2012-13 Offseason Discussion

[irvink]

“My instinct,” Dombrowski continued, “is that we would add somebody that could hit from the right-hand side that, if those guys don’t make it, could go out there and play with Dirks. But we’ll wait and see.”
.

Yes, in the article he talks about the possibility that Nick or Avi could win the spot in ST. But he also says they would have to outright win the job, they are not platoon candidates. Anything could happen, but I think that DD's top choice will be to bring in a RH bat to platoon with Dirks.

[Gehringer_2]

Agree with this. I'd be thrilled if we got an 800 OPS for a full season from Dirks.

Milb career 780, MLB career 794 at 500+ AB.

If they platooned him with Garcia I think odds would be very high he would OPS 800 facing mostly Righties. But probably the Tigs don't want to do that. They want Garcia playing full time - at Toledo. So the preference is for Dirks (or whoever) to play full time. When he came up, Dirks was pretty helpless against LHP, but he seemed better last season, so I think the question is open.

[tiger337]

Milb career 780, MLB career 794 at 500+ AB.

If they platooned him with Garcia I think odds would be very high he would OPS 800 facing mostly Righties. But probably the Tigs don't want to do that. They want Garcia playing full time - at Toledo. So the preference is for Dirks (or whoever) to play full time. When he came up, Dirks was pretty helpless against LHP, but he seemed better last season, so I think the question is open.

Against RHP I agree, but I thought the question was playing full-time versus acquiring a RHB to platoon with him.

[sabretooth]

He's not Young/Raburn, but I don't know that he's an .800 OPS in a full season either.

Yeah, this was going to be my point. Dirks seems more naturally like a 750 guy as a full-timer....that would be fine with me....really not much different from Raburn hitting-wise when Raburn was 27 -28 years old (Dirks is harder to strike out, I like Dirks' approach better).

[sabretooth]

Which is really going to affect the posting volume here.

Or at least the volume of the posts.

[PuNk42AE]

Juan Pierre goes to the Marlins, already has been told he's been traded to Las Vegas.

[Gehringer_2]

Against RHP I agree, but I thought the question was playing full-time versus acquiring a RHB to platoon with him.

Still too many unknowns. Would have been nice if Dirks had gotten that extra 100 AB and in particular more against LHP pitching to see where he was going to end up. And even if the conclusion is that Dirks can't hit lefties well enough to play full time, there is still the question of they expect from Garcia that ties back to the same decision. If Garcia isn't going to be good enough against RHP to play full time but can hold his own against LHP, then signing another guy is going to turn out to be a waste.

[RandyMarsh]

I have my doubts about Dirks as well, but he doesn't have to be great, as long as he plays decent defense and isn't a complete black hole(even say a .700 OPS or a .340 OBP if he doesn't hit for power) we'll be alright. I mean we're probably going to have plus offensive players at every spot on the field so even if Dirks struggles a bit, if he plays decent defense we'll be fine. I'd rather not start the clock early on Castellanos if he's only going to play against lefties.

[STLTiger69]

I'm trying to figure out who this right handed hitting corner outfielder might be to "help" Dirks out. So far I think someone like Jonny Gomes or Reed Johnson might be my top guess.

Other options include;

Scott Hairston
Matt Diaz
(your gonna love this)- Delmon Young

The Tigers are not going to sign a guy like Ryan Ludwick or Jason Bay who may be wanting to play with another team were they can be in the starting lineup everyday and not just against LHP. Also I think the Tigers have to realistically say that the "floor" is Ryan Raburn for the outfield. If the Tigers can't find someone better than Raburn, what is the point? So I'm not thinking there will be a Darnell McDonald signing in the near future....

[Yoda]

Delmon is not an option to play left field.

[chasfh]

Delmon is not an option to play left field.

Until he is mathematically eliminated, he's technically an option.

[Casimir]

Delmon is not an option to play left field.

I hope he is the option for Cleveland.

[sabretooth]

I'm less fearful of the stretches of poor hitting that could come from 2b and Lf this year with Infante and Dirks, simply because I know that they will both deliver good defense...plus Dirks will generally give you a tough at-bat, and even when Infante is not hitting well he's still a serious threat to whack the ball against LHP. As long as there are fairly good platoon options available for those two if in case they are really rough for 100+ at-bats, I'm comfortable with them as everyday players.

I'm a little less comfortable with Peralta only because if he's OPSing .720 with a wOBA barely above .300, his so-so range/no error defense and generally poor at-bats will make him a two-edged drain, particularly on the left side with Cabrera defensively. It's particularly disconcerting that the backup IF (Santiago) seems to have hit the wall skill-wise. With Peralta we could really use a guy with a glove to back him up, and with Infante it would be nice to have that backup be a LH hitter who can get on base a little....in short, the 2007 - 2011 version of Santiago rather than the 2012 version....here's hoping that he can somehow defy the odds and bounce back at age 33....not likely. And I don't see anybody in the minors who could fill this role capably either. Still thinking a trade for a better fielding SS would make the most sense....not seeing it happen though. I guess we have to hope that Peralta re-discovers flyball hitting in 2013.

For Pete's sake start by finding a good RH hitting catcher. That would cover a multitude of sins bench-wise.

[irvink]

Tony Paul predicting the Tigers will bring in another OF, maybe even a full timer.

In all likelihood, the Tigers will continue shopping this winter for another outfielder, and they could even zero in on a starter. And they just might have their pick.

Outfield is among the deepest positions on the free-agent market, so because of supply and demand there's always a chance the market will crash on many of them — like it did with closers last offseason. That could make for some bargains, especially when out-of-work players start hitting the panic button come January...

The Tigers likely won't be in on the biggest-name free agents, such as Josh Hamilton, Michael Bourn and B.J. Upton, but don't rule out someone like Cody Ross or Ryan Ludwick — both former Tigers farmhands, by the way....

Probably, though, it'll be a reserve the Tigers seek for left field to play against lefties while Dirks starts against righties, and there is no shortage of options there, too, such as Jonny Gomes, Reed Johnson or Scott Hairston, who all hit left-handed pitching well and also could hold their own if asked to start full-time. The Tigers were known to be interested in Hairston ahead of last summer's trade deadline.

Tigers still might seek another outfielder | The Detroit News | detroitnews.com

[STLTiger69]

Here's a breakdown of some of the players that have been mentioned, both the career split and 2012 split and salary for last year;


Jonny Gomes OF/DH
1 year/$1M for 2012

Career spilts;

I	Split	G	PA	AB	R	H	2B	3B	HR	RBI	SB	CS	BB	SO	BA	OBP	SLG	OPS	BAbip
	vs RHP as RHB	712	1960	1712		381	70	9	86	257	31	16	180	561	.223	.307	.425	.732	.270
	vs LHP as RHB	470	1100	934		265	53	5	50	154	17	7	128	269	.284	.382	.512	.894	.344

Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Original Table
Generated 11/19/2012.

2012 splits;

Split	G	PA	AB	H	2B	3B	HR	RBI	SB	CS	BB	SO	BA	OBP	SLG	OPS	BAbip
vs RHP as RHB	71	137	115	24	0	0	7	21	1	1	17	46	.209	.324	.391	.715	.270
vs LHP as RHB	75	196	164	49	10	0	11	26	2	0	27	58	.299	.413	.561	.974	.400

Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Original Table
Generated 11/19/2012.


Reed Johnson OF 1yr/$1.15M for 2012
career splits

I	Split	G	PA	AB	H	2B	3B	HR	RBI	SB	CS	BB	SO	BA	OBP	SLG	OPS	BAbip
	vs RHP as RHB	851	2225	2023	538	102	12	35	227	27	13	97	435	.266	.323	.380	.703	.322
	vs LHP as RHB	556	1406	1275	397	90	10	27	142	14	15	77	218	.311	.367	.461	.828	.356

Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Original Table
Generated 11/19/2012.

2012 splits;

Split	G	PA	AB	H	2B	3B	HR	RBI	SB	CS	BB	SO	BA	OBP	SLG	OPS	BAbip
vs RHP as RHB	81	127	118	31	4	1	1	10	2	1	5	36	.263	.315	.339	.654	.370
vs LHP as RHB	66	161	151	47	10	2	2	10	0	1	8	25	.311	.354	.444	.798	.363

Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Original Table
Generated 11/19/2012.




Scott Hairston OF 1yr/$1.1M

Career;

I	Split	G	PA	AB	H	2B	3B	HR	RBI	SB	CS	BB	SO	BA	OBP	SLG	OPS	BAbip
	vs RHP as RHB	609	1478	1347	308	63	11	56	170	21	5	99	352	.229	.288	.416	.704	.266
	vs LHP as RHB	385	921	850	235	61	6	39	109	13	6	63	155	.276	.325	.500	.825	.297

Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Original Table
Generated 11/19/2012.

2012 splits:

Split	G	PA	AB	H	2B	3B	HR	RBI	SB	CS	BB	SO	BA	OBP	SLG	OPS	BAbip
vs RHP as RHB	103	199	188	45	8	3	9	27	4	1	11	49	.239	.281	.457	.739	.277
vs LHP as RHB	83	199	189	54	17	0	11	30	4	1	8	34	.286	.317	.550	.867	.297

Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Original Table
Generated 11/19/2012.

Matt Diaz OF 2yr/$4.25M ($2M for 2012)

career:

I	Split	G	PA	AB	H	2B	3B	HR	RBI	SB	CS	BB	SO	BA	OBP	SLG	OPS	BAbip
	vs RHP as RHB	521	1007	918	237	39	7	14	106	18	8	53	226	.258	.314	.362	.675	.326
	vs LHP as RHB	443	1026	945	306	58	7	31	119	15	8	52	149	.324	.364	.498	.863	.355

Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Original Table
Generated 11/19/2012.

2012 splits:

Split	G	PA	AB	H	2B	3B	HR	RBI	SB	CS	BB	SO	BA	OBP	SLG	OPS	BAbip
vs RHP as RHB	26	33	30	3	1	0	0	3	0	0	2	11	.100	.152	.133	.285	.150
vs LHP as RHB	43	85	78	21	5	0	2	10	0	0	7	10	.269	.329	.410	.740	.288

Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Original Table
Generated 11/19/2012.


Delmon Young 1yr/$6.75M

Career spilts:

I	Split	G	PA	AB	H	2B	3B	HR	RBI	SB	CS	BB	SO	BA	OBP	SLG	OPS	BAbip
	vs RHP as RHB	805	2529	2378	654	123	6	55	341	27	19	96	448	.275	.307	.401	.708	.315
	vs LHP as RHB	431	1046	980	301	62	4	34	141	7	2	49	178	.307	.341	.483	.824	.343

Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Original Table
Generated 11/19/2012.

2012 splits:

Split	G	PA	AB	H	2B	3B	HR	RBI	SB	CS	BB	SO	BA	OBP	SLG	OPS	BAbip
vs RHP as RHB	140	419	392	97	15	0	11	48	0	2	16	79	.247	.279	.370	.649	.278
vs LHP as RHB	88	189	182	56	12	1	7	26	0	0	4	33	.308	.333	.500	.833	.345

Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Original Table
Generated 11/19/2012.

[STLTiger69]

Tony Paul predicting the Tigers will bring in another OF, maybe even a full timer.




Tigers still might seek another outfielder | The Detroit News | detroitnews.com

Interesting, but I think the wildcard is how much $$$$ it will cost the Tigers to either keep Sanchez or get a replacement. By my math, no Sanchez and no replacement = about $10M-$14M in savings to spend another way. So it's possible...but my best guess is smaller player pick up for short term is more likely than anything else....

[Casimir]

This transaction wasn't mentioned yet.

The Tigers have signed Kevin Russo to a minor league contract with an invitation to Spring Training, reports Jon Paul Morosi of FOX Sports (Twitter links). The 28-year-old utility man hit .284/.358/.351 with 15 steals in 456 Triple-A plate appearances while playing second, third, and all three outfield spots. Russo made a brief cameo with the 2010 Yankees.

Really, an OBP higher than a SLG.

[Yoda]

An OBP guy with speed? What's this world coming to?

[sabretooth]

I want the Tigers to have every guy whose mother couldn't spell "Johnny".

[Yoda]

I want the Tigers to have every guy whose mother couldn't spell "Johnny".

Maybe Jon Paul Morosi can write an article on them.

[sabretooth]

My take on the RH bat guys from above:

- Reed Johnson - not worth it...poor fielder, no power, hits singles fairly well against LHP, basically Delmon Young without power.
- Scott Hairston - also not worth it...hits LHP fairly well and with some power, but a below average fielder...basically Delmon Young, maybe a slightly better fielder
- Jonny Gomes - yes....hits lots of flyballs (something our team outside of Fielder/Cabrera is suddenly very poor at doing), mashes LHP, no defense...basically Delmon Young but with walks and more power.

I'd want a guy with at least a passable glove, but frankly with Hunter/Jackson/Dirks and Garcia/Berry in the AAA wings, we're pretty well stocked for outfield defense. Gomes would provide several things that we need - flyball hitting, power and on-base against LHP. All good for late-inning situations.

[irvink]

You're not joking about Gomes. Obviously, it would be nice if he could play defense, but he really does kill LHP. His numbers

2012 - 196 PAs against LHP - .299/.413/.561/.974

In 1100 Career PAs against LHP - 284/.382/.512/.894

[Shelton]

Gomes is essential.

[IdahoBert]

Why didn't the Marlins get desperate and stupid with the Tigers? Oh, wait....

[roarintiger1]

No thank you for Gomes, Johnson, or Hairston.......None of those would be an improvement.

