Sanchez a Tiger 5 yrs 80M

[DTroppens]

Great move. I don't think he'll end up being overpaid at all.

I hope you are right. I'm in the camp that he's going to prove this is way too much to be spending on him. I hope I'm proven wrong, obviously.

[tiger337]

I don't think this is an overpay. It won't be if he keeps pitching the way he has the last few years. Pitchers are always a risk, but he is no more of a risk than Scherzer and Fister and his performance over the last three years has been just as good. There is always the concern about what happens once Mike Ilitch's influence is gone. Will they be able to keep everybody? I don't know, but they are in great shape the next couple of years.

[Tim Mitchell]

Cubs fans bitching about that dirty Sanchez. Your move now Texas and LAA.....we have the best rotation and a murderous top five in our line up. Never thought I'd see the Yankees and BosSox become so...irrelevant.

Jackson
Hunter
Miggy
Prince
Victor

Verlander
Mad Max
Mister Fister
Anibal
Porcello/Smyly

Is this heaven?

[DTroppens]

The more I'm reading up, maybe this really is a good deal. Based on his numbers, the Tigers got themselves a sub-3.00 ERA guy who is going to pitch close to 200 innings in 30-something starts. That's what he's done for four straight seasons anyway. Those type of guys aren't a dime-a-dozen. Maybe he is worth it.

[apabruce]

I love that the Tigers signed two major free agents without giving up a draft choice.

[Tim Mitchell]

I love that the Tigers signed two major free agents without giving up a draft choice.

Is this Heaven? No It's Iowa - YouTube

[Sports_Freak]

Jackson
Hunter
Miggy
Prince
Victor

Verlander
Mad Max
Mister Fister
Anibal
Porcello/Smyly

Is this heaven?

Not quite yet. Having a great starting rotation is great, but we need to make sure we can hold leads from the 7th inning on.
I think our biggest weakness at this point is, in no order, our BP, IF defense and our lack of team speed.

Not much we can do about the defense, other than replace Peralta. And not much we can do about the #3 thru #5 hitters lack of speed, other than hit the ball so far the players can just jog around the bases.

[alwaysthrowheat]

His deal looks like a steal in comparison to what Greinke got. And his production is not far off.

McCarthy, Lohse, Edwin, and Dempster's deals are going to be a steal compared to what Anibal got.

[alwaysthrowheat]

The problem I have with this move is that it sets a precedent for Max and Fister to point to and both say they're better than Anibal. Can't pay 3 pitchers 15+MM plus paying JV 25+.

[socaltiger]

Why not ?

[TigerNation]

I am sure DD is thinking ahead to make room for JV, but the money he will get is going to be staggering....I am not sure if we are going to be able to afford him.

Not sure what their current payroll is at, but the Tigers will easily be able to support a payroll in the neighborhood of 180 million when the new TV money kicks in starting in 2014.

I'm not the least bit concerned about their ability to lock up both JV and Cabrera.

[TigerNation]

The problem I have with this move is that it sets a precedent for Max and Fister to point to and both say they're better than Anibal. Can't pay 3 pitchers 15+MM plus paying JV 25+.

Sanchez will only have 2 years left on his contract by the time Fister is a FA right?

If that's right, and Sanchez performs over the next three years as he has the last three, then they'll easily be able to trade him and get a good return.

[tiger337]

Not sure what their current payroll is at, but the Tigers will easily be able to support a payroll in the neighborhood of 180 million when the new TV money kicks in starting in 2014.

I'm not the least bit concerned about their ability to lock up both JV and Cabrera.

Other teams have good TV deals too and they choose not to have such big payrolls. I'm confident the Tigers will be OK as long as Mike Ilitch is alive. After that, who knows that the mindset of ownership will be. I will worry about that when the time comes I guess.

[irvink]

I love that the Tigers signed two major free agents without giving up a draft choice.

Very happy about this too. I also think it probably eliminates a nagging concern I have had... That Boras would talk Illitch into Soriano. Really can't see that happening now, not even on a one year deal.

Will be nice to have 2 picks in the top 37 or so this year.

Also, this makes it more likely we hold onto our best prospects, unless an opportunity arises for a young SS, and in which case, I would not mind a trade.

Don't know the Pitt or SD systems very well. Do they have a MI to spare?

JIM BOWDEN ‏@JimBowdenESPNxm
Pirates and Padres are amongst the teams interested in Rick Porcello who becomes available after the Tigers resigned Anibal Sanchez to 5yrdl

[alwaysthrowheat]

Why not ?

Because that's not how teams are built. Can't pay everybody. That'd be 120MM to 6 players.

[Walt]

McCarthy, Lohse, Edwin, and Dempster's deals are going to be a steal compared to what Anibal got.

Sure...

[tiger337]

This might be the best pitching rotation we'll ever see in Detroit.

It will be hard to top the staffs of the late 1940s - primarily Newhouser, Trout, Trucks, Hutchinson. Lots of things can go wrong with pitchers, but this group is capable of doing it.

[alwaysthrowheat]

Sure...

