2012-13 Offseason Discussion

**RatkoVarda** · 11-30-2012, 01:03 PM

Originally Posted by TigersSlappy

Brian Britten ‏@BBritten_Tigers
Tigers announce club will not tender LHP Daniel Schlereth a contract for the 2013 season. #tigers

they are dumping a lot of trash this winter. good for them.

**PuNk42AE** · 11-30-2012, 01:08 PM

MLB ‏@MLB

Source confirms to @MLB.com's @Alden_Gonzalez that @Angels on verge of acquiring RHP Tommy Hanson from Braves for RHP Jordan Walden.

Will the Angels have any pitchers from 2012 in 2013?

**PuNk42AE** · 11-30-2012, 01:09 PM

Originally Posted by RatkoVarda

Gio's Nats contract runs thru 2018

Oops I meant EJax, not Gio.

**PuNk42AE** · 11-30-2012, 01:34 PM

With Schlereth coming off the 40 man, I believe there is now 38 players, leaving 2 openings for a Rule 5 picks, which as a Contending team probably won't happen.

**STLTiger69** · 11-30-2012, 01:41 PM

Originally Posted by PuNk42AE

With Schlereth coming off the 40 man, I believe there is now 38 players, leaving 2 openings for a Rule 5 picks, which as a Contending team probably won't happen.

Possibly leaving room for free agent signings and/or trades involving players not on the 40 man going out and players that needed to be on the Tigers 40 man roster coming in...

**john doe** · 11-30-2012, 01:45 PM

Originally Posted by STLTiger69;2846199[B

]Possibly leaving room for free agent signings and/or trades involving players not on the 40 man [/B]going out and players that needed to be on the Tigers 40 man roster coming in...

This.

**Nastradamus** · 11-30-2012, 08:33 PM

Originally Posted by PuNk42AE

I don't get how that would be a big catalyst for them going after Greinke. Gio is a FA so they have a spot open, but they also have Lannan and Detwiler who could be #5. It wasn't like Meyer was going to be in the Rotation. They were looking at Upton before he signed but Span still is adding payroll to the team.

They have a hole opening up with Jackson leaving, they are supposedly non-tendering Lannan and they free up some cap space with both Jackson and Laroche coming off the books for about 21 mil. They added Span for about 6, but they've shown a propensity to spend.

**RandyMarsh** · 11-30-2012, 10:11 PM

Just read on twitter that Mark Reynolds got non tendered. I know he's not really a fit here since the 3 positions he plays(3b,1b,dh) we are set at, and I'm sure he could get a starting job for another team but if for some reason he couldn't I think we should take a look at him for a big PH bat off the bench/insurance if V-Mart doesn't come back 100% and or god forbid something happens to Miggy or Prince.

**Nastradamus** · 11-30-2012, 10:45 PM

I always liked him to some degree. HRs change games, period. However, it just won't happen here. He'll get a better, more regular job somewhere, guaranteed. I think Tampa should sign him.

**PuNk42AE** · 11-30-2012, 10:55 PM

Tampa probably has a good chance of going after him since Pena isn't signed yet.

**RandyMarsh** · 11-30-2012, 11:01 PM

Originally Posted by Nastradamus

I always liked him to some degree. HRs change games, period. However, it just won't happen here. He'll get a better, more regular job somewhere, guaranteed. I think Tampa should sign him.

Yeah I agree, I'm sure somebody will offer him a full time job, I was just saying that I think we should still atleast inquire about him even if we do appear to not be a match and have a place for him full time.

**PuNk42AE** · 11-30-2012, 11:04 PM

No reason the Tigers would get him, he'll cost about what Delmon did last year, and that was with a full time job between OF/DH.

**alwaysthrowheat** · 11-30-2012, 11:58 PM

Spots on the 40 man are not a big deal. There are a few guys who can be moved if necessary.

