11/15/09. Lions @ Vikings. 1:05 PM, FOX. Week 10.

[Buddha]

Originally Posted by Stormin' Norman

Took the words right out of my mouth.

You agree with this:

I don't see him as an elite receiver in this league as he currently stands,

Really?

[Hongbit]

Originally Posted by DukeCityRadical

4) This team really did play hard yesterday. Had we played as well in the previous two games as we did yesterday, I believe we would have won them.

I know I've said this before but playing hard for 30 or 45 minutes isn't playing hard.

This has been a constant with this team the entire season. The incredible lack of talent especially on the defensive side makes it nearly impossible to put together anywhere close to a full 60 minutes of competitve, professional quality football. Nearly every game they go through a stretch where one of the three phases looks lost and unable to complete even the most basic tasks.

Maybe this is better for another thread somewhere but many of the offseason veteran acquisitions have failed miserably and these poor decisions from the summer are really coming back to bite now. They are getting almost nothing from Buchanan, Henry, Northcutt, Bryant Johnson, Loper, King, and Grady Jackson among others.

[jonjd]

Originally Posted by drownwithyou

I think this would be a crappy way for him to approach football, and a crappy way to view his situation. But we obviously don't see eye to eye on this issue.

We definitely do not. When the guaranteed paycheck kicks in, I care slightly about the team's performance and more about where me and my close friends are going to spend the off-season. Why wouldn't I? If the dumb fans are willing to come, the dumb owner willing to spend, and the rules being the way they are, then I'd be happy.

Manipulation is key. That amount of dough when I'm a fair looking 21 year old kid is like cocaine to a young Bobby Brown. My life is complete and I will be happy as will my family and friends.

Again: this all derives from my original reply to the statement of whether or not I should feel bad for Matt Stafford. No way in hell. His own life and his family are set for life. Not specifically because of a lavish lifestyle, but because nobody in that family needs to work ever. That is my goal. I would love to come across that kind of money and call the parents and tell them to start researching amazing properties in the locations that they desire. Is that so bad? My man Yoda had to chime in and state that I assumed otherwise and that he'll live happily on his contract alone. That's not what I meant totally. But in these economic times, it must be nice to know that you are set for life!

Again: Imagine not having to WORK ever again. That's why Matt Stafford has it good.

[cruzer1]

Originally Posted by Hongbit

I know I've said this before but playing hard for 30 or 45 minutes isn't playing hard.

This has been a constant with this team the entire season. The incredible lack of talent especially on the defensive side makes it nearly impossible to put together anywhere close to a full 60 minutes of competitve, professional quality football. Nearly every game they go through a stretch where one of the three phases looks lost and unable to complete even the most basic tasks.

Maybe this is better for another thread somewhere but many of the offseason veteran acquisitions have failed miserably and these poor decisions from the summer are really coming back to bite now. They are getting almost nothing from Buchanan, Henry, Northcutt, Bryant Johnson, Loper, King, and Grady Jackson among others.

They weren't given more than a few years on their contracts, so it won't kill them long term. That said, they need to do better, but I'd rather they build throught the draft and do it right, rather than overpay for fringe guys to plug holes. It can't be fixed overnight.

[Mr. Bigglesworth]

Originally Posted by jonjd

We definitely do not. When the guaranteed paycheck kicks in, I care slightly about the team's performance and more about where me and my close friends are going to spend the off-season. Why wouldn't I? If the dumb fans are willing to come, the dumb owner willing to spend, and the rules being the way they are, then I'd be happy.

Manipulation is key. That amount of dough when I'm a fair looking 21 year old kid is like cocaine to a young Bobby Brown. My life is complete and I will be happy as will my family and friends.

Again: this all derives from my original reply to the statement of whether or not I should feel bad for Matt Stafford. No way in hell. His own life and his family are set for life. Not specifically because of a lavish lifestyle, but because nobody in that family needs to work ever. That is my goal. I would love to come across that kind of money and call the parents and tell them to start researching amazing properties in the locations that they desire. Is that so bad? My man Yoda had to chime in and state that I assumed otherwise and that he'll live happily on his contract alone. That's not what I meant totally. But in these economic times, it must be nice to know that you are set for life!

