Official End of Jim Leyland Era Thread

**stanpapi** · 10-28-2012, 11:51 PM

Please discuss

**Nastradamus** · 10-28-2012, 11:57 PM

PLease no

**hail2mich** · 10-28-2012, 11:57 PM

If it really is the end of the Leyland era, I have just one thing to say. Thank you Jim.

**mr0zip0** · 10-28-2012, 11:58 PM

We should re-title all of the threads made in the following week "Non rational impulsive thread #_"

Either that or just merge them with the more rational yet still impulsive threads we made during the season.

Honestly. If Leyland wants to go, he will go. If he wants to stay, he will be welcomed back with another one year deal. Simple as that.

**Chopper** · 10-28-2012, 11:59 PM

Originally Posted by mr0zip0

We should re-title all of the threads made in the following week "Non rational impulsive thread #_"

Either that or just merge them with the more rational yet still impulsive threads we made during the season.

Honestly. If Leyland wants to go, he will go. If he wants to stay, he will be welcomed back with another one year deal. Simple as that.

This is the "official" thread.

**mr0zip0** · 10-29-2012, 12:03 AM

Originally Posted by Chopper

This is the "official" thread.

Lol. The 'o' word obviously makes it better than the nine other threads made this year about him I quickly found via search.

**Gehringer_2** · 10-29-2012, 12:03 AM

Originally Posted by mr0zip0

We should re-title all of the threads made in the following week "Non rational impulsive thread #_"

Either that or just merge them with the more rational yet still impulsive threads we made during the season.

Honestly. If Leyland wants to go, he will go. If he wants to stay, he will be welcomed back with another one year deal. Simple as that.

I wonder. If the owner was so happy to have him back, why no extension yet? They extended him before immediately before the playoffs, why not this year? It would seem someone still had doubts. If the internal narrative turns out to be that the Yankees were an old collapsing team, then what you have is Oakland taking us to the brink of elimination and SF sweeping us and woeful offensive execution under pressure in both series.

**pyrotigers** · 10-29-2012, 12:08 AM

Jim Leyland is a dumb manager who does dumb things, I think he's a good guy, I'm appreciative of the work he has done with the Tigers. Even had they won the World Series I still wouldn't want him back. He's out of place in the modern game.

**jbhappy** · 10-29-2012, 12:09 AM

Originally Posted by Gehringer_2

I wonder. If the owner was so happy to have him back, why no extension yet? They extended him before immediately before the playoffs, why not this year? It would seem someone still had doubts. If the internal narrative turns out to be that the Yankees were an old collapsing team, then what you have is Oakland taking us to the brink of elimination and SF sweeping us and woeful offensive execution under pressure in both series.

I thought he had said he just didn't want the in-season distraction this season. That could mean a number of things, but it at least makes me think that management wanted him back.

**Buddha** · 10-29-2012, 12:16 AM

Leyland may be the most successful manager the Tigers have ever had. Two world series and three playoff appearances is nothing to shake a stick at.

But it would be nice if next year the Tigers make the playoffs and Leyland lets someone else manage the team during the playoff games...

**mr0zip0** · 10-29-2012, 12:17 AM

Tigers' GM Dave Dombrowski: 'Jim Leyland is welcome back' | Detroit Tigers | Detroit Free Press | freep.com-

Note that this was said before the World Series, but I doubt four losses change this.

**Gehringer_2** · 10-29-2012, 12:23 AM

Originally Posted by jbhappy

I thought he had said he just didn't want the in-season distraction this season. That could mean a number of things, but it at least makes me think that management wanted him back.

Maybe they could have used the distraction. Leyland has implied often enough through the last part of the season that he was waiting on them. Meh - he's a wierd bird.

I would still really like to see Lloyd gone though. Haven't liked this teams approaches all year. Either he is hitting a wall with too many of them or they aren't listening to him - either way I'm ready to see what someone else can do. We didn't even make any of these pitchers work to win, and that is pretty lame - and we've been doing it all year.

**TheCouga** · 10-29-2012, 12:23 AM

Originally Posted by Buddha

Leyland may be the most successful manager the Tigers have ever had. Two world series and three playoff appearances is nothing to shake a stick at.

But it would be nice if next year the Tigers make the playoffs and Leyland lets someone else manage the team during the playoff games...