**pyrotigers** · 12-01-2012, 12:30 AM

The Braves are non tendering Jair Jurrjens

Trade Rick Porcello and bring him back, he's better than Verlander

**Gehringer_2** · 12-01-2012, 12:54 AM

Originally Posted by pyrotigers

The Braves are non tendering Jair Jurrjens

Trade Rick Porcello and bring him back, he's better than Verlander

Kind of interesting that JJ was kind of a poster boy for the 'velocity doesn't matter' school of pitching, but in the end he turned out to be more a demonstration that it does. Yes it may be true that not all pitchers need to to throw at the same velocity to be effective, but on the other hand it is also true that take even a relative soft tosser and deprive him of 2-4 mph of what he is used to throwing and he will be a much worse pitcher - as JJ has been since his arm troubles started.

Of course, by this logic Porcello *should* have started getting better at some point this year.......

**macedonian bengal** · 12-01-2012, 03:20 AM

Originally Posted by Gehringer_2

Kind of interesting that JJ was kind of a poster boy for the 'velocity doesn't matter' school of pitching, but in the end he turned out to be more a demonstration that it does. Yes it may be true that not all pitchers need to to throw at the same velocity to be effective, but on the other hand it is also true that take even a relative soft tosser and deprive him of 2-4 mph of what he is used to throwing and he will be a much worse pitcher - as JJ has been since his arm troubles started.

Of course, by this logic Porcello *should* have started getting better at some point this year.......

yep, once again..this is the year Frederick Porcello is supposed to have it all figured out and is due for a break out season.
Quit f'ing kidding yourselves and get on with the facts, that there is no better time than now to dump this bum for whatever we can get back for him, and move on. If i am wrong, i'll gladly eat my crow...until then.;.please trade this (edited by moderator)!??

**Just Some Dude** · 12-01-2012, 06:24 AM

The Giants non-tendered Brian Wilson. He could be worth taking a chance on if the price is right. He was pretty damn good before his 2nd TJ surgery.

**catswithbats** · 12-01-2012, 07:11 AM

Originally Posted by macedonian bengal

Quit f'ing kidding yourselves and get on with the facts, that there is no better time than now to dump this bum for whatever we can get back for him, and move on. If i am wrong, i'll gladly eat my crow...until then.;.please trade this a**hole!??

You seem a little hostile toward Porcello.

I'd be fine with the Tigers trading him, but 1.) I don't think they absolutely "need" to dump him and 2.) I don't think they need to dump him for whatever they can get. He still has value.

**Longgone** · 12-01-2012, 08:30 AM

Originally Posted by macedonian bengal

;.please trade this a**hole!??

speaking of which...

**Yoda** · 12-01-2012, 08:44 AM

Originally Posted by macedonian bengal

yep, once again..this is the year Frederick Porcello is supposed to have it all figured out and is due for a break out season.
Quit f'ing kidding yourselves and get on with the facts, that there is no better time than now to dump this bum for whatever we can get back for him, and move on. If i am wrong, i'll gladly eat my crow...until then.;.please trade this a**hole!??

Classy as always.

**TigersSlappy** · 12-01-2012, 12:36 PM

Ken Rosenthal ‏@Ken_Rosenthal
#Brewers announce acquisition of RHP Burke Badenhop from #Rays for outfielder Raul Mondesi Jr. Mondesi, 20, was in rookie ball last season.

**irvink** · 12-01-2012, 01:56 PM

Tom Gorzelanny also non-tendered. If the Tigers are looking to add a lefty specialist, he could be a good, inexpensive addition.

**sabretooth** · 12-01-2012, 02:12 PM

Originally Posted by irvink

Tom Gorzelanny also non-tendered. If the Tigers are looking to add a lefty specialist, he could be a good, inexpensive addition.

Pretty similar to Coke, slider/change, a little worse control, but more of a SP over his career, so his career results are tainted by facing a fair number of pitchers.

I dunno, seems like a dime-a-dozen, but might be worth a look.