Again: Imagine not having to WORK ever again. That's why Matt Stafford has it good.

Wow. I disagree with many of the premises presented here on many levels.

I guess the only one I am really going to pick on is the presumption that the only motivatation for a young player is money, and if that is guaranteed, then the player cares little about the team's performance.

Honest question: Have you ever played a competitive sport for an extended period of time?

I can't claim to be a good athlete (I am not, never was), but my time around good/successful athletes while playing competitive sports suggest, as a group, they highly competitive and are quite driven to do the best they can. That is a big part of how they get to be so good as to command silly amounts of money in salary. I don't think that drive goes away once the money is received, nor do I think it often the primary (or even a major) motivating factor to become good in the first place.

[BigBoiKzoo]

Originally Posted by DukeCityRadical

My thoughts, for what they're worth:

3) I like Kevin Smith. Not the fastest, not the quickest, not the strongest, but he hits holes with more determination than any running back we've had since Barry, and Barry can't be judged on this standard as he made his own holes. I think we're actually okay at the rb position this year, but we have too many issues on oline and defense for us to make use of a position of relative strength.

I came into this year pretty high on Smith. The more I watch him though, the more I don't like him long term. Why? He doesn't have the ability to break tackles, move piles, or make people miss. The first person that gets near him, makes the tackle. He's OK, but you look at a lot of the middle of the road or higher RB's, they can do any of those things.

[Mr. Bigglesworth]

Originally Posted by BigBoiKzoo

I came into this year pretty high on Smith. The more I watch him though, the more I don't like him long term. Why? He doesn't have the ability to break tackles, move piles, or make people miss. The first person that gets near him, makes the tackle. He's OK, but you look at a lot of the middle of the road or higher RB's, they can do any of those things.

I pretty much agree with all of this.

I think Smith is C or C- running back.

I want to upgrade RB, but it simply isn't as glaring a need as so many other positions.

[cruzer1]

Smith doesn't need to be replaced, he does need help. They need either a speed guy, or a big guy who can move piles. I do believe they would have drafted Beanie if he fell.

[DTroppens]

Originally Posted by cruzer1

Smith doesn't need to be replaced, he does need help. They need either a speed guy, or a big guy who can move piles. I do believe they would have drafted Beanie if he fell.

This is kind of how I think. Smith will do for another year or maybe two until we get other ills improved upon. I don't want to be using valuable resources trying to find a RB right now. He's certainly not the cream of the NFL, but I think he's serviceable right now as this team works on trying to strengthen other areas.

All that said, when he gets tripped by a couple pinkies next week, it'll drive me nuts once again.

[Stormin' Norman]

Originally Posted by Buddha

You agree with this:

Really?

This season (or as he currently stands) he has not played like an elite receiver. He has the potential to be an all time great with his ungodly raw physical tools - but he has been inconsistent this year.

[BigBoiKzoo]

Originally Posted by cruzer1

Smith doesn't need to be replaced, he does need help. They need either a speed guy, or a big guy who can move piles. I do believe they would have drafted Beanie if he fell.

I agree. I wouldn't want to spend any draft pick on a running back this year unless someone rated pretty high falls to us in rounds 5-7. Falls along the BPA mantra.

I'll add onto the Graham hype. Every game I see him play, I see a guy with a motor that doesn't stop. Most of the penalties he's gotten for hitting QB's have been BS to me. I'll freely admit I haven't seen a lot of the DE's, but it's hard to say anything bad about him.

[DukeCityRadical]

Originally Posted by Stormin' Norman

This season (or as he currently stands) he has not played like an elite receiver. He has the potential to be an all time great with his ungodly raw physical tools - but he has been inconsistent this year.

This is all I was saying, really. There is no limit to how good Calvin can be, but I'm talking about what I have seen from him this year, on the field, nothing more. I would not put his performance this year within the top, say, 10 at his position, so I would not consider him elite at this moment.

[Buddha]

Originally Posted by Stormin' Norman

This season (or as he currently stands) he has not played like an elite receiver. He has the potential to be an all time great with his ungodly raw physical tools - but he has been inconsistent this year.

I agree, although I have a hard time seeing him as an all-time great.

I think CJ may ultimately disappoint us in that he turns out to be very good, but flawed and not great.