[tiger337]

Hairston and Gomes would be good platoon options. They also need backup catcher. The Tigers are talking like they would be happy with Holaday, but I don't believe them.

[TheCouga]

Hairston and Gomes would be good platoon options. They also need backup catcher. The Tigers are talking like they would be happy with Holaday, but I don't believe them.

That could also be a move to increase awareness/trade value. They're doing the same thing with Rondon. Making him seem more valuable as a trade chip by saying "yeah, he's so good we're going with him for closer next year." I think DD is really looking to make some significant trades.

[Yoda]

That could also be a move to increase awareness/trade value. They're doing the same thing with Rondon. Making him seem more valuable as a trade chip by saying "yeah, he's so good we're going with him for closer next year." I think DD is really looking to make some significant trades.

Agreed. Another reason would be to keep an agent from driving the price upward if they do look at other relievers. Dave usually has a purpose for disclosing things like this.

[TigersSlappy]

They also need backup catcher. The Tigers are talking like they would be happy with Holaday, but I don't believe them.

There's always going to be a skeptic or two.

You sound like the girl in HS that didn't believe I loved her even though I bought her a bottle of Tickle Pink.

[Elevate]

ESPN published an article by Jim Bowden today (says it's Insider but I could see all of it... Five trades for Justin Upton - The GM's Office by Jim Bowden Blog - ESPN) that said the Tigers could be in play for Justin Upton. Bowden proposed Castellanos and Garcia for Upton and said "This is probably the best fit for Towers."

I'd make this trade everyday and twice on Sunday. Upton would be the ideal LF and would completely solidify the OF. Upton, Jackson, and Hunter would probably be the best defensive OF in the whole league and I expect him to have a bounce back year at the plate.

Am I missing something here? Is this not a slam dunk?

[Yoda]

There's always going to be a skeptic or two.

You sound like the girl in HS that didn't believe I loved her even though I bought her a bottle of Tickle Pink.

He isn't just a skeptic, DD has a history of doing this exact thing. It would be idiotic to just assume he means what he says.

[Tim Mitchell]

In my opinion, Cody Ross is the best option.
He is fairly inexpensive, hits lefties well, and is a legit home run threat anytime he comes to the plate.

[Casimir]

Hairston and Gomes would be good platoon options.

I would prefer Hairston, but the Mets had been rumored to want to keep him, and supposedly he was looking for more playing time. Not sure if it is a legit possibility.

They also need backup catcher. The Tigers are talking like they would be happy with Holaday, but I don't believe them.

I think it'd be best for the Tigers to keep Holaday in Toledo for now, if only as depth. I think the backup better be ready to start on a semiregular basis if Avila breaks down again.

[Gehringer_2]

ESPN published an article by Jim Bowden today (says it's Insider but I could see all of it... Five trades for Justin Upton - The GM's Office by Jim Bowden Blog - ESPN) that said the Tigers could be in play for Justin Upton. Bowden proposed Castellanos and Garcia for Upton and said "This is probably the best fit for Towers."

I'd make this trade everyday and twice on Sunday. Upton would be the ideal LF and would completely solidify the OF. Upton, Jackson, and Hunter would probably be the best defensive OF in the whole league and I expect him to have a bounce back year at the plate.

Am I missing something here? Is this not a slam dunk?

why does he play so much better in odd years?

TBH, I love OF defense more than most, but I'm realistic. OF defense in the corners doesn't win you anything. From a defensive POV, a good SS is probably worth 2 GG corner OFs.

[Yoda]

In my opinion, Cody Ross is the best option.
He is fairly inexpensive, hits lefties well, and is a legit home run threat anytime he comes to the plate.

You need to consider the fact that it'll probably take more than 1 year to sign him, and possibly as much as 3 years.

[Oblong]

Only if he comes with Travis Chapman...

[tiger337]

There's always going to be a skeptic or two.

You sound like the girl in HS that didn't believe I loved her even though I bought her a bottle of Tickle Pink.

Holaday is OK as insurance but with Avila's durability problems they need somebody who can be ready to step in and get significant playing time. I am betting that they have somebody else in mind other than Holaday.

[djhutch]

Holaday is OK as insurance but with Avila's durability problems they need somebody who can be ready to step in and get significant playing time. I am betting that they have somebody else in mind other than Holaday.

Victor Martinez?

[PuNk42AE]

Victor Martinez?

I think that ship has completely sailed. He's probably in the C mix just like Raburn being the backup one.

[TigersSlappy]

I think that ship has completely sailed. He's probably in the C mix just like Raburn being the backup one.

I agree. I think Victor would be the emergency 3rd catcher only.