**alwaysthrowheat** · 12-01-2012, 02:54 PM

Originally Posted by sabretooth

Pretty similar to Coke, slider/change, a little worse control, but more of a SP over his career, so his career results are tainted by facing a fair number of pitchers.

I dunno, seems like a dime-a-dozen, but might be worth a look.

Has had plenty of success against LH in his career. Could also be a 7th starter. Would rather throw him out there than Wilk.

**alwaysthrowheat** · 12-01-2012, 03:02 PM

Geo Soto could be a nice platoon for Avila. Hits LHP well. I think a bad team will still let him start, though.

**sabretooth** · 12-01-2012, 04:01 PM

Originally Posted by alwaysthrowheat

Has had plenty of success against LH in his career. Could also be a 7th starter. Would rather throw him out there than Wilk.

Absolutely true.

**sabretooth** · 12-01-2012, 04:04 PM

Originally Posted by alwaysthrowheat

Geo Soto could be a nice platoon for Avila. Hits LHP well. I think a bad team will still let him start, though.

Wow, yes, he certainly crushes LHP...I would be in favor.

**chasfh** · 12-01-2012, 04:39 PM

Originally Posted by sabretooth

Wow, yes, he certainly crushes LHP...I would be in favor.

When you're talking .239/.302/.375 against LHP versus .182/.259/.331 against RHP, "crush" is a relative term, indeed. Plus, he's not exactly a catch and throw guy. Lastly, I'm not a guy who cries "ROIDS!" at the first sign of a spike, but if I had to do so on one player, it would be Soto 2007-2008.

**RandyMarsh** · 12-01-2012, 04:47 PM

Originally Posted by chasfh

When you're talking .239/.302/.375 against LHP versus .182/.259/.331 against RHP, "crush" is a relative term, indeed. Plus, he's not exactly a catch and throw guy. Lastly, I'm not a guy who cries "ROIDS!" at the first sign of a spike, but if I had to do so on one player, it would be Soto 2007-2008.

He no doubt struggled last year against everybody but in as recently as 2011 he had a .971 OPS against lefties, and for his career he has a .891 OPS against them, so I would say that he hits them pretty damn well and that last year may have just been a fluke. I certainly wouldn't be opposed to getting him because I think he would be a great platoon fit with Avila but I think some team will offer him a full time gig.

**macedonian bengal** · 12-01-2012, 04:52 PM

Originally Posted by catswithbats

You seem a little hostile toward Porcello.

I'd be fine with the Tigers trading him, but 1.) I don't think they absolutely "need" to dump him and 2.) I don't think they need to dump him for whatever they can get. He still has value.

Not hostile at all, Cats. perhaps my after bar demeaner suggested so. My apologies, i was in a mood.

However, I'm still not buying the Porcello hype. he's had years to blossom into the so called "elite Starter" that they hoped for when they drafted him. Im far more comfortable with Smyly for our #5 SP at this point, and hopeful we resign Anibal, or acquire someone else, whos better than Frederick.

I'd still prefer to trade him, and of course, for something of value to the team. whether it be a key piece in package deal, or for a shortstop or left fielder, which is certainly far more than "just anything". i'll insert my foot in my mouth now.

**macedonian bengal** · 12-01-2012, 04:53 PM

Originally Posted by Longgone

speaking of which...

whatever.

**macedonian bengal** · 12-01-2012, 04:54 PM

Originally Posted by Yoda

Classy as always.

only for you!

**irvink** · 12-01-2012, 06:54 PM

Not sure how good he is defensively at SS, but another potential option on the trade market...

Espinosa, 25, is likely to draw interest from teams who need either a second baseman or shortstop, and the Nats could be open to moving him in the right deal.

Could Nationals move Espinosa? - Yardbarker

**alwaysthrowheat** · 12-01-2012, 07:32 PM

Originally Posted by irvink

Not sure how good he is defensively at SS, but another potential option on the trade market...