Leyland is a good long-term manager. He is patient, and this helps with the clubhouse atmosphere, helps to take pressure off during the season, and players don't have to worry about losing their jobs due to short-term slumps. I think over the course of an entire 162-game season, these big things are far more important than the day-to-day stuff, second guessing lineups and bullpen decisions, etc.

I don't think his style is good for the playoffs, however. The roster has to be managed to win every game. In this sense, we shouldn't have Berry batting second, shouldn't have had the Valverde experiment continue, there should have been immediate pressure on Fielder to fix his amateur playoff plate approach, etc. He was kind of hamstrung in that we didn't have anyone else all that much better to put in there, but I think Dirks did fine batting second when he did this season.

**NeedMoreLike84** · 10-29-2012, 12:24 AM

My guess is that if they won he'd retire. As such he wants one more chance.

More successful than Sparky btw.

**Buddha** · 10-29-2012, 12:24 AM

It's not Leyland's job to fix the hitters. That's why we have a hitting coach.

THAT'S the guy who has to be fired. Not that it will happen.

**Vonlenska** · 10-29-2012, 12:25 AM

Leyland's done, and it's his decision. I just have a feeling.

**NeedMoreLike84** · 10-29-2012, 12:26 AM

Originally Posted by Buddha

It's not Leyland's job to fix the hitters. That's why we have a hitting coach.

THAT'S the guy who has to be fired. Not that it will happen.

Jackson?

**Gehringer_2** · 10-29-2012, 12:32 AM

Originally Posted by Buddha

It's not Leyland's job to fix the hitters. That's why we have a hitting coach.

THAT'S the guy who has to be fired. Not that it will happen.

To me that is one reason he might be better off gone in my view. Yeah - I'll give Jim all kinds of props on his clubhouse, but it took him 5 years to finally find a pitching coach who seems to be able to actually help our guys get better, and the team's hitting approach is pretty much in the toilet now. It's fine that he is loyal to his friends, but his first obligation is that he need coaches that can help improve his team. I just kept laughing all season when reports of Llyod working with Boesch to tweak his swing kept hitting the press, like *how* he swung was ever any great part of his problem. While the mechanics work with Jackson was great, the playoffs have been a microcosm of the fact as a team, pitch and pattern recognition and PA strategy are a lot bigger problems than swing mechanics.

**pyrotigers** · 10-29-2012, 12:36 AM

As much as I dislike Leyland the hitting approach goes to Dombrowski to me. He's the one that gave Leyland a team of Delmon Youngs

**NeedMoreLike84** · 10-29-2012, 12:38 AM

Originally Posted by pyrotigers

As much as I dislike Leyland the hitting approach goes to Dombrowski to me. He's the one that gave Leyland a team of Delmon Youngs

Just to recap.

Jackson, Infante, Dirks, Cabrera, Fielder, Berry = Demon Young.

**Gehringer_2** · 10-29-2012, 12:40 AM

Originally Posted by pyrotigers

As much as I dislike Leyland the hitting approach goes to Dombrowski to me. He's the one that gave Leyland a team of Delmon Youngs

Yeah - there is that, but even Delmon took more walks per PA with Minny than he has with us.

**NJTiger** · 10-29-2012, 12:42 AM

let's not forget that next year we have vmart back and delmon gone.

**FloridaTigers** · 10-29-2012, 12:43 AM

Originally Posted by Vonlenska

Leyland's done, and it's his decision. I just have a feeling.

I hope he takes Lloyd with him.

**MC24** · 10-29-2012, 12:44 AM

Please. I'm begging you DD, let this guy go. Please.

**NeedMoreLike84** · 10-29-2012, 12:46 AM

Originally Posted by NJTiger

let's not forget that next year we have vmart back and delmon gone.

Just another in our team which include 1 hitter type: Delmon Young.

**RJBBREZ** · 10-29-2012, 12:50 AM

The biggest inning of the year, he responds by pinch hitting Don Kelly. Don Kelly who had a .187 batting average all year and who had yet to have an atbat in the playoffs. Genius.

I am thankful for the work he has done in Detroit and I'll always respect him, but he's just not the guy to lead this team to a championship. He is stubborn and relies on his "gut" to much for big games. This team has reached its ceiling with Leyland running the show. Time to move on.