ERA+ and OPS against in 2012

McCarthy- 123 and .706
Lohse- 134 and .642
Edwin- 98 and .719
Dempster- 124 and .677
Sanchez- 105 and .716

Sanchez is going to get easily the longest commitment in terms of years, the most total value, and most money per year. Sure, these are only two measures, but I don't think he's that much better than any of these 4 names, nor Shaun Marcum. I worry about paying 17MM to someone barely above average his entire career.

[Yoda]

The problem I have with this move is that it sets a precedent for Max and Fister to point to and both say they're better than Anibal. Can't pay 3 pitchers 15+MM plus paying JV 25+.

I'm not sure either can say they're better than him. The next couple years will tell everything.

[Scottwood]

I wrote this awhile back, but I'll add it here, as well. Sanchez gained an entire MPH on his fastball in his time with the Tigers compared to with the Marlins. They also changed his pitch usage, dropping his usage of the fastball by about 7% and upping the usage of his slider and curveball. It's also striking how much better a pitcher he has become the last 2 years compared to earlier in his career. He used to struggle with walks and now he's turned himself into one of the better strike throwers in the league, while maintaining his K% and GB%.

I think it will be very interesting the next few years to watch how the careers of Fister, Scherzer and Sanchez develop. Given how much they changed with Sanchez's pitch usage and upped his fastball in the brief time that Jeff Jones worked with him; they might have placed a higher value on Sanchez than other execs did around the league b/c they think that his success in his stay with the Tigers was just the beginning due to some of the changes and improvements they saw in him after working with their pitching coaches.

[Walt]

ERA+ and OPS against in 2012

McCarthy- 123 and .706
Lohse- 134 and .642
Edwin- 98 and .719
Dempster- 124 and .677
Sanchez- 105 and .716

Sanchez is going to get easily the longest commitment in terms of years, the most total value, and most money per year. Sure, these are only two measures, but I don't think he's that much better than any of these 4 names, nor Shaun Marcum. I worry about paying 17MM to someone barely above average his entire career.

Take a look at FIP or WAR. Sanchez has had (and still has) some bad infield defenses behind him. Addressing the guys above him in ERA+, McCarthy is a significant injury risk, and got a lesser contract because of it. I am not sold on Lohse. Dempster has been about a 3 win player the last 3 years in the NL central, and will be playing in the AL east. Sanchez has been a 4 win player over that timeframe, and does not make significantly more annually. There is a chance that one of these contracts will be better, but at this point, it is far from the foregone conclusion you are making it out to be. I don't think we got a great deal, but it isn't a horrendous deal either. I think that it is the kind of deal that a contending ballclub makes.

[john doe]

Take a look at FIP or WAR. Sanchez has had (and still has) some bad infield defenses behind him. Addressing the guys above him in ERA+, McCarthy is a significant injury risk, and got a lesser contract because of it. I am not sold on Lohse. Dempster has been about a 3 win player the last 3 years in the NL central, and will be playing in the AL east. Sanchez has been a 4 win player over that timeframe, and does not make significantly more annually. There is a chance that one of these contracts will be better, but at this point, it is far from the foregone conclusion you are making it out to be. I don't think we got a great deal, but it isn't a horrendous deal either. I think that it is the kind of deal that a contending ballclub makes.

....and, the significant age difference between Sanchez and Dempster. Dempster will be 36 early in the 2012 season, Sanchez?....Still in his 20's.

[TigerNation]

Other teams have good TV deals too and they choose not to have such big payrolls. I'm confident the Tigers will be OK as long as Mike Ilitch is alive. After that, who knows that the mindset of ownership will be. I will worry about that when the time comes I guess.

True.

My point was mostly that this contract won't prevent them from doing so, that they'll have the financial capabilities to do so if they chose to.

If they don't lock them up, it won't be because of this contract preventing them having the flexibility to do so.

[sabretooth]

I think it's a tad pricey and a little too long for my tastes, but he's a good pitcher and we needed someone like him, so it's a good deal overall.

[Yoda]

Before 2006, there was about a 15 year period where Sanchez would have been their best starter. My how things have changed.

[Sven Draconian]

I'm really amazed at some of the negativity regarding this signing. Watching Clubhouse confidential the "going rate" is about 5 million per WAR. Putting Sanchez right on the nose. He's about a 3 WAR player, he'll get 15 million per.

When you compare this signing to the other big signings off the off-season (Hamilton, Greinke) it's a relative steal. Looking just at the peripherals he's almost a match for Greinke, a few less strikeouts, but almost identical. Based on WAR they are nearly identical. However, Anibal is going to cost, on average, 10 million less per season, for one fewer season and without the player-based perks (Greinke being able to opt out if traded in the first year, Greinke being able to opt out after 2015).

The Hamilton contract might go down as one of the worst contracts in baseball history. This will be his age 32 season and he posted a pair of 3.5 WAR seasons playing the in hitter-haven of Arlington. The Angels may very well be paying 25 million dollars per season to a 2 WAR player..... this season. Let alone what happens when him and Pujols both need to shift to DH.

Sanchez is heading into his age 29 season. According to the Bill James arc pitchers tend to peak at the age 30 season (Batters at 27). It can be reasonably expected (though, not a gurantee) that his next 3 or 4 seasons will be the best of his career. This is in sharp contrast to the typical FA signing where players are hitting their decline (Ie, Pujols, Hamilton, CJ Wilson).