Could Nationals move Espinosa? - Yardbarker

Good at second, around average at SS, to maybe a tick below from what I understand.

**sabretooth** · 12-01-2012, 07:47 PM

Originally Posted by chasfh

When you're talking .239/.302/.375 against LHP versus .182/.259/.331 against RHP, "crush" is a relative term, indeed. Plus, he's not exactly a catch and throw guy. Lastly, I'm not a guy who cries "ROIDS!" at the first sign of a spike, but if I had to do so on one player, it would be Soto 2007-2008.

By "crush" I mean his career .891 OPS and .387 wOBA against LHP, 3 out of the last 5 years he's had at least a 950 OPS/400 wOBA against LHP, only last year was he below the 770/345 he did in 2009.

In short, he's as reliable a lefty-killer at catcher out there.

2008 was surely an amazing year, but you could say the same thing about Avila's 2011. Soto's HR/FB% spiked to 17.7%, but that's not stratospheric vs. his career norm of 13.7%.

**shauntacular** · 12-01-2012, 07:49 PM

Every day that I try to talk about baseball anywhere else on the Internet I remember what makes this site so awesome. Just earlier I was told I didn't know what I was talking about by singing the defensive praises of Asdrubal Cabrera over Jhonny Peralta because Peralta has a higher UZR and UZR150 which of course makes him a better fielder. Right? Right?

**alwaysthrowheat** · 12-01-2012, 08:02 PM

Originally Posted by RandyMarsh

He no doubt struggled last year against everybody but in as recently as 2011 he had a .971 OPS against lefties, and for his career he has a .891 OPS against them, so I would say that he hits them pretty damn well and that last year may have just been a fluke. I certainly wouldn't be opposed to getting him because I think he would be a great platoon fit with Avila but I think some team will offer him a full time gig.

Feel exactly the same.

**sabretooth** · 12-01-2012, 08:02 PM

Oddly, Alfonso Soriano's Home/Road and L/R splits have been pretty non-existant for the last few years...in short he's not needed the friendly confines of Wrigley to excel. He's not the lefty-killer he used to be either, but he still has a career OPS of .878 vs. southies.

His biggest hitting advantage for this team is that he is a bona-fide flyball/power hitter, always has been.

Also, suprisingly, he's had a positive UZR every year he's started in LF from 2006 - 2012 with only 2009 as the negative exception....so fielding-wise he's pretty strong.

He's definitely a hacker, not my cup of tea in that regard, but we could do a lot worse in LF than Soriano.

**sabretooth** · 12-01-2012, 08:05 PM

Originally Posted by shauntacular

Every day that I try to talk about baseball anywhere else on the Internet I remember what makes this site so awesome. Just earlier I was told I didn't know what I was talking about by singing the defensive praises of Asdrubal Cabrera over Jhonny Peralta because Peralta has a higher UZR and UZR150 which of course makes him a better fielder. Right? Right?

What we both apparently didn't appreciate until recently is that they are both below average fielders....go figure!

**alwaysthrowheat** · 12-01-2012, 08:07 PM

Originally Posted by sabretooth

Oddly, Alfonso Soriano's Home/Road and L/R splits have been pretty non-existant for the last few years...in short he's not needed the friendly confines of Wrigley to excel. He's not the lefty-killer he used to be either, but he still has a career OPS of .878 vs. southies.

His biggest hitting advantage for this team is that he is a bona-fide flyball/power hitter, always has been.

Also, suprisingly, he's had a positive UZR every year he's started in LF from 2006 - 2012 with only 2009 as the negative exception....so fielding-wise he's pretty strong.

He's definitely a hacker, not my cup of tea in that regard, but we could do a lot worse in LF than Soriano.

Sure, he'd be a nice platoon guy. I'd rather get Casper Wells, though. Even last year in Seattle, hit for a .891 OPS against LHP. Also has hit .838 for his career. I'm on the Casper train.