2009, 11:03 PM

Originally Posted by Johnny Mac

Well because of injuries, the stats are more wieghted towards Stuckeys second season v. Billups rookie season. But man, I didnt realize Billups struggled so much with his shooting. Actually tho, almost half of billups shots his first two years were 3 pointers, Stuckey drives the hole and has a ton of layup attempts, so comparing their shooting percentage is kind of apples to oranges.

The one thing you can say though is that Billups always had a lot of confidence in his jump shot based on the number of three's he took. The same can't be said for Stuckey.

**Deleterious** · 11-04-2009, 11:03 PM

Originally Posted by Johnny Mac

Well because of injuries, the stats are more wieghted towards Stuckeys second season v. Billups rookie season. But man, I didnt realize Billups struggled so much with his shooting. Actually tho, almost half of billups shots his first two years were 3 pointers, Stuckey drives the hole and has a ton of layup attempts, so comparing their shooting percentage is kind of apples to oranges.

Well, look at the advanced tab. TS% and eFG% will fix that and Billups is a bit ahead in both.

But honestly, the assists and turnovers was really the two I was looking at.

**Johnny Mac** · 11-04-2009, 11:06 PM

Originally Posted by Deleterious

Well, look at the advanced tab. TS% and eFG% will fix that and Billups is a bit ahead in both.

But honestly, the assists and turnovers was really the two I was looking at.

Yea, those were close, dont mind my comment, I was just kind of babbling to myself about shooting percentage because that is what has me down on Stuckey right now.

I think a lot had written Billups off as a bust early in his career, career turnarounds like that are usually the exception. Hope we can get a similar turnaround from Stuckey.

**Truth** · 11-05-2009, 12:37 AM

Originally Posted by DTroppens

It's not even close either. Gordon is clearly the most talented player on this team. You can't keep him to 25-30 minutes for no real good reason.

It will be interesting to see how this shakes out. I know friends from Chicago filled my head with a list of all of his weaknesses in terms of involving others or trying to run an offense around his game. I don't think I've seen enough games yet to know if there is any truth to that and if it's even fair when he's playing along side Stuckey.

**Johnny Mac** · 11-05-2009, 01:41 AM

Originally Posted by Truth

It will be interesting to see how this shakes out. I know friends from Chicago filled my head with a list of all of his weaknesses in terms of involving others or trying to run an offense around his game. I don't think I've seen enough games yet to know if there is any truth to that and if it's even fair when he's playing along side Stuckey.

Not sure about the Chicago fans you know, but the ones I know are quick to jump all over someone. I remember last year one I knew wanted to re-sign Gordon, then when it didnt happen Gordon was a bum. Kyle Orton was going to be a pretty good QB, now even though he is doing real well in Denver, my friends are waiting on the "real Kyle Orton to start losing games by himself". It goes the other way as well, Hossa is a bum and now he was a great offseason addition.

I heard all that stuff about Gordon too, but I took it with a grain of salt.

**DaBishop** · 11-05-2009, 09:37 AM

maybe we can get LB to come teach Stuckey how to be the new and improved Billups?

The Ben's are making Joe look very good. I think Charlie V will come around as well. The question will be can Rip and Prince be moved for Bosh/Amar'e or at the very least for a Joe Johnson/Rudy Gay/upgrade at SF. Do you think we could move anyone for Danny Granger?