**sabretooth** · 10-29-2012, 12:52 AM

I think Leyland has had a successful track record getting the big guys to play well for a whole season every year. Too bad about what happened with Prince and Miggy this offseason...not sure if that should be blamed on Leyland or not.

There are probably better options out there, but I'm content enough with Leyland. I am not going to complain if they replace him, but I am guessing that any replacement would be hated sooner or later by the few folks around here who deem the season a "failure" for not winning the WS.

**NeedMoreLike84** · 10-29-2012, 12:52 AM

For the record, if there is better out there, by all means replace Jim leyland. But he better be better.

**hueytaxi** · 10-29-2012, 12:52 AM

Originally Posted by pyrotigers

Jim Leyland is a dumb manager who does dumb things, I think he's a good guy, I'm appreciative of the work he has done with the Tigers. Even had they won the World Series I still wouldn't want him back. He's out of place in the modern game.

I believe this as I have watched the replacement of several of the Tigers staff this year, Jonsey, Matlack, Ezell, Coleman, Bradshaw, and others throughout the levels. Change in direction is eminent.

**pyrotigers** · 10-29-2012, 12:52 AM

Originally Posted by NeedMoreLike84

Just to recap.

Jackson, Infante, Dirks, Cabrera, Fielder, Berry = Demon Young.

Jackson, Cabrera, Dirks and Fielder were the only very good offensive players on the team this year yes.

Meanwhile he had Delmon and Boesch batting 5th and 2nd to start the year. Yee haw

**RJBBREZ** · 10-29-2012, 12:52 AM

Originally Posted by NeedMoreLike84

Just another in our team which include 1 hitter type: Delmon Young.

I know this has to be a joke.

In no way are Vmart and DY similiar hitters. No way.

**Motor City Sonics** · 10-29-2012, 12:53 AM

Leyland will be back next year. Lamont will be the third base coach. I could see Lloyd leaving for another team, but if another job does not open up, he'll be back too. So will Peralta.

**FloridaTigers** · 10-29-2012, 12:53 AM

Originally Posted by Motor City Sonics

Leyland will be back next year. Lamont will be the third base coach. I could see Lloyd leaving for another team, but if another job does not open up, he'll be back too. So will Peralta.

You make me want to look forward to 2014 already.

**RJBBREZ** · 10-29-2012, 12:54 AM

Originally Posted by Motor City Sonics

Leyland will be back next year. Lamont will be the third base coach. I could see Lloyd leaving for another team, but if another job does not open up, he'll be back too. So will Peralta.

Please don't make this night more depressing. LOL>

**Gehringer_2** · 10-29-2012, 12:55 AM

Originally Posted by RJBBREZ

The biggest inning of the year, he responds by pinch hitting Don Kelly. Don Kelly who had a .187 batting average all year and who had yet to have an atbat in the playoffs. Genius.

.

The more I think about it, the more persuaded I am that even though JL would defend it as a rational R/L match move, JL had half thrown in the towel and was giving a guy a WS AB to end his career on, as I doubt Kelly is back in '13.

**jonjd** · 10-29-2012, 12:57 AM

The Tigers exceeded my expectations this year. I may be the only one.

Congrats to a great franchise like SF.

**NeedMoreLike84** · 10-29-2012, 12:58 AM

Originally Posted by RJBBREZ

I know this has to be a joke.

In no way are Vmart and DY similiar hitters. No way.

Yes. it is a complete joke. See post #19.

**RJBBREZ** · 10-29-2012, 01:03 AM

Originally Posted by Gehringer_2

The more I think about it, the more persuaded I am that even though JL would defend it as a rational R/L match move, JL had half thrown in the towel and was giving a guy a WS AB to end his career on, as I doubt Kelly is back in '13.

That is a interesting way to look at it. Nice call.

**RJBBREZ** · 10-29-2012, 01:04 AM

Originally Posted by NeedMoreLike84

Yes. it is a complete joke. See post #19.

Gotcha. My bad.

**NeedMoreLike84** · 10-29-2012, 01:05 AM

Originally Posted by Gehringer_2

The more I think about it, the more persuaded I am that even though JL would defend it as a rational R/L match move, JL had half thrown in the towel and was giving a guy a WS AB to end his career on, as I doubt Kelly is back in '13.

You can disagree with the guy's calls all you want. I know I do. Angrily in fact. But not his motives. I think his desire to win is still at full force.