Obviously there are always exception (Re: Crawford, Carl), but as far as FA signing this counts as a pretty good one.

[will the thrill]

this signing, the Hamilton signing and the Greinke signing make me look forward in amazement at what Verlander will get if he has 2 more seasons like the last 2. 4 straight seasons of 7.5+ war and the bidding would start at 35per

[RandyMarsh]

My head hurts after hearing MLB Tonight's analysis of the signing. One of the reasons they knocked it is because he is a "Number 4 starter" for us, another reason is because his w-l record, Bowa said some guys know how to win the 9-8 games and Sanchez apparently isn't one of them. Ridiculous

[will the thrill]

My head hurts after hearing MLB Tonight's analysis of the signing. One of the reasons they knocked it is because he is a "Number 4 starter" for us, another reason is because his w-l record, Bowa said some guys know how to win the 9-8 games and Sanchez apparently isn't one of them. Ridiculous

I'm glad I'm downsizing my cable next week when Homeland ends, I can't deal with all the ex players on MLB network. There analysis is 99% horrible. Harold Reynolds on the whole Josh Hamilton thing talking about how great the guy is because he bounced back at the end of the year after struggling. It's like they don't even use stats at MLB network, they just base it on 30 year old thinking about how this guy hit 43 homeruns so he must be awesome

[MC24]

My head hurts after hearing MLB Tonight's analysis of the signing. One of the reasons they knocked it is because he is a "Number 4 starter" for us, another reason is because his w-l record, Bowa said some guys know how to win the 9-8 games and Sanchez apparently isn't one of them. Ridiculous

I thought people stopped using W/L to evaluate a pitcher but apparently not.

[JimPriceFan]

Ok, I'm happy but what about our ****** bullpen. Closer, setup man etc... I don't trust Benoit and obviously Valverde is gone.

[Yoda]

Benoit will be just fine.

[Biff Mayhem]

Benoit will be just fine.

Of not, Rondon will be

[tiger337]

My head hurts after hearing MLB Tonight's analysis of the signing. One of the reasons they knocked it is because he is a "Number 4 starter" for us, another reason is because his w-l record, Bowa said some guys know how to win the 9-8 games and Sanchez apparently isn't one of them. Ridiculous

Crap, now they have two pitchers who don't know how to win games.

[TheCouga]

Ok, I'm happy but what about our ****** bullpen. Closer, setup man etc... I don't trust Benoit and obviously Valverde is gone.

I happen to think our bullpen is poised to be as good as it has been in a long time. For once, we actually have depth there.

I could care less about overpaying for an over the hill, veteran closer. I'd rather just go closer by committee. Coke/Dotel/Benoit/Rondon will be able to handle those duties as a group just fine. Then you have Villareal, Alberquerque, and possibly Smyly/Below as 6th starters/swingmen. You have Marte, Downs, and Putkonen as depth. I'd be perfectly fine starting the season without a single bullpen move.

[RandyMarsh]

Crap, now they have two pitchers who don't know how to win games.

Yep, were screwed. But as bad as Bowa's analysis was of that signing I think the fact that he suggested that the Rangers should trade Mike Olt for Alfonso Soriano may have been even worse.

[Sven Draconian]

This brings up a ton of interesting opportunities if we deal Porcello.

We can either get a starting caliber LF, moving Dirks to the bench and having at least one quality bench player.
We can get a starting caliber SS and then deal Peralta for ???
Package Porcello and Peralta and get a SS/LF back and sign Drew?
Make a deal to actually get a few prospects in order to restock and cut payroll a bit?

I imagine that Porcello has pretty good value. Regardless of how he is perceived in Detroit, he has stuck in the majors for 4 seasons, has consistently improving peripherals and pitched in the tougher league. I'm not even sold that getting rid of him is our best move, but I can understand it from a financial standpoint and the fact we have Drew Smyly ready and waiting. At some point you need to deal from a position of strength in order to secure a weakness.

[Dawgs]

Something like Porcello and Peralta for Andrus would interest me but otherwise Im keeping Rick as my #5, at least until the trade deadline when maybe his value is higher and I have 5 healthy starters going with the addition of Smyly.

[darko31]

Before 2006, there was about a 15 year period where Sanchez would have been their best starter. My how things have changed.

Who was the LHP who was great when he played but always injured? Justin Thompson I think? Man, that guy was everything you needed to know about the 91-05 Tigers.

[Longgone]

ERA+ and OPS against in 2012

McCarthy- 123 and .706
Lohse- 134 and .642
Edwin- 98 and .719
Dempster- 124 and .677
Sanchez- 105 and .716

Sanchez is going to get easily the longest commitment in terms of years, the most total value, and most money per year. Sure, these are only two measures, but I don't think he's that much better than any of these 4 names, nor Shaun Marcum. I worry about paying 1
7MM to someone barely above average his entire career.

If he stays healthy it will be fine. A couple of million more or less per year won't make or break anything. The risk with any pitcher is that they'll break down, and then you're paying for